# Ethics of deceptive advertising in regards to dog food.



## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

Ok, so I know dog food companies are in it for the money. Don't get me wrong. And I DO believe in personal responsibility for food choices, research etc. But the average consumer does NOT know food terms, and it's further conflicted when vets preach that dogs are omnivores, not carnivores... I think there should be tougher laws and regulations when it comes to dog food (and human food too, but that's another place). 

Eg, should Alpo be able to call their formula "Lamb, rice and barley formula" when the ingredients are:
Ground Yellow Corn, Digest of Chicken By-Products, Poultry By-Product Meal, Animal Fat(stabilized with BHA), Lamb Meal, Brewer's Rice, Ground Barley, Soybean Meal, Corn Gluten Meal, Whole Chicory Root, Salt, Potassium Chloride, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Manganese Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Sodium Selenite, Choline Chloride, Vitamin E, A, B12 & D3 Supplements, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement, Thiamin Mononitrate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Folic Acid, Biotin.

.. Shouldn't it really be more accurately called corn and random animal bits formula?

Should Beneful be allowed to call their food healthy, and show happy pictures of whole ears of corn, big chunks of real meat, when in reality it's a meat slurry of different types of animals and corn gluten meal?


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

I can't remember where I saw it but I read somwhere several years ago that if ingredients are mentioned in the name, they must be the prominent ingredients in the formula. As for the pictures, thats normal operating procedure with all dog food companies.


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## Porphyria (Jul 13, 2011)

Unfortunately we live in a very pro-corporate environment, which makes it difficult to further regulate _ anything _.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

Porphyria said:


> Unfortunately we live in a very pro-corporate environment, which makes it difficult to further regulate _ anything _.



True. Flip Fox News on any minute of the day. You will see some blowhard railing against regulation and how its responsible for the current economic climate we are in. 

If anything, get ready for LESS regulation. 

It commands us to be better consumers. Luckily, we have this wonderful thing called the Internet. No longer can companies spin their BS marketing campaigns on us and not be found out....at least for those willing to type some key words into a search box on Google(I know its difficult


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

We shouldn't rely on the government to take care of us. We have brains and we should use them. Admittedly, I went a long time without using my brains on either dog or people food. 

And yes the internet has made a huge difference. They can run, but they can't hide if we only take the time to check.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

kevin bradley said:


> True. Flip Fox News on any minute of the day. You will see some blowhard railing against regulation and how its responsible for the current economic climate we are in.


They aren't blowhards. They are telling the truth. This country got to were it was a few years ago by people taking responsibilty for their own lives and not depending on the government babysitting them throughout life. This has been changing the last few years and really rushed into "change" when the country was thougtless enough to elect a community organizer as president. 



> If anything, get ready for LESS regulation.


We can only hope. 



> It commands us to be better consumers. Luckily, we have this wonderful thing called the Internet. No longer can companies spin their BS marketing campaigns on us and not be found out....at least for those willing to type some key words into a search box on Google(I know its difficult


We had ways to do research before the internet. It was just more difficult.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Porphyria said:


> Unfortunately we live in a very pro-corporate environment, which makes it difficult to further regulate _ anything _.


We used to back when times were prosperous. Unfortunately in today's world we don't. Private enterprise is regulated to death.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> They aren't blowhards. They are telling the truth. This country got to were it was a few years ago by people taking responsibilty for their own lives and not depending on the government babysitting them throughout life. This has been changing the last few years and really rushed into "change" when the country was thougtless enough to elect a community organizer as president.


ALWAYS, Raw? Come on. That is debateable. 

I'm not in small business so I can't speak to what regulations they face. However, I don't feel like the Govt commands my life. I travel where I want, do what I want, eat what I want, feed my dogs what I want... virtually every day, too , I just have a hard time with the rights view that Govt has taken over my life. Tax me to death?... Hell, I haven't seen anything change in my paycheck. 

I wish we would have had MORE regulation in my area. Enbridge energy busted an oil line in a local creek in my area a year ago. Oil flowed into my favorite Smallmouth Bass Stream and I haven't been able to fish it since. Look it up. 

Where I don't agree with you is this... its this, "Sell what you want, do what you want, to hell with ethics, let the free market decide what it wants and everything will be Eutopia." 

