# new food back to basics



## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

PORK 


ALL THere is in it is pork offal and peas have u guys seen this? WOW 

FIve stars? 

ITs very new 



Looks crazy It is meant for dogs with problems like allergy u guys heard of it?


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

I've heard of it. I literally searched all over for a good kibble. I got extremely excited after looking at the ingredients so I stated looking at reviews. Apparently some people found trash in their bags which immediately turned me off. I don't know if they've fixed that yet, but I'd still be wary none the less.


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

i think that was cleaned up also haters can start rumors

REmember new bags come with free coupons and discounts that could be the garbage silly people are thinking they are getting? lol

Pork Liver
Pork Meal
Pork Protein
Tapioca
Pork Fat (Naturally Preserved with Mixed Tocopherols)
Peas
Pork Gelatin
Pork Kidney
Whole Flaxseed
Menhaden Fish Oil
Natural Pork Flavor
Sunflower Oil
Salt
L-Carnitine
Dicalcium Phosphate
Potassium Chloride
Zinc Proteinate
Choline Chloride
Iron Proteinate
Vitamin E Supplement
L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate (Source of Vitamin C)
Manganese Proteinate
Biotin
Copper Proteinate
Niacin
Calcium Pantothenate
Sodium Selenite
Vitamin A Supplement
Riboflavin Supplement
Vitamin D3 Supplement
Thiamine Mononitrate
Vitamin B12 Supplement
Calcium Iodate
Pyridoxine Hydrochloride
Folic Acid


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## monster'sdad (Jul 29, 2012)

This food is made by Dad's. It is very expensive and in my opinion not worth the money. "Pork Protein" is a cheap, powdered protein concentrate made from hides. Is it a bad ingredient, no, far better than Pea Protein, but this food is way overpriced.

Dad's has a good facility and also makes Enhance.

It is a matter of cost.


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

yeah it is so expensive like we have to be millionairs to buy food these days what the hell? lol 

how would you compare this cost to canine caviar? this food seems cheaper than the cali natural kangaroo BUT this food is much better than cali natural kangaroo.

you really need to be rich these days to own a big dog.


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## monster'sdad (Jul 29, 2012)

exotica said:


> yeah it is so expensive like we have to be millionairs to buy food these days what the hell? lol
> 
> how would you compare this cost to canine caviar? this food seems cheaper than the cali natural kangaroo BUT this food is much better than cali natural kangaroo.
> 
> you really need to be rich these days to own a big dog.


No you don't. I use Dr. Tim's Pursuit and I have large breed dogs going two months on a 44lb bag for around $50. World class food made for dogs not people. If Dr. Tim can win the Iditarod, crush other dogs in the Purina Endurance Invitational and have other top kennels using it, that is good enough for me.

Canine Caviar is not a food I would use. The guy running it is a sharp marketer and that is it. The food is not made at Ohio Pet anymore either.

For a Canadian resident, I would use Nutram or one of the foods made by Corey.


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## Kibblelady (Jul 13, 2012)

Back To Basics is not a new brand. That may be a new formula but they have always used pork protein.


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## monster'sdad (Jul 29, 2012)

Kibblelady said:


> Back To Basics is not a new brand. That may be a new formula but they have always used pork protein.


The old Back to Basics went bust, probably owed Dad's money for production and then Dad's took over using the name. 

The name is old but not the food that is out there now.


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

the old one was nasty


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

The food has been out for over a year.


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## DaViking (Sep 27, 2011)

schism said:


> I tried to contact Nutram and ask where they sources their vitamin pre-mix and they were very vague but did say overseas..? I'm not very comfortable with that answer.
> Who is Corey?


Nutram Adult and Nutram Active are among the best foods you can buy in Canada. I really don't care that much about where vitamin pre-mixes are sourced. European, Mexican or Asian. There are some big multinational players in this market with plants all over the globe. They are subject to the same standards. Protein sources is another thing.

Corey Nutrition is the maker of ProSeries and Inukshuk.


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

Chicken meal, ground rice, whole ground corn, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of vitamin E, and citric acid), fresh chicken, beet pulp, natural chicken flavours, Canadian salmon meal, dicalcium phosphate, Canadian salmon oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of vitamin E, and citric acid), flaxseed, whole dried egg, alfalfa, oat fibre, potassium chloride, salt, calcium sulphate, sodium tripolyphosphate, chicory root extract, dried seaweed meal, vitamins & minerals*, citric acid, calcium propionate, dehydrated spinach, glucosamine hydrochloride, choline chloride, DL-methionine, yucca schidigera extract, green lipped mussel, green tea leaves, peppermint leaves, parsley leaves, ginkgo, echinacea, chamomile, rosemary extract.

looks like garbage to me, if i fed that trash to my dog it would kill her.  I am never going to read another post of yours again. Where is the ignore feature here?


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

schism go have fun stuffing your dogs face with white rice and corn then dont you tell me what is what.


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## DaViking (Sep 27, 2011)

exotica said:


> Chicken meal, ground rice, whole ground corn, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of vitamin E, and citric acid), fresh chicken, beet pulp, natural chicken flavours, Canadian salmon meal, dicalcium phosphate, Canadian salmon oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of vitamin E, and citric acid), flaxseed, whole dried egg, alfalfa, oat fibre, potassium chloride, salt, calcium sulphate, sodium tripolyphosphate, chicory root extract, dried seaweed meal, vitamins & minerals*, citric acid, calcium propionate, dehydrated spinach, glucosamine hydrochloride, choline chloride, DL-methionine, yucca schidigera extract, green lipped mussel, green tea leaves, peppermint leaves, parsley leaves, ginkgo, echinacea, chamomile, rosemary extract.
> 
> looks like garbage to me, if i fed that trash to my dog it would kill her.  I am never going to read another post of yours again. Where is the ignore feature here?


