# I'm going to try PMR..... !



## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

I decided my start date! I have a week off of Grad school for Thanksgiving. This will be the perfect time to start! I have time to research and time to finish up their current bags of kibble/premade raw. Also, I will have those free days to actually sort out meat and enjoy/document their first few raw meals!

We have an extra fridge/freezer in the garage. It's not perfect because only half of it is a freezer, but it's better than nothing and I can stock a decent amount in there. 

Any starting advice would be appreciated! They are both standard poodles. One is 8 mo. and 42 pounds, the other is 2 1/2 years and 60 pounds. The main reason I want to switch them to raw is because Henry bloated and almost died. My conventional vet, who is generally against raw, said, "If I had a dog that bloated, I would try raw..". 

And, hey, if it's too much work? I'll just go back to kibble! It's worth a try, right?


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Woooohooo, welcome to the dark side! lol. 
Just remember to not get ahead of yourself, start out slow, don't rush the process. 
Raw is incredibly rewarding. 
I can't imagine not having my freezers though, I'd watch for ads for good cheap ones.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Read through our website for a complete and detailed guide to getting started, that's where I suggest you start out. Come back with any and all questions!!!! 

How to get started feeding a Prey Model Raw Diet | Prey Model Raw


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

I'm currently living with my parents. I'm not sure how they would feel about me dragging a new freezer into the house, ha ha! Do people make it work by just stocking up a 1/2 freezer? I am hoping I can just buy for 1 or 2 weeks at a time.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Oh for sure. It's just to get the super cheap prices on meat you usually have to buy in bulk. If there's no room inside their house it's perfectly fine to put a freezer outside as long as it's safe from water damage. We have kept one freezer outside for quite a while without issue. It is much easier with more freezer space, no doubt about that.

I will also say that you must give it time and patience. There is a chance that your pups may not know what to do with RMBs or have a bit of initial digestive upset. But give it a chance and you'll never go back to kibble, even for the ease and convenience of kibble. Even if I could get the best kibble on the market for free I would never go back to it!


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## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

I currently feed about 1 kg a day and I only have a small freezer. Yea I would love a large chest, or full hight upright but I make do. admittedly I did just give over the last of the human food space to my pup!!! 
I have gone for the different proteins different draw options, so I have 2 draws of chicken one of beef, and one of all others like fish I normally have to shop every 2 weeks for foods. But heck thats part of the fun!!


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

I'm getting kind of excited, ha ha!

These are my only concerns so far:

*Where do I feed them in inclement weather? (Snow, rain, etc.) I plan on feeding them outside in nice weather. Will I need to clean up outside so people aren't walking around in raw meat juices? Millie doesn't like to eat raw deliciousness in one spot.
*Calculating the right amount to feed. I am terrible at math!
*Is it still okay to feed regular dog biscuits? I don't want to give those up!


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## spookychick13 (Jan 26, 2010)

Yay!
Welcome.

Premade raw was my gateway drug too.


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

BrownieM said:


> I'm getting kind of excited, ha ha!
> 
> These are my only concerns so far:
> 
> ...


Rain/Snow: I'd feed outside in the snow as long as it wasn't like 10 below. For the really cold/wet days we feed in the kitchen. Cleanup is a quick wipe of the floor

You can teach them to eat where you want. We allow ours to take their dinner onto their dog beds. If they move somewhere you don't want them eating, pick the food up and move it to where you want them to eat. Repeat this process until they stay where you want

Calculating: We've never weighed a single thing. That's not saying that it might not help you in the beginning. If you're really worried about it get a small kitchen scale that you can use to weigh things out. Pay attention to the size of each item so you can more easily eyeball it later on. 

When we feed we simply hand out meat until we feel each girl has had enough for the day. We keep an eye on body condition and if anyone starts to look a little ribby or chunky we'll adjust their next few meals.

Biscuits: I would avoid treats until your dogs have adjusted to raw. You don't want anything coming into their diet that could cause digestive upset and set their progress back. Once they're adjusted feel free to include your normal treats again


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

We still feed outside in the snow unless it's really freezing cold. When that happens, we feed inside. If it's raining we either wait til it stops or feed them outside still if it's not too heavy or just inside. You'd be surprised how clean a dog is when raw fed.

Math is easy with raw...Assuming your pup will get up to 60 pounds full grown, you'd feed 1.2 to 1.8 pounds per day. This is of course just a guideline and you may have to adjust a bit up or down.

I still feed crap biscuits on occasion LOL


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## luvMyBRT (Mar 8, 2010)

Awww....so your coming over to the dark side now.....:wink: Welcome! :biggrin:

You've gotten some great advice from the pros. Just wanted to add that when the weather is bad outside, I feed in the garage. Works great and I have no clean up.

