# I need your opinions especially if anyone is framiliar with Addisons Disease!



## KK3 (Mar 25, 2012)

Hi Everyone, I am in desperate need of all your opinions and advice!

My dog Casey was diagnosed with Addisons Disease about 4 months ago where we almost lost him. Ive been told repeatedly that It wasnt my fault but I truly feel that this disease came on because He has always been a "Picky" eater in which he would start to eat his kibble and then throw a strike and not eat for days or pick here and there. Ive always fed him the highest quality kibble but he just doesnt like it. So I have decided to start cooking for him. Ive done months of research and reading of what to do but I am still so unsure if I am doing this right. I know that the majority of you are raw feeders, but I personally can NOT stomach feeding him raw. Im a vegetarian so for me to feed him raw meat (which ive been doing) is pretty tough for me. 

So this is Caseys diet this week:

AM
3 large eggs (cooked)
2oz veggie mix (I cooked broccoli, cauliflower, carrots, zuchini, peas and green beans and brown rice)
scoop of cottage cheese or yogurt 
1/2 tsp crushed up dried egg shells

PM
7oz Raw Hamburger (80/20)---(one night I gave him 8 oz of canned salmon with bones and no egg shells)
2oz veggie mix ^
scoop of cottage cheese or yogurt
1/2 tsp egg shells


Is this balanced enough? 

Do I really need to give him organ meat and/or bones...I really think I might gag just thinking about it...

Does anyone know if there is something special I need to be aware of with Addisons Disease. My Vet tried scaring me away from cooking but I think kibble is... B.S. and refuse to give it to him.

All advice and opinions are BEYONE APPRECIATED!


<3 KK


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## Makovach (Jan 24, 2012)

Am not familiar with this disease or home cooking as I feed raw, nut I know there are people on the forum that do/ have done home cooking so maybe they will be of more help. 

What is his breed? What is his size?


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## KK3 (Mar 25, 2012)

He is a bonafide Mutt...no one really knows what he is...some sort of bird dog, maybe a tiny bit of pitt bull but no definite answers. 
He is 48 Lbs, perfect balance of active couch potato and has some severe allergies, but the vet really thinks they are outdoor/environmental allergies because he doesnt have stomach upset or itchy paws. Just really red skin and his fur is dry.


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## twoisplenty (Nov 12, 2008)

Are you puréeing the veggies? If not there is really no point in feeding them, Dogs can not digest vegetable matter. Even when puréed they are getting minimal nutrients from them. There are several raw feeders on this site that are also vegetarian, its about putting your beliefs to the side and feeding whats best for you pet.

I personally do not feed veggies or any dairy product as dogs are lactose intolerant. If you dont like the thought of feeding bones, then you need to purchase some powdered bone meal. Organs are required, plain and simple. You already seem to be feeding some items raw, its just about getting you comfortable feeding everything raw including the eggs


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## KK3 (Mar 25, 2012)

@twoisplenty... yes I pureed the veggies, cooked then pureed... I always thought raw eggs were good but then I read a few places that they can be toxic. I dont really have a belief in meat eating, I eat it here and there, It just grosses me out lol... it sounds weird but what can I tell ya.


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## werecatrising (Oct 15, 2010)

Quinn is an atypical addisonian. I know it is hard not to blame yourself but the signs with these dogs are so vague.

I now feed raw but when I started here I was feeding a home cooked diet. There is a thread in this section on crock pot food.Maybe read through that and get some ideas.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

I'm pretty sure you probably need some oils in there, especially for the skin. Omega 3 oils are very important. if you give the canned salmon on a regular basis, make sure it is low in salt. 

Also, I wouldn't give the hamburger. Ground meat is exposed to alot more bacteria than non-ground. And, I believe dogs with Addison's might need a lower amount of purine and uric acid. Red meat is higher in those than white meat like chicken or turkey. 

