# Please help me understand. Pet shop dog vs. adoption.



## nfedyk (Jan 13, 2012)

First let me say that I am a total novice when it comes to dogs. A little background first. We lost my dad last year. Needless to say after 56 years of marriage my mom was absolutely devastated. After a few months passed we started to talk to her about getting a dog as a companion to ease her loneliness. She was very opposed to the idea initially. However when she went for a checkup with her doctor and mentioned this, the doctor thought it was a great idea. All of a sudden mom really wanted a dog and we were thrilled. The next morning my nephew took her to the local SPCA as well as a few pet stores in the area. Mom fell in love with a papillon at the pet shop and without doing any research we got him right away. (I know,big mistake.) We were just so happy that she agreed to get a dog. My mom named him Oliver.
We took Oliver to the vet right away and overall he was healthy except that he had giardia which the vet said was common in puppies. We are still trying to rid him of this after several rounds of meds. On the postive side he has totally changed my mom's life. She loves him to death and he does her. She now has a much better outlook on life and a reason to live. We took him to puppy classes and he did very well in them. He is a very active little guy and plays all day long. He still guards his food and toys at times but is getting better. He was already 6 months old when we purchased him so part of that may stem from living in a store environment with other dogs. The store had like little stables where each individual dog was housed but they were allowed to roam around the store and play with the other puppies.
I spend alot of time at my mom's and am very close to her little puppy. I was never a big animal person but I have to say I absolutely love Oliver and would do anything for him.
After we got him I joined a couple forums to gain information about caring for him. It was then that I read alot of the threads and realized that buying from a pet shop was a bad idea. I have a couple questions that I hope you experts can answer. First I would like to know if there are certain things we should watch out for being physical or emotional since he came from a pet shop? The second thing I don't fully understand is why does everyone say to adopt from a shelter or rescue instead? Is it mainly not to support the puppy mills? Aren't many of these dogs ones that might have been purchased at a pet shop initially as well before they were given up? If that is the case, wouldn't they have issues as well? Thanks for any suggestions you can give me. Oliver is now 10 months old. I really just want to do everything possible to do right by this little guy.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Buy buying a pet store dog, you are supporting one of the cruelest animal husbandry industries in the history of the US. Not to mention buying dogs that often have lifelong, chronic illnesses and genetic problems. If your puppy is healthy for her life, you will be lucky.

i think this might help explain.


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

Well you are right - buying from a pet shop is a bad idea. Not only supporting a despicable industry but as you see first hand emotional and behavioral problems are the norm along with physical problems. He was probably taken from his litter at 5 or 6 weeks old. Horrible for a baby. He has not learned to be a dog, bite inhibition, social graces and thousands of other things mom and siblings would have taught. 

First I would like to know if there are certain things we should watch out for being physical or emotional since he came from a pet shop? 
Definately watch for OCD behaviors, separation anxiety, extreme mouthiness, food/toy guarding, snapping or nipping at people. 
Healthwise anything from allergies - to epilepsy and anythign else his breed might be prone to. He definately did not come from top lines bred for health. 

The second thing I don't fully understand is why does everyone say to adopt from a shelter or rescue instead? Is it mainly not to support the puppy mills? 

People say that because shelter and rescues are cleaning up the mess left behind by puppy mills. Yes, many are puppy mill pups but some are from more reputable sources who just fell on bad luck. Yes, you do not want to support puppy mills in any way.


Aren't many of these dogs ones that might have been purchased at a pet shop initially as well before they were given up?
Yes, but buying them gives the store and the puppy mill reason to breed more.


If that is the case, wouldn't they have issues as well? Thanks for any suggestions you can give me. Oliver is now 10 months old. I really just want to do everything possible to do right by this little guy.

Yes, rescue dogs can and often do have all the same issues. The rescue actually does healthcare and you would know of these issues up front and hopefully the dogs being placed are being treated for these issues. There are also emotional traumas that oftentimes are just not fixable. Many are nervous, anxious, destructive, etc. Just take good care, watch for issues and take decisive action immediately whether it is a health issue or behavior issue. Good luck with your pup - I am glad he is being loved and cared for.