But I do love you


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

kevin bradley said:


> ALWAYS, Raw? Come on. That is debateable.


If you want the government to take care of all your needs, then it's debatable. Otherwise it isn't.



> I'm not in small business so I can't speak to what regulations they face.


I have owned small businesses in years past and I will tell you I spent at least as much time complying w/ govt regs as I did in actually doing company work. It's MUCH worse today. Large corps have it even worse. They have several whole departments that all they do is handle government regulations.



> However, I don't feel like the Govt commands my life.


You just haven't sat down and analyzed that. The government has its hands in every aspect of your life. It even controls the type toilet you meditate on. It controls every product you buy. It increases the price on every product you buy. It even tells you what products you can and can't buy. Very soon, I won't be able to buy the light bulbs I want to buy.



> I travel where I want, do what I want,


Yes, but the govt holds up the building and upgrades off all the roads you travel on. Because of Gov't regulations, it takes 15 years to build a road a few miles long from conception until completion. It determines what research much be done before the road can be built. lt controls how right of way is purchased. It controls which contractors can bid on that road. It tells those contractors where they must purchase their raw matrials. It controls the manufacturer of the items that goes into the building of those roads (asphalt, gravel, soil, cement, etc). It tells the contractor what he must pay his workers. It tells him what hours he can and can not do work on the road. The government regulates every aspect of the gasoline you burn to travel. It controls the formulas of that gas. It taxes the gas. The government gets a larger part of the money you pay for the gas than the oil company does.



> eat what I want, feed my dogs what I want...


But the government controls every aspect of that food from plowing the field to the running of the gorcery stores. It controls the trucks and trains and planes that deliver that food to the grocery store. It controls every step of the handling of that food.



> I just have a hard time with the rights view that Govt has taken over my life.


Well maybe you see better now. AND ... each of those zillion regulations costs YOU money. The government spends money controlling all that stuff. Guess who pays for all that regulation? Me and you! Each regulation causes the price of that particular product to rise becaue it costs the company money to comply with the regulations. Guess who pays for that? Me and you through higher prices.

So now do you see why so many jobs are going overseas? 

Let me give you an example of the federal government costing me money when I was in the highway construction business. All of my employees were paid a set hourly wage BUT when we worked on roads that had federal money in it, we had to pay them a higher wage because the federal government mandated it. During normal work, they were paid overtime for work over 40 hours in a week but on federal jobs we were mandated to pay overtime rates on all over 8 hours a day. That is a big difference.



> Tax me to death?... Hell, I haven't seen anything change in my paycheck.


Sit down and figure how much you are paying in taxes ... Federal Income tax, State Income tax, City income tax, Gas tax, sales tax, FICA tax, cigarette tax if you smoke, alcahol tax if you lke a beer occasionally, excise tax on some products you buy, airport tax if you ever fly. Those are the direct taxes you pay. Then there are the indirect taxes you pay because of the prices you pay for all the companies you do business with. For example, how much cheaper would a loaf of bread be if the farmer, manufacturer, trucker, and grocer had to pay no taxes? About 60% or more of the cost of a loaf of bread is in taxes that someone along the line had to pay.



> I wish we would have had MORE regulation in my area. Enbridge energy busted an oil line in a local creek in my area a year ago. Oil flowed into my favorite Smallmouth Bass Stream and I haven't been able to fish it since. Look it up.


What regulation would have stopped that? Stuff happens. Always has, always will. How much more would more regulations add to the cost gas?

One more thing to think about ... because of regulations in place today, if the airplane had not been invented yet, it could never be built. Same with automobiles and we would be stuck with horse and buggy forever. 



> Where I don't agree with you is this... its this, "Sell what you want, do what you want, to hell with ethics, let the free market decide what it wants and everything will be Eutopia."


Private market will take care of itself. The law of supply and demand should be supreme law.



> But I do love you


I love you too but not like that. :biggrin:


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

Points well made, Raw.

But don't you feel like SOME regulation is a good thing... and most are done so with reasonably sensible intentions? Anything can go too far, but the foundation is generally to make us safer, to make our world more civil and safe. 

Take speed limits. We can debate all day long about whether the Govt has the RIGHT to set speed limits. However, the INTENTIONS of the rule is to make us all safer... I honestly don't feel like its to control our lives or have their hand on us, or some diabolical conspiracy. Plus, you impact others around you when you drive like a wild man. 