You have no idea what you are talking about. Come back when you realize that big piles of poop from inappropriate fiber sources and undigested starch is not so ideal anymore. Let us know when you see off the charts blood protein concentrations. There isn't a single grain free formula on the market that are better and more appropriate than good grain in formulas. None, it's not made yet. Feel free to ignore whatever you want, it's a free country.


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## karisma11 (Feb 13, 2011)

DaViking said:


> Let us know when you see off the charts blood protein concentrations.


What does that mean?


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

oh no viking trust me i will ignore those who try to push me into feeding things that will kill my dog including you. Don't you dare try tell people what is the best you are no vet.


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

there are 100 other grain free to choose from nutram would be the worst of them all. I AM DONE WITH THIS FOOD!

I decided on canine caviar anyways so far it is going ok on day 3. stools are not soft but not hard inbetween.


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## DaViking (Sep 27, 2011)

exotica said:


> there are 100 other grain free to choose from nutram would be the worst of them all. I AM DONE WITH THIS FOOD!


Again, you have no idea what you are talking about. Nutram GF have only been available in the market for a few months and only a handful of stores carry it. But you are saying you have thoroughly tested it and found it to be the "worst of them all"? Come on.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

this person is clearly...insane.


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## DaViking (Sep 27, 2011)

karisma11 said:


> What does that mean?


Increased plasma concentrations of amino acids and a-amino acids competing for the same transport mechanisms. I also have questions re. constantly bombarding the liver with high amounts of ammonia, more a question than anything firm really. Very little research on this but we do know that ammonia poisoning in mammals, either directly from a protein overload or from an otherwise compromised liver, is very much a reality.


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## karisma11 (Feb 13, 2011)

DaViking said:


> Increased plasma concentrations of amino acids and a-amino acids competing for the same transport mechanisms. I also have questions re. constantly bombarding the liver with high amounts of ammonia, more a question than anything firm really. Very little research on this but we do know that ammonia poisoning in mammals, either directly from a protein overload or from an otherwise compromised liver, is very much a reality.


Transport mechanisms where? Where are you finding this information?

From my understanding, hyperammonemia is only a concern in cases of portosystemic shunts, end stage liver disease, and congenital urea cycle enzyme deficiencies. High protein does lead to high BUN, but normal animals should not have increased levels of ammonia.


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## DaViking (Sep 27, 2011)

karisma11 said:


> Transport mechanisms where? Where are you finding this information?


The blood-brain barrier. Abundant circulating amino acids compete for a limited number of transport molecules into the brain. There is no shortage of anecdotal evidence from trainers out there that will tell you dogs with no extreme energy and protein needs on a high protein diet are a challenge to work with, unable to concentrate and appear to be stressed.

De Napoli, J.S., Dodman, N.H., Shuster, L., Rand, W.M. & Gross, KI (2000) Effect of dietary protein content and tryptophan supplementation on dominance aggression, territorial aggression and hyperactivity in dogs. JAVMA, 217, 504-508.
Dodman, N.H., Reisner, I., Shuster, I. et al (1996) Effect of dietary protein content on behaviour in dogs. JAVMA, 208, 376-379.
Lindsay, S.R. (2001)Handbook of Applied Dog Behaviour and Training, Vol 2, USA, Blackwell
Mugford, R.A. (1987) The influence of nutrition on canine behaviour. J Small Anim Pract. 28, 1046-1085.
Spring, B. (1986) Effects of food and nutrients on the behaviour of normal individuals. In Wurtmann, R.J. & Wurtmann, J.J. (Eds) Nutrition and the Brain, 7, 1-47




karisma11 said:


> High protein does lead to high BUN, but normal animals should not have increased levels of ammonia.


I have searched for studies focusing on this but have found very little. Do we know, across the board, what is enough? And is "enough" the same across all breeds and sizes? When will the liver say "hey, enough already, all this ammonia is taking too much of a toll" I have some very concrete reasons and a diagnosis for asking these questions, but it is circumstantial as so much else is. Thing is it didn't fit in with any of the scenarios you gave above.


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## Kibblelady (Jul 13, 2012)

That listed ingredient panel looks well constructed. It certainly would not kill a dog, geeze what's that based on? The corn in that food is being used appropriately. I would try it. I believe it only had three ingredients before the fat source. That usually indicates a lot of animal protein if the protein percentage is high.


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## monster'sdad (Jul 29, 2012)

DaViking said:


> Nutram Adult and Nutram Active are among the best foods you can buy in Canada. I really don't care that much about where vitamin pre-mixes are sourced. European, Mexican or Asian. There are some big multinational players in this market with plants all over the globe. They are subject to the same standards. Protein sources is another thing.
> 
> Corey Nutrition is the maker of ProSeries and Inukshuk.


Totally agree with the statement about Nutram.


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## monster'sdad (Jul 29, 2012)

exotica said:


> there are 100 other grain free to choose from nutram would be the worst of them all. I AM DONE WITH THIS FOOD!
> 
> I decided on canine caviar anyways so far it is going ok on day 3. stools are not soft but not hard inbetween.


You picked an average food made by a dishonest person and spent 2 -3 times what you should have.


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## exotica (Nov 2, 2012)

the one you picked has to many things in it, won't work sorry


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