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## danecolor (Nov 22, 2010)

Liz and xellil have already done a good job of explaining, but i will add my two cents on one of your questions as well.

"_The second thing I don't fully understand is why does everyone say to adopt from a shelter or rescue instead? Is it mainly not to support the puppy mills? Aren't many of these dogs ones that might have been purchased at a pet shop initially as well before they were given up? _"

when you pay for something, the money you hand over goes to support the business you buy from. when you buy a car, for example, your cash is used by the car company to pay for costs of operation.

pet shop puppies come from puppy mills. pet shops, like all businesses, work under the forces of supply and demand. if there is a high demand for their puppies, they purchase more from the puppy mills to meet that demand and get more money. in contrast, if there was zero demand for pet shop puppies, pet shops wouldn't be making money from stocking puppies in their stores and therefore would not buy any more puppies from the puppy mills. when pet shops stop buying puppy mill puppies, the puppy mills no longer have an incentive to breed puppies they can't sell.

when you buy a puppy from a pet shop, you are creating a demand. you are opening a spot in their "inventory" for them to "stock" another puppy mill dog. your money is going to support the pet shop, which in turn supports puppy mills. since puppy mills are disgusting, inhumane operations that produce physically and mentally unstable dogs, most dog-savvy people would never intentionally support them.

so, to summarize: 

​pet shop buys puppy from puppy mill. 

​you buy puppy from pet shop. 

​your money supports pet shop and opens up a spot for another puppy in the shop. 

​pet shop pays puppy mill for another puppy, which encourages them to breed more and more puppies. 

this is how buying from a pet shop supports puppy mills and keeps them in business.

on the other hand, adopting a puppy mill dog that has been surrendered to a shelter or rescue does not support the continuation of puppy mills. you give your money to the shelter, which responsibly vets, cares for, and places dogs in carefully screened homes. you are supporting the continuation of the shelter by giving them your money and you are also giving a less-fortunate dog a home. understandably, this is a much better option.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

You might want to watch this clip
Madonna of the Mills | One Woman. Two Thousand Dogs. A Story of Hope


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

I am glad you are doing right by Oliver, you are being a very consciousnesses owner. I also want to say that I'm really sorry about your Dad, thats awful and I can understand how lonely and upset your Mum was.
Puppymill dogs though. They live their whole life in a cage, never allowed out. They are forced to mate, have a litter, mate, have a litter, mate, have a litter until the dog's body breaks down. Thats what's so dreadfully wrong, they are not treated or respected like a dog should be, they are just used like a machine to make money.
Rescue dogs are those that are given up for some reason. Sure, some of them are very likely to be ex puppymill dogs. And, a lot of the time you don't know what you are getting, but it's like having kids, you love them and part of the parcel is taking care of their medical needs, you just don't go and get rid of a kid or an animal because it gets sick. But a lot of shelter dogs are just sweethearts who have been dumped because of callous, uncaring owners, thats why it's always my first choice, to save a life and give a home to a dog that deserves it. 
But, I don't want you to feel bad, you've given Oliver the best home ever, he's a very lucky pup!


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

I think for the average pet home, often the best option is to rescue from a reputable shelter/rescue. I say reputable because not all rescues are created equal...

Pet stores and bad breeders (this can include the broad label of backyard breeders to puppy mills, etc.) do all dogs a disservice and can range from the extreme horrors in puppy mills to the clueless pet owner down the street who thought breeding Fluffy and Sparky was a grand idea because they are just so cute. The health, temperament, and because of how they are kept/raised/placed social and emotional well being of these animals often suffers.

Breeding dogs should be done to better the breed. A reputable breeder does extensive health testing on both parents (OFA, Cerf, etc.), titles or works both parents in some venue, and spends a heck of a lot of time and money on their stock and puppies. They place their pups a lot more carefully, usually with a contract to ensure first right of return for the pups safety so that the breeder can appropriately rehome the pup should things not work out or something happen.

