# Rotating Puppy Foods



## harrkim120 (Feb 2, 2010)

I have a friend who has a GSD puppy who is about 6 months old. She currently has the dog on Orijen Large Breed puppy. I know that it's good to rotate between different protein sources, but what options does she have with puppy food? Most of the decent ones seem to be limited to chicken. :frown:


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Grain Free Foods Suitable for All Life Stages:

Canidae Grain Free ALS (poultry)
Canidae Grain Free Salmon 
Nature's Variety Instinct Duck Meal & Turkey Meal
Nature's Variety Instinct Rabbit Meal
Nature's Variety Instinct Chicken Meal
Merrick B.G. Buffalo
Merrick B.G. Salmon
Merrick B.G. Chicken
Taste of the Wild Pacific Stream
Taste of the Wild High Prairie
Taste of the Wild Wetlands


**I know some people with large breed pups have their own ideas of what Ca levels are acceptable. This varies from person to person and what they're comfortable with. It's my understanding, though, that most breeders of large breeds even recommend skipping the puppy food, and going with an ALS formula, so I've made this list based off of foods that are formulated for All Life Stages rather than those "suitable for dogs over 1 year" like Evo and Core.
-Holy crap commercial foods turn feeding pets into a science. What a nightmare!


Honestly, I'm not all that concerned about Ca but maybe that's because I refuse to make feeding my pets that complicated. If I had a puppy and I had to feed it commercial food, for some reason beyond my understanding, I would just stick with Orijen and introduce other protein sources with varieties of canned food or fresh meats. Merrick B.G. cans are good for this.


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## buddy97 (Mar 29, 2010)

CorgiPaws said:


> Grain Free Foods Suitable for All Life Stages:
> 
> Canidae Grain Free ALS (poultry)
> Canidae Grain Free Salmon
> ...


while the Ca ratio is important, its the raw overall calcium content that studies have shown to be detrimental to growing large breed pups.

tecnically, Wellness could label Core as an all life stages food under AAFCO standards. they chose to be responsible and not label it as such because the Ca levels, at just over 2% arent suitable for growing large breeds. Diamond (and some of the others) took a different approach (surprise) with TOTW and decided to label it an all life stages food under VERY loose AAFCO standards.

virtually every grain free food listed above has as fed maximum Ca levels right around 2% or higher..so just as high, or higher, than Core, so they are no more suitable than Core for large breed puppies for the exact same reasons.

IMO, i would not feed any of those foods to a large breed pup. if you want to rotate with the orijen, just use a grain inclusive food with lower maximum Ca levels.

just because a food qualifies as "all life stages" under AAFCO guidelines, doesnt make them so in my book.

after all, even some of the lowest grade, grocery store dog foods meet "the nutritional levels established by the AAFCO Dog Food Nutrient Profiles", but do any of us feel they meet the nutritional standards we are looking for?


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## luvMyBRT (Mar 8, 2010)

harrkim120 said:


> I have a friend who has a GSD puppy who is about 6 months old. She currently has the dog on Orijen Large Breed puppy. I know that it's good to rotate between different protein sources, but what options does she have with puppy food? Most of the decent ones seem to be limited to chicken. :frown:


This is something I am having a problem with too. The two Large Breed Puppy foods that I know I am for sure feeding is Horizon LBP and Orijen LBP, however they are both chicken based.  I am thinking that I will add in a small amount of canned (when I say small amount, I am meaning a small amount as I don't want to mess with anything like the calcium levels). The canned I am adding in will be grain free and from a different meat source.

Another kibble I will probably feed once my pup is a bit bigger is the Acana Pacifica (fish as a meat source). I think their calcium/phosphorus levels are okay for a LB puppy. However, I'm going to wait until he's a bit older to add this to our rotation.


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## buddy97 (Mar 29, 2010)

saraj2878 said:


> Another kibble I will probably feed once my pup is a bit bigger is the Acana Pacifica (fish as a meat source). I think their calcium/phosphorus levels are okay for a LB puppy. However, I'm going to wait until he's a bit older to add this to our rotation.


the Pacifica has a max Ca of either 2.1% or 2.17% (cant recall now, one is pacifica, the other grasslands)


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## luvMyBRT (Mar 8, 2010)

buddy97 said:


> the Pacifica has a max Ca of either 2.1% or 2.17% (cant recall now, one is pacifica, the other grasslands)


Oh, thanks. I wasn't aware of the max levels. I will hold off on this food until he is much older.

I just happened to check the levels in the Orijen LBP:
Calcium (min.) 1.5% 
Calcium (max.) 1.7% 
Phosphorus (min.) 1.1% 
Phosphorus (max.) 1.3%

I would tend to think that this is a bit on the high side...would you agree? Maybe I'll start off with the Horizon LBP (as I know the levels are lower) and feed the Orijen once he is closer to a year?


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## BRule (Apr 20, 2010)

I believe 6 Fish and Regional Red could classify as ALS.


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## harrkim120 (Feb 2, 2010)

Thanks guys. I'll relay the message. I also mentioned trying different cans with the dry, but apparently this dog has quite a sensitive stomach and anytime she is given something other than the norm, she gets diarrhea. :frown:


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## buddy97 (Mar 29, 2010)

BRule said:


> I believe 6 Fish and Regional Red could classify as ALS.


for me personally, i draw the line at 1.7% maximum Ca. anything closer to 2% i stay away from for large breed pups. ive seen breeders who had a disproportionate amount of growth problems with pups feeding grainless kibbles that were just over 2%.

so, im comfortable with orijen large breed puppy, the adult, and the fish for large breed pups. the regional red is at 1.9% max Ca, so ive always stayed away from that. (gotta draw the line somewhere). others may be ok feeing that to pups.


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## harrkim120 (Feb 2, 2010)

buddy97 said:


> for me personally, i draw the line at 1.7% maximum Ca. anything closer to 2% i stay away from for large breed pups. ive seen breeders who had a disproportionate amount of growth problems with pups feeding grainless kibbles that were just over 2%.
> 
> so, im comfortable with orijen large breed puppy, the adult, and the fish for large breed pups. the regional red is at 1.9% max Ca, so ive always stayed away from that. (gotta draw the line somewhere). others may be ok feeing that to pups.


So, in your opinion, the 6 Fish Orijen would be ok as well?


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## luvMyBRT (Mar 8, 2010)

harrkim120 said:


> So, in your opinion, the 6 Fish Orijen would be ok as well?


Orijen 6 Fish:
Calcium (min.) 1.5% 
Calcium (max.) 1.7% 
Phosphorus (min.) 1.2% 
Phosphorus (max.) 1.4% 

When do we need to start worrying about the phosphorus getting too high? If this looks okay, then maybe the 6 Fish could also be added into our rotation.


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## buddy97 (Mar 29, 2010)

harrkim120 said:


> So, in your opinion, the 6 Fish Orijen would be ok as well?


it has the same Ca level as the large breed puppy. its a little higher in fat, but as with any large breed puppy, you want to be very careful of not overfeeding, which also can cause an increased growth rate. i alternated between the Puppy Large and fish during most of my GSD's puppyhood.


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