# Needs to Gain Weight!



## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

My boy who has been showing for the past few months is back home and is being transitioned from a diet of kibble + premade raw to a PMR diet. He is doing excellent! Now, he is too thin for my liking and needs to gain weight. That said, I'm feeding him 2.5 pounds daily and he weighs maybe 45 -50 lbs? (My spayed girl who is his size only eats 14-16 oz daily!!) I can feel his spine and his hip bones. I think that a lot of this is that he is an intact, adolescent male (13 months) with LOTS of hormones and LOTS of energy. He also has a very refined physical build. 

Right now in his PMR transition, he is eating chicken quarters, boneless chicken and tripe (lamb, beef and bison). He got his first boneless meal the other day. I gave him a little chunker of beef heart last night with his chicken quarter, but he's definitely not ready to transition to meals of beef heart yet. I do add salmon oil to his food.

I know that he *should* gain weight as he is transitioned to all of the proteins and when I am then able to feed lots of fattier cuts. However, until then, any advice on keeping weight on him? 

Finally, when I picked him up from his handler they asked if I had some dry food for him when he got home. I explained that I don't feed kibble at all when they are home, just raw.  She told me to be careful because they can get really skinny eating an all raw diet. Now, I found this quite interesting because my other two have been eating PMR for over a year. They have GAINED weight since being on raw. This made me wonder if a lot of her raw feeding clients were feeding a BARF version with lots of veggies? With the PMR diet I feed, I can't believe dogs would have trouble keeping weight! Also, I want to note that my boy was this thin when I picked him up - he has not gotten thin since being on PMR. And, I know that they were trying to keep weight on him too, because a dog that is out of shape and too thin does NOT do well in the show ring! They should be lean, but not too skinny.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

Murphy thinned out considerably on PMR.


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Once he has done well on the chicken and his poops are good, you are going to have to feed more in lbs I believe until you reach the red meat stage as this is where the dog will really be able to utilize the calories from the meat. Being that he is intact, you will have to adjust the amount that you feel he needs. Glad he is home...


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

meggels said:


> Murphy thinned out considerably on PMR.


Really? Mine got FAT fat fat! They had to go on major diets! LOL


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

BrownieM said:


> Really? Mine got FAT fat fat! They had to go on major diets! LOL


I'm not sure Murphy got past the Chicken/turkey stage


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

Yes, I should note that with my two dogs who have been eating PMR for over a year, they eat very little chicken. I feed nearly all red meat. Lots of venison, pork, alpaca, lamb and beef heart. Chicken quarters, turkey necks and lamb ribs for bone.

Tiger should be able to transition soon to red meat as he has already been eating turkey necks for dental benefits while on pre made with his handler. We can probably just skip the turkey stage! The first week he was home, I had him on a beef pure meat/bone/organ grind from My Pet Carnivore. They grind it themselves and don't add in anything else. Not one of those patties you buy at the store. So I know that he can tolerate beef to some degree! 

ETA: I've never owned an intact dog before. Is this typical, that they can eat and eat and eat and eat and never gain weight? LOL


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

Yeah, he never did.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

BrownieM said:


> Really? Mine got FAT fat fat! They had to go on major diets! LOL


Here as well. Aussie, Copper and Lucky all three gained considerably on raw.


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Intact males metabolisms are incredible, (wish mine was like that) Most intact males that I've seen have all been on the lean side.

When I got Leo at 11 months he was a scrawny, non muscular B.T, but they fed him kibble and all he wanted to do was spin and hump. 2nd day I had him he went to the vet to get neutered.


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## kady05 (Jul 29, 2011)

BrownieM said:


> ETA: I've never owned an intact dog before. Is this typical, that they can eat and eat and eat and eat and never gain weight? LOL


YES. I always laugh when people are talking about overweight dogs.. I don't think I could MAKE any of my dogs fat (or even mildy overweight) even if I tried, especially Sako! That's actually one reason why I haven't switched him to PMR yet.. worried that he'll drop weight and therefore won't do well at the shows. This is what he looks like currently:










So he's pretty lean. He's the exact same age & size (turned a year on 11/2 & is around 46-47lbs.) as your boy and still has a ton of filling out to do. I'm planning on switching him to raw in the next couple of weeks (when his kibble is gone). I'm *hoping* that he doesn't drop a lot of weight.. would LOVE if he gained some! We have a show in Feb. so we shall see.