Most reputable rescues have even more stringent placement policies, requiring home checks, follow up visits, etc. Shelters can't be so picky... often certain breeds like Siberian Huskies get returned over and over again because they are not suited to most pet homes and the shelter doesn't have the funding to have better adopter screening in place in order to safely place working dogs like that. Breed rescues try to pull shelter dogs for that reason... so the dogs have a better chance at finding a forever home.

I have two rescue dogs and while they are awesome, next time I will be going through a reputable breeder. Mainly because I want a working dog and not a pet dog. I'd also like to start baggage free. Not saying I won't ever rescue again, but yeah.

The Pap breed club website has a health section: Welcome to Papillon Club of America Inc ~ Health and Genetics website
I would look up what they are prone to and have your mom's pup screened just you can catch things early and set him up for as good a life as possible.


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## Donna Little (May 31, 2011)

This is something that I'm painfully passionate about. Probably more so because I'm one of the people cleaning up the mess. Puppy mills are literally houses of horror and it's not just about these poor dogs being forced to give birth heat cycle after heat cycle until they can no longer reproduce. It's about surviving with just enough basic necessities to keep them alive. Any comforts, ANY, are kept from them. Living on wire cages, matted to the skin, broken bones, starving if their cage mates keep them from the food bowl, full of infection from wounds (whether it be from fights or feet being caught in the cage bottoms), living in extreme heat or cold, suffocating from the smell of their own urine and feces, ulcerated eyes, ugggg, I could go on and on.
My precious boy that died this past summer was a puppy mill survivor. I had the honor of caring for him for just under 5 yrs before he died. All I can hope is that his former life of misery was forgotten because of the unconditional love he received here. He and all the other "breeder dogs" deserve SOOO much more that to be turned into money making machines. They deserve what you're giving your little guy. A home. With people that love them. A luxury most will unfortunately never know.
When you go to a shelter you don't always know exactly what you're getting. BUT, you don't know that when you buy from a puppy miller or pet shop either. AND adopting from a shelter means you will be saving a life. Even if you adopt from a no-kill shelter. When one dog gets adopted it makes room for the next and so on...
I'm hoping that the answers you've been given here will help you make good informed future decisions when you're ready to adopt again. 
I'm very sorry about your dad and hope that this lucky little Papillon lives a long and full life with your family.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Amen, Donna. Just looking into the eyes of your crew makes me incredibly grateful for you and your ilk who help save so many. 

And for Snorkels' foster mom, who is extremely similar to you - 11 doxies in her house right now. And getting more all the time.

We can legislate until the cows come home, but the only way to stop it is for people to quit buying.


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## nfedyk (Jan 13, 2012)

Thank you so much everyone for all your responses. You have really given me an education and I appreciate it so much. I just happened to check if the puppy store where we got Oliver had a website. Here is a snapshot of the home page. They sure make it sound like you are getting a top quality dog. How deceiving that is. I am hoping that by giving Oliver the best care and good quality food he will be able to overcome some of the issues he could have being that he came from a puppy mill.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Yep, unfortunately that is definitely a place that sells puppy mill dogs. There are red flags all over the web page.

And sadly, most people will pay more for a mixed breed (aka "designer) dog at a pet shop than they would pay for a well bred dog from a good breeder.


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## Maxy24 (Mar 5, 2011)

Like everyone else said, the main reason to choose shelter/rescue over a pet shop is because of where your money is going. In either case you don't know the dog's genetic background so health and temperament are both questionable (in the case of puppies...with adult dogs you have some idea of temperament). But int he case of a shelter your money is going to take care of animals who were abandoned and need help. In the case of a pet shop your money is going to continue the torture of mill breeding dogs. I hope Oliver turns out to be a wonderful and healthy dog, and as much as I hate and despise pet stores that sell puppies, I can't get mad at people who buy pet store dogs without knowing where they came from and what they are funding by doing so. So just use this knowledge for the future, and enjoy your little dog.