Read the link that Natalie posted about getting started. It and the link by RFD are what I refer to all the time. I also ask tons of questions! :smile:


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

saraj2878 said:


> Awww....so your coming over to the dark side now.....:wink: Welcome! :biggrin:
> 
> You've gotten some great advice from the pros. Just wanted to add that when the weather is bad outside, I feed in the garage. Works great and I have no clean up.
> 
> Read the link that Natalie posted about getting started. It and the link by RFD are what I refer to all the time. I also ask tons of questions! :smile:


I'm just going to give it a try! It can't hurt, right?  I'm actually not even against feeding high quality kibble or premade raw, but I will do anything to lessen the chance of Henry ever bloating again and to protect Millie from bloat. I really think that raw is a great way to reduce the chance of bloat (besides genetics).


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

The very BEST way to prevent bloat is to have a gastropexy done on your dogs. Our Danes will ALWAYS have this done


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

I agree with Jon 100000%. I have known raw fed dogs that still bloat. Ask your vet about doing a gastropexy as a preventative measure with Millie...I sure would if I were you.


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

jdatwood said:


> The very BEST way to prevent bloat is to have a gastropexy done on your dogs. Our Danes will ALWAYS have this done


Very true. We learned this after Henry bloated - he obviously had the pexy done when he bloated. It turns out he had many risk factors so it was just a matter environmental factors to bring it on. He has a VERY narrow chest (like danes) and there is bloat in his lines. We were out of town and he was staying with my sister. He didn't eat for a few days (he missed us too much) and she dropped him off at our house 2 hours before we arrived home. She chased him around the back yard and left him with a bowl of food. He felt so relaxed to be in his own house, that he gulped the food. When we walked in the door 2 hours later, he had already bloated.

Millie, well, I thought about prophylactic gastropexy when she got spayed, but I opted not to because she is a smaller built girl, more chunky and less narrow. She does not have that narrow, deep chest and tall body that Henry has. So, I decided not to fix something that wasn't broken. I still waver on whether or not I made the right decision. If I was to do it again, I would wait until she was 1 year old to get her spayed and I would have done the gastropexy then.

If I had a dane, there is NO doubt I would do gastropexy. Don't Danes have like a 20% chance of bloat in their lifetime or something? I'm not sure of the percentage, but I know they are #1 on the list!


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

danemama08 said:


> I agree with Jon 100000%. I have known raw fed dogs that still bloat. Ask your vet about doing a gastropexy as a preventative measure with Millie...I sure would if I were you.


I'm sure there are still dogs who bloat that are raw fed, but don't you think having less fillers, corn, preservatives, etc. helps reduce the risk?

I already had her spayed, so I am not sure how I feel about putting her under again for the gastropexy. Especially because she doesn't seem to have that skinny, narrow body. I know a lady who lost her last poodle to bloat and she also agreed that Millie just doesn't have that body type and she doubts she would ever bloat. Now, that's not to say it won't happen. I am going to try to control her environmental factors though before I go straight to surgery. Henry has had some digestive complications from having his stomach tacked and while I know those complications are not normal, I would just hate to put my healthy puppy through that! 

I may never know if my decision was the right one or not, but the least I can do is minimize her risk with environmental factors!


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Yes the percentage is that high! 

And 10% of the Danes that do bloat die from it or complications during or after surgery....

ETA: Your dog that bloated who had complications with his bowls was probably a side effect from the act of bloating and not the surgery. If you had a gastropexy done preventatively the chances of side effects are much much lower. 

Also, I do believe that raw does reduce the risk but it sure doesn't prevent it from happening altogether...I don't believe that trying to reduce environmental factors really helps much, at least for Danes that is.


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

danemama08 said:


> Yes the percentage is that high!
> 
> And 10% of the Danes that do bloat die from it or complications during or after surgery....


Yikes! We were very lucky with Henry. We caught it right away! There was no damage to any of his organs. 

He actually didn't show any outward signs (he wasn't visibly bloated). He was in terrible pain though because his stomach was twisted. At first the vet said, NO he's not bloated! Only after the x-ray did they know.


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## hcdoxies (Sep 22, 2010)

I have a small 5 cu. ft. freezer in our master closet  (my husband thinks I'm insane!) It holds about 120 lbs of meat. I feed 7 miniature dachshunds - totaling about 77 pounds


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

hcdoxies said:


> I have a small 5 cu. ft. freezer in our master closet  (my husband thinks I'm insane!) It holds about 120 lbs of meat. I feed 7 miniature dachshunds - totaling about 77 pounds


my husband thinks i'm insane because i want another freezer. we already have two and a half....i have two dogs, total weight - 54 lbs.

what an awesome idea.....freezer in a closet LOL

brownie....i hope it works out for you and raw....i think you're going to love it....and i'm real glad you're going to give it a try...


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## bumblegoat (May 12, 2010)

A freezer in a walk-in closet? Next step - get a walk-in freezer.


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## hcdoxies (Sep 22, 2010)

magicre said:


> what an awesome idea.....freezer in a closet LOL


haha, yes... It's quite inventive 

You know, though, it's in the perfect location for us. I dream of getting a stand-up freezer (it would fit in the same spot!)... but my husband won't let me :-(


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