I really think BARF feeders can give you better advice than raw feeders. I'd tell you the cottage cheese, yogurt, veggies are of no help. Egg shells give a certain amount of calcium but his diet is so veggie/dairy based it's hard to tell if it's enough and it looks like he's getting alot of phosphorus.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

KK3 said:


> Hi Everyone, I am in desperate need of all your opinions and advice!
> 
> My dog Casey was diagnosed with Addisons Disease about 4 months ago where we almost lost him. Ive been told repeatedly that It wasnt my fault but I truly feel that this disease came on because He has always been a "Picky" eater in which he would start to eat his kibble and then throw a strike and not eat for days or pick here and there. Ive always fed him the highest quality kibble but he just doesnt like it. So I have decided to start cooking for him. Ive done months of research and reading of what to do but I am still so unsure if I am doing this right. I know that the majority of you are raw feeders, but I personally can NOT stomach feeding him raw. Im a vegetarian so for me to feed him raw meat (which ive been doing) is pretty tough for me.


Addison's Disease is just something that happens with some dogs. There are different types of the disease....do you know which one he has? 

Don't blame yourself, it doesn't do any good. What you can do is take care of him now that you DO know what the issue is. 



> So this is Caseys diet this week:


I'm going to pick it apart a bit and give you some feed back. 



> AM
> 3 large eggs (cooked)


Feed them raw. Shells and all. People worry about a biotin deficiency if you feed raw eggs, but there is plenty of other biotin sources you can easily feed to make up the difference. Other than that, raw eggs are perfectly safe and healthy to feed to dog. 



> 2oz veggie mix (I cooked broccoli, cauliflower, carrots, zuchini, peas and green beans and brown rice)


Broccoli and cauliflower are both irritating to the bowel and can cause massive amounts of gas....yucky. 

Cooking veggies actually decreases their nutritional value greatly...so, keep that in mind. I would recommend leaving them raw, but still pureeing them to make them bioavailable to your dog. 

Brown rice is a grain....grains aren't ideal. I'd cut these out and replace it with either more egg shells or bone meal for that bulk/fiber aspect. Because that's all that rice is good for with dogs...adding bulk to stools to keep them firm. 



> scoop of cottage cheese or yogurt


Dogs are lactose intolerant...so these can cause digestive upset.



> 1/2 tsp crushed up dried egg shells


This isn't a whole lot of egg shell. Unless you have a small dog, I would add more especially if you cut out rice. 




> PM
> 7oz Raw Hamburger (80/20)---(one night I gave him 8 oz of canned salmon with bones and no egg shells)


Ground meats harbor more bacteria than whole chunks of meat. Increased amounts of bacteria can digestive upset and can be more taxing on the body if things are compromised...like in his case. 

Canned salmon is alright, just make sure its no sodium added because most canned fishes have salt added.

I would instead at least start out feeding whole cuts of meat, or chunks of meat instead of ground. Feed ground meats sparingly as they are not ideal. Also feed a variety of different meats instead of just beef. Variety is the spice of life...




> Is this balanced enough?


Honestly? I have no idea. 



> Do I really need to give him organ meat and/or bones...I really think I might gag just thinking about it...


You don't NEED to. I personally think its best...but you have to do what you're comfortable doing. If doing a home cooked/prepared diet is what you're comfortable doing then do just that! Just keep in mind that dogs are carnivores and thrive when eating a carnivores diet. 



> Does anyone know if there is something special I need to be aware of with Addisons Disease. My Vet tried scaring me away from cooking but I think kibble is... B.S. and refuse to give it to him.


I think you've made your first best decision with refusing kibble. That's a HUGE step in the right direction. Your vet probably doesn't know much about home cooked stuff other than the stuff they were taught about how "imbalanced" they all are in school.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I'm a vegetarian (almost 6 years now) and I am better at slicing up and handling raw meat than most of my omnivorous friends now that I've been feeding raw for almost 4 years. It's just something you get over for the better health of your pets. 

Having said that, I agree with everything DaneMama broke down for you above and what everyone else said, especially about using red meat. Start with chicken or turkey, it's gonna be way easier on his digestive system. I'd highly recommend getting some more organ meat in there, at least liver, preferably some heart too. As DaneMama also said, cut out the cruciferous vegetables since they are notoriously harder on the system and cause gas. Try adding in more nutrient-dense veggies like spinach to your current mix. Also, as was previously mentioned, omega 3s are great. Just a squirt or two of salmon oil should do the trick. And get rid of the dairy.


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## KK3 (Mar 25, 2012)

Wow...Thank you all so much for your responses! I didnt think I would get so many so quickly! 

I do not know which type of Addisons he has, how would I know? He went into crissis and takes 6 fludrocortisone pills every day...which is typically more than he should.