But overall, I get what you are saying. You almost sound Libertarian.

And yeah, I don't Love you like THAT either


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

I wish I had saved the article and I didn't but I read last year that in 2005 we paid 55% of our salary in taxes - this year it will be 70%.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Yes, unfortunately some regulation is necessary. However I don't believe that most regulation is done with good intentions towards us or our lives. Most regulations are in place for the benefit of some group or entity and have nothing to do with the public well being. I am libertarian, I guess. I believe in freedom. I believe everyone should be free to do exactly as they want as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of someone else. I am a strong believer in MUCH smaller government and MUCH smaller taxes on everything.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i think that consequences need to be in place for those who are unethical and greedy......

but kneejerk reactions to create more legislation and regulation only keep honest people groaning from the monkeys on our backs because of some ass who thought it would be cool to deregulate short selling....or sell a person making 12000 a year that 400000 dollar home.

consequences. that's what we need.

we talk about government as if it is an entity unto itself and i guess it seems that way. 

but it's not.

it's people like you and me who got a taste for power and abuse it day after day.

throw them out and start over. replace the greedy ones. it's all a matter of public record. go to the dot gov page and see which way your congressman or senator voted.....and if you agree, vote them back in. if not, then don't.

the usda and fda and ama and big pharma only have power because we the people gave it to them. 

we the people need to take back our country. and whilst that sounds very idealistic, in reality we can by voting the suckers out. over and over again. 

regulations? more? i'm being watched every where i go. those damned cameras....i have no privacy because after 9/11 we decided we needed a paternalistic government where daddy would take care of us..

anyone here ever read the patriot act? good because congress didn't before voting it in....the senate didn't before voting it in...

we have more pac money going out of our wallets and never mistake that special interest groups are wining and dining your senators and congressman so we pay for it, for the money has to come from somewhere...

yes, we are grass roots...but that is how we overthrew britain....pretty powerful stuff...when did we give away our power?


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## kzhen8 (Sep 13, 2011)

It is wrong and I never trust the packaging or would ask and double check with my favorite holistic pet store owner before anything. Always read the ingredients and the first three are usually used most. Also lamb meal is not real lamb..


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## dogmanden (Apr 9, 2009)

I'm more worried about the BLOWHARD in the WHITE HOUSE!!!


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

dogmanden said:


> I'm more worried about the BLOWHARD in the WHITE HOUSE!!!


he's the least of your worries. 

worry more about a contentious congress and senate. worry more about the new poverty level.

we have a system of cheques and balances for a reason and actually the executive branch is the weakest of the three.....

but, having said that....you have power to vote him out. wouldn't it be cool if 100% of us exercised our power to vote, freely, for whomever you desire.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

magicre said:


> h
> but, having said that....you have power to vote him out. wouldn't it be cool if 100% of us exercised our power to vote, freely, for whomever you desire.


In my hometown, the last local elections (and I think individuals have so much more influence on these) produced a 3% turnout, in a town of almost 100,000 people. I was appalled - it made me wonder if we don't deserve to have such a crappy, corrupt government because in reality it seems no one cares who is in office.


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## Cliffdog (Dec 30, 2010)

Here's something you all might find an informative read. I did.
Four Naming Rules That Can Help Reveal a Dog Food’s True Meat Content


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

Cliffdog said:


> Here's something you all might find an informative read. I did.
> Four Naming Rules That Can Help Reveal a Dog Food’s True Meat Content


maybe im misunderstanding this, but it seems they are i nfavor of the 25 percent rule...even the 25 percent rule seems bad at best case and horrible at worst case.

for ''beef dinner'' it is 25 percent beef..whihc is bery low.

for ''beef and rice dinner'' it is 22 percent rice, 3 percent beef

haha originally i wrote beef and lamb instead of beef and rice hahah lamb is always paired with rice i think of it as a grain


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## Cliffdog (Dec 30, 2010)

I'm not certain, but I believe the ingredients in the title must be in order of the weight of the ingredients, therefor it'd need to be at least 13% beef and 12% rice to be called Beef and Rice Dinner. Now it doesn't mention that on the page so I'm not positive it's true, but that's the way it is for the 95% rule.


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