Anyway.. with Piper, I found that once I added in more red meats, she picked weight up. I also added in satin balls to her & Sako's diet (she gets them 3x a week, Sako gets them 4-5x a week, they're a little smaller than a tennis ball) and I really think those helped her put on the last pound or two she needed to really look nice. So that may be an option for you.. I know they have oatmeal and a few other raw "no-no's" in them, but it was worth it for me because I wasn't liking how ribby she was looking for awhile there.


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Buck is awfully thin right now too. We recently had a lady dog go into heat (or so we think) and both boys lost a considerable amount of weight (although other than the weight dropping, Dude didn't react at all). Buck, being the one who reacted to the female dropped a ton of weight. You can see all of his ribs (although he has a very thin, single layer coat that shows them most of the time anyways) and his spine a bit. We bumped up the amount of food they were getting. We bumped it up by 1/4 lb for a few days then by another 1/4 lb so that they are, for now, getting a 1/2 lb extra to help them put that weight back on. I have already noticed a difference in Buck. Dude's weight just seems to fluctuate all the time. 

Since they dropped weight we have pretty much stopped feeding poultry all together. We haven't permanently eliminated it from their diet but they get so much more out of red meat that we want them to have mostly red meat to help them gain weight. Both my boys are intact and while Dude is easier to maintain, Buck's metabolism is so good that we might end up keeping him on 2 1/2 lbs. They really only need to put maybe 3 lbs back on but the red meat is definitely helping.

Gosh, Sako is gorgeous... *sigh* hahaha

***Abi, if you are reading this... Dude lost EXACTLY that 10 lbs that that crazy vet told me he needed to lose and now he looks just plain unhealthy! Hahaha. Crazy kibble vets...


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

Yeah, I've been avoiding the satin balls because I don't like the oatmeal in them. Though, I have heard there is a grain-free version. I can't really show you a photo of Tiger's body because he's got so much hair, LOL! I think I just need to get some beef and pork in his diet!


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## kady05 (Jul 29, 2011)

Dude and Bucks Mamma said:


> Gosh, Sako is gorgeous... *sigh* hahaha


Thank you  I think Sako's head might explode from all the compliments he's gotten on forums lately! 



BrownieM said:


> Yeah, I've been avoiding the satin balls because I don't like the oatmeal in them. Though, I have heard there is a grain-free version. I can't really show you a photo of Tiger's body because he's got so much hair, LOL! I think I just need to get some beef and pork in his diet!


You could probably find some way to do them grain free, I didn't look for that recipe though. FWIW, they tolerated them fine.. and they're like doggy crack LOL.


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

kady05 said:


> Thank you  I think Sako's head might explode from all the compliments he's gotten on forums lately!


Well, his looks are awfully hard to ignore! Hahaha. Your other two are lookers as well but Sako is DEFINITELY the stud of the group!

BrownieM, for the future... If you find out any tricks other than the red meat that keep weight on Tiger, aim them my way! Haha. I think you and I will be having the same weight problems with our two boys!


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## kady05 (Jul 29, 2011)

Dude and Bucks Mamma said:


> Your other two are lookers as well but Sako is DEFINITELY the stud of the group!


Literally


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Beef Heart has seriously been a life saver for us when it comes to getting weight on the dogs. We feed a little bit of it every single day to Annie, and if I run out, she starts losing weight within about a week.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

Shade plumped up considerably once I got him and started him on real meat. In fact, he's on a continuous diet.