Where do I find no sodium added canned salmon? Is there a better cut of chicken? white or dark? Is it ok to give that raw? is it really that much worse to cook the meat for the him? 

I was reading the dogaware.com and it states to give 1/2 tsp per lb of food every day and he gets a lb...so more is ok? are there some good vitamins that I could give him just in case his diet isnt really balanced? read at dogaware that if you give fish oil you need to give vitamin E because they will become deficient.

If I give him liver how often should I give it to him and how should I prepare it. Is there something I should look for?


Man I thought I kind had a handle on this! I feel like I am throwing it all out the door now! LOL


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## twoisplenty (Nov 12, 2008)

If you choose a raw PMR diet over that of a home cooked diet, here is a great site that will answer all of your questions and explain the transition step by step How to Get Started | Prey Model Raw It just so happens this is Danemama's site 

If you are looking for a Barf style diet (includes fruits, veggies, dairy) Here is their website BARF Diet - Healthy & Natural Raw Food For Dogs & Cats, Pet Health Care Food & Nutrition Products Supply Online

I would love to see a picture of Casey


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Well, cooking destroys or alters most of the nutrients. In dry dog food it is added back artificially. So if you cook the meat, you'll need to feed him a whole bunch of other stuff. 

It's hard for me to find canned fish that doesn't have salt in it. You an also look for sardines with no salt. I think natural food places are more likely to have them but surprisingly I have found sardines at lower end places like Big Lots. Or, some groceries stores have an "organic" section and at Kroger I found salmon in that section. If you have a place to buy real fish that is best - sardines, herring, mackeral - all are good. But they will need to be fed raw.

Dark meats have more nutrients but they also have more fat. I wonder if, having Addison's, your dog shouldn't have so much fat. 

How big is he? if he's small a chicken wing would be great to feed him. If he's larger, maybe a chicken quarter. The amount and even the cut of meat depends on the weight of the dog. Don't feed any liver right now, it's very rich and his stomach couldn't handle it.

There are also pre-mixed raw foods. They are quite expensive but your handling of raw meats would not be so much. And books - I can't recommend any because I haven't read them, but here is a book that has raw and home-cooked alternatives with a section on feeding for Addisons
Optimal Nutrition - Raw and Cooked Canine Diets by Monica Segal-Books

i started out wanting to cook for my dogs. It's way, way more complicated than raw because you have to have so much more stuff since you're cooking out nutrients. It was totally overwhelming to me. Raw is actually very simple, if you can get over your queasiness.


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## KK3 (Mar 25, 2012)

Here is Casey John! Yes he has a middle name...I consider him my "first born"


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Aw. He is adorable. he looks like different dogs in each photo! i wish my dogs would get on a floatie like that.


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## dooneygirl09 (Mar 9, 2012)

If you are going the raw way, I would introduce meats slowly. Like you are doing hamburger and salmon, i would just stick with the hamburger for now till he can get a feel for it. I am NOT an expert, but have been learning some great things here from everyone. Raw is a very beneficial thing. I know you probably already know, but dogs arent vegetarians lol, meat is the best thing you can do for them. Ask questions, get in on some conversations, read, read, read. Raw is a giant leap, but once you start, its simple. It really is. And what I was afraid of is that the raw would be SOOOO expensive. But I literally have spent less this month on raw than I would have one 3 different types of dog food for each of my dogs. You always want to do whats best for your dogs, because they ALWAYS do whats best for you (at least they think.) Im not telling you to go either way, but I have seen great things come out of raw.

Good luck either way you go


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## KK3 (Mar 25, 2012)

@xellil:Thank you so much! I know im bias but I think hes perfect! Hes sucha ham for the camera too...ill try and dig more pics up and attach them!!!

@dooneygirl09: Im gonna try my hardest to feed him raw, im just nervous.


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## dooneygirl09 (Mar 9, 2012)

If you get over your quezzies (sometimes I get them myself) its very rewarding! And its pretty cool to see them eat. But dont do it until you are 100% ready! Its kind of a mind set you have to be in! lol But good luck! I have a picky eater too. Pekingese are horrible at it. But even now Vegas likes it! Oh , listen to me. Going on and on. Im just excited lol!