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Your questions have been answered already, I just wanted to applaud you for your willingness to learn and understand the horrific industry that pet shops and puppy mills are. A lot of people really don't think about or question these things.


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## bridget246 (Oct 26, 2011)

My next show dog will be from a breeder. Going to do my hardest to raise Bridget and give her the best life possible but she might have issues. I really want to be able to talk to my breeder about any problems that might come up. It of course nothing can grant a problem free experience. 

I'd be worried about the shelter for more of the same reason. I'd feel a lot better because at least then I know I'm rescuing a dog. If I had to pick 10 dogs and was given the option to pick as much as I wanted from either place I would get all 10 from the shelter. I wouldn't even consider the pet store.


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Excuse me as I did not read the whole thread. 

Pet shop puppies are cute, brand new little puppies who are sold in pet stores like they are these well bred, properly cared for dogs when they are, more than likely, puppy mill puppies. 

Rescue dogs are dogs who may or may not have been pet store puppies at one point but are in need of a second chance. 

The way I see it, a lot of pet store puppies will end up in shelters. Why not stop supporting the sale of pet store puppies which will therefore help reduce the number of emotionally damaged dogs in shelters? If pet stores stopped selling puppies, it would really help reduce the numbers of dogs in shelters because the puppy mills would no longer have those stores to sell their puppies to which would aid in putting them out of business.

I could go on and on but I will likely start repeating myself.

Everyone else has given you great answers. Your family made a mistake by not researching this first but it was an honest one and it only makes us here think more of you because of your willingness to learn. That says more about a person than anything else. All I can say is that you have my respect for wanting to learn more about your puppy's past and background even though you could have gotten nothing but criticism for where your pup came from.


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## brandypup (Jan 23, 2012)

Pet shop = puppies bred for profit only, treated as livestock and merchandise. From ilegle puppy mills or from commercial puppy farmers. Over priced puppies, no health testing or guarentee no recourse or breeder support through dogs lifespan. 

Adoption - saving a discarded dog at a fraction of the price of buiying a pet store dog. Making room for another dog to be saved. 

responsible breeder - takes work and time to find one. Supporting responsible breeding means you support the breed and the people who care enough to do more then just breed puppies. Can take a year or more of work and time. Lifetime supoprt, health testing and guarentee. 

You can research a pet store puppy here
Request Report


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

I can't say anything more than has been said here! My neighbors daughter recently went to a UGH Happiness is Pets out here and bought her puppy! She went in like your mom fell in love and that was that! I have learned the hard way too not to buy from puppy stores! I think many have! I am right now interested in a bunny and am looking into adoption ! My daughter has been looking for a guinea pig and has found shelter pigs !So yes we all learn ! Your Mom fell in love with a puppy and so be it! Your doing a great job with the pup and he is having the best of the best! I am sorry to hear of your fathers passing. Your Mom sounds like she is thrilled with her little puppy so kudos to her, and you! Next time, when she wants a compainion for the pup ,you will know to take her to the shelter!


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Petfinder is also a great source if you are looking for a particular breed. They don't get a ton of puppies, but i know the Dobie rescue I got Rebel from had three litters in the year I was involved with them. Certainly not any longer than waiting for a litter from a good breeder.


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## Donna Little (May 31, 2011)

I end up with purebred puppies all the time as well as "designer breeds" that people decide they don't want to deal with after they've been born. I just got a call last week asking me to take a litter of 7 Rat Terrier puppies. The dog was bred and apparently the owner has become overwhelmed and no longer thinks this was a good idea. They want to keep the mom so the puppies will stay with her until they're old enough. I don't know if they'll change their minds before the pups are old enough to come to my house and then end up plastering them all over Craigslist but I'll find out in a few weeks. Purebreds are in rescue all the time now, much more than in the past. Sad but true...


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