But Rocky, he stayed thin and just slowly added weight until he's finally reached his full size and weight at 3 years (I hope). I think some boys just take a long time to fill out and mature, whether they are intact or not. Rocky was about 70 pounds at age 2 and when I next weighed him at age 3 he was 90 pounds and I really didn't notice him getting bigger. But, he's a hairy guy like Tiger so it creeps up on you and with raw it's a slow, steady growth. Tiger may not fill out for several years.


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

My intact dog definitely could eat until he died and not gain too much weight! And that said, he is lazy...lol. It seems like his metabolism is finally slowing down a small bit at age 2? I don't have to feed him quite so much. 

Why not try giving him satin balls to get the weight on him initially then try to maintain that weight w/ PMR?


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

Oh I just saw someone else suggested Satin balls and you said you wanted to avoid them b'c they have grain...well, you probably could do something without grain but not sure how great their consistency would be.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

I have found just feeding more works well to keep weight on Emmy. I think once he's through the brunt of the transition you can gauge better at what he needs every day to stay at a good weight. I would be hesitant to increase his meals now because he's doing well and you definitely don't want to take steps in the wrong direction!


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Avery is a neutered male and he eats almost 2lbs of food a day and he is just over 50lbs. I swear this dog could eat a whole cow by himself and not gain a lb. I have been slowly increasing his intake, I think I just need to be more consistent with how much food he gets per day (some days are more some are less)...


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

My intact girl eats a ton.. my neutered male doesn't gain or lose weight ever.. he's an easy keeper! Tess eats around 1lb per day, and she's barely over 10lb. A little thin for my liking, but we're getting there. I found that adding red meats helps, cutting the amount of chicken, and instead feeding poultry like duck and quail. Another thing I have been doing is buying "pork belly skin", which is basically just fat, cutting it in 2cm x 2cm cubes and feeding a couple at each meal, in addition to her normal amount.

She ate a lb of butter once, and didn't gain an ounce. I may or may not be a little jealous. :biggrin:


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

My young boy started staying a little more beefy looking when we added hearts. Maybe just chicken heart would be a start?


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

Liz said:


> My young boy started staying a little more beefy looking when we added hearts. Maybe just chicken heart would be a start?


I've already been feeding chicken gizzards, isn't that mostly heart?


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

If you get it from a grocery store it is mostly gizzards - we buy cases of just heart - chicken, turkey, pork or beef. But maybe getting straight chicken hearts would be beneficial.


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## Ania's Mommy (Feb 8, 2009)

BrownieM said:


> I've already been feeding chicken gizzards, isn't that mostly heart?


Before I started raw, I thought that gizzards were "chicken guts". So heart, liver, kidneys, etc. But I think I was confusing them with "giblets". 

A gizzard is a totally different body part. It's a muscle that helps grind down food, kind of like a secondary stomach. So, no, chicken gizzards are NOT mostly heart. They're GIZZARDS! :tongue::becky:

However, they usually sell hearts & gizzards in the same package (at least here the do). And yes, I would say that those packages typically have more hearts than gizzards in them.


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

Ania's Mommy said:


> Before I started raw, I thought that gizzards were "chicken guts". So heart, liver, kidneys, etc. But I think I was confusing them with "giblets".
> 
> A gizzard is a totally different body part. It's a muscle that helps grind down food, kind of like a secondary stomach. So, no, chicken gizzards are NOT mostly heart. They're GIZZARDS! :tongue::becky:
> 
> However, they usually sell hearts & gizzards in the same package (at least here the do). And yes, I would say that those packages typically have more hearts than gizzards in them.


Yes, that's what I meant. The packages of chicken hearts and gizzards. I have bought pure chicken hearts before and these are mostly what is in the packages of gizzards/hearts.


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## 3Musketeers (Nov 4, 2010)

I've noticed when I feed lots of pork or beef, 2 of my brats start to fatten up a bit. My Patchie on the other hand has been super lean (maybe a bit underweight) for about a year now, despite being fed twice as much on a daily basis. I don't worry about it, she's happy, active, and looking a lot better than when she was fat on kibble.
I would try out feeding more and different meats to see what helps, I tend to notice the brats lose weight on turkey for instance.


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