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## Roo (Oct 17, 2010)

I'm curious about the eggshells and feeding raw, eggshells are calcium carbonate, which is used as an antacid as well as a calcium source. I wouldn't think you'd want to lower the stomach acid when feeding raw meat. I've read that dogs don't get as much calcium out of whole eggshells that they crunch up, as they do finely ground eggshells that people use as a calcium supplement, so maybe that makes a difference, I don't know. I do feed raw eggs on occasion, only one of my dogs will eat the shell, he's never had an issue with it and eating his raw diet.


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## Milburn (Jan 5, 2013)

Ground beef is revealed to much more parasites than non-ground. And, I believe pets with Addison's might need a lower amount of purine and the crystals. Red beef is higher in those than white beef like poultry or poultry.


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## Foodie (Apr 25, 2010)

KK3 said:


> Hi Everyone, I am in desperate need of all your opinions and advice!
> 
> My dog Casey was diagnosed with Addisons Disease about 4 months ago where we almost lost him. Ive been told repeatedly that It wasnt my fault but I truly feel that this disease came on because He has always been a "Picky" eater in which he would start to eat his kibble and then throw a strike and not eat for days or pick here and there. Ive always fed him the highest quality kibble but he just doesnt like it. So I have decided to start cooking for him. Ive done months of research and reading of what to do but I am still so unsure if I am doing this right. I know that the majority of you are raw feeders, but I personally can NOT stomach feeding him raw. Im a vegetarian so for me to feed him raw meat (which ive been doing) is pretty tough for me.
> 
> ...


I am very familiar with Addison's Disease and feeding him kibble did NOT cause it. Dogs with AD very often don't eat well prior to diagnosis and treatment, it wouldn't have mattered if he was on a raw diet. As his disease was advancing and just prior to his diagnosis you might have tried to feed him all of his favorite foods and he probably wouldn't eat them. Vomiting and diarrhea can also be a symptom. Once his Addison's is stable and well controlled by medication he shouldn't have any problems accepting whatever you decide to feed him. Is he considered stable yet? Have you tried feeding him his regular food?

The type of Addison's he has doesn't matter as the treatment is the same. There are two treatments available and the one you select might make a difference on how well he's controlled. What is the reason you decided on fludrocortisone? It's much easier to regulate and control AD with a monthly injection of Percortin. Usually a small amount of prednisone is also given with this treatment. If he's still having trouble with appetite then I would say he probably doesn't have control over his disease.


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## Herzo (Feb 5, 2011)

Foodie I don't think you'll get your answer this is an old thread. Don't think kk3 is on here any longer.


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## Foodie (Apr 25, 2010)

LOL, thanks, I didn't notice this was an older posting.


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## Herzo (Feb 5, 2011)

You bet< I just posted in another because the same poster has brought up another old thread. I'm thinking spammer. I think I'll report. I didn't notice them in Introductions section.


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## jerrypardue (Jan 4, 2013)

One of the valuable things that the dog food industry has done is to publish various and many dog food profiles as to a canine need for protein, fat, fiber, vitamins, minerals, etc. The profiles printed on most dog foods reflect the findings of AFFCO which sets standards for dog food nutrition. Please keep these in mind when you are putting together a combination of meat, vegetables, and other nutrients to feed your beloved canine or your health challenged dog.


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## jerrypardue (Jan 4, 2013)

Addison's Disease can be caused by an ineffective adrenal system or by disease so anything that you may or may not have done during your dog's life may have absolutely nothing to do with it's present condition. Looking at your present menu, ground flax seed may be of some help for a number of nutritional reasons including the presence of Omega 3 fatty acids and added energy to your dog's diet to get it off the couch.


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## Roo (Oct 17, 2010)

> One of the valuable things that the dog food industry has done is to publish various and many dog food profiles as to a canine need for protein, fat, fiber, vitamins, minerals, etc. The profiles printed on most dog foods reflect the findings of AFFCO which sets standards for dog food nutrition. Please keep these in mind when you are putting together a combination of meat, vegetables, and other nutrients to feed your beloved canine or your health challenged dog.


The NRC actually set the standards for dog nutrition, AFFCO, use to use their numbers, but then decided to set their own standards for commercial food use to reflect manufacturing processes not included in NRC's numbers. If feeding a homemade diet, it would probably make mores sense to look at NRC numbers over AFFCO because you'd probably be using whole foods, not processed, so no manufacturing processes to consider.


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## jerrypardue (Jan 4, 2013)

It may make more sense to you or to the NRC but does it make more sense to the dog. The fact is that when it comes to dog nutrition, what the NRC or AFFCO sets as the standard(which is usually the absolute minimum plus 10 to 20 per cent) is of no particular consequence. Many phases of nutrient fortification operate on one principle, increased fortification equals increased performance. There are numerous lifestyles of canine animals and those lifestyles represent different nutritional profiles. In actuality, the mineral needs of a dog that is in a growth and maintenance mode is about three fourths or four fifths less than a canine in reproductive mode. How does one single feeding program address that? Also, geography can enter into mineral nutrition and that has absolutely nothing to do with the NRC or AFFCO.


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## Roo (Oct 17, 2010)

> It may make more sense to you or to the NRC but does it make more sense to the dog. The fact is that when it comes to dog nutrition, what the NRC or AFFCO sets as the standard(which is usually the absolute minimum plus 10 to 20 per cent) is of no particular consequence. Many phases of nutrient fortification operate on one principle, increased fortification equals increased performance. There are numerous lifestyles of canine animals and those lifestyles represent different nutritional profiles. In actuality, the mineral needs of a dog that is in a growth and maintenance mode is about three fourths or four fifths less than a canine in reproductive mode. How does one single feeding program address that? Also, geography can enter into mineral nutrition and that has absolutely nothing to do with the NRC or AFFCO.


If it's of _"no particular consequence"_, why did you suggest to _"keep AFFCO's nutrient profile in mind when you are putting together a combination of meat, vegetables, and other nutrients to feed your beloved canine or your health challenged dog."_ ? 

Yes dogs need different nutrient profiles, for example the NRC has profiles for more than just the adult dog, and of course taking into consideration other factors like health issues, weight, metabolism, geography, could theoretically be figured out, if one want's to create a diet in that manner.


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## jerrypardue (Jan 4, 2013)

I did not say that the NRC profiles are wrong, just inadequate for many lifestyles. Those parts that make up the nutrient profile are important and should be kept in mind when putting together a "custom" diet, particularly as it pertains to MDR. Also, most feed companies do not differentiate as to lifestyles when it comes to micro-ingredients. A senior diet usually has slightly higher fiber and sometimes more protein. The increased protein is a help because older dogs are often losing muscle and bone mass and higher protein levels address that. They do not however, increase trace mineral fortification which can be a problem in that when a dog passes the 5-6 year age, they lose almost half their ability to metabolize trace minerals, almost all mono-gastric animals do. Also, their gut bacteria population is probably decreasing and may need a boost. Some senior products address that situation with yeast and or probiotics and some do not. What I am saying is there is no general rule that you can follow. Nutrition is a serious matter in dogs and all animals and generally, there is a lot of information out there from AFFCO and the NRC however, they represent feed companies and sometimes they look at what is manufacturer friendly and not individual dog oriented.


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## jerrypardue (Jan 4, 2013)

Cooking does not alter or destroy all ingredients. It has no effect on minerals which after all, are rocks, ground up to a supposedly digestible form and size. Heat can damage vitamins so maybe the best idea if you are cooking you pet's ration at home is to add the vitamin/mineral supplement after cooking or separate from cooking. Notice I said when you add the vitamin/mineral supplement not when you add the vitamin/mineral supplement because if you have a dog under some form of health stress or is under-conditioned, they most likely need a vitamin mineral supplement.


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## Roo (Oct 17, 2010)

I think you and I are on a different page here Jerry, I'm referring to using NRC numbers to compare nutrient profile of a diet, making sure a diet is in the correct range for balance (taking into consideration health issues etc. if need be and customizing) for homemade diets, you seem to be referring to commercial processed diets and their inadequacy with being customizable. I don't think the NRC numbers represent the feed companies, because some of their requirements were established in studies where the nutrients were supplied as pure ingredients, with no processing interactions as what takes place with manufactured dog foods, hence why AFFCO decided to do their own nutrient profile. Which is what I talked about in my first post and why I recommended referring to NRC numbers over referring to AFFCO.

I agree, if feeding home cooked you do need to supplement, more than with a homemade raw type of diet. Heat (depending on temp) can also damage enzymes, certain sulphur-containing amino acids, and certain antioxidants, along with some vitamins. 



> Notice I said when you add the vitamin/mineral supplement not when you add the vitamin/mineral supplement


This part was a little confusing to me...


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