# I have a difficult decision to make



## IslandPaws4Raw (Sep 7, 2011)

I hoped this day would never come, but I'm not sure if the PMR diet is feasible for my guys anymore. In light of the discussions lately on a properly balanced diet, I have had to put some serious thought into whether I am able to provide my guys with a balanced diet. And sadly the answer is probably....no.

I'm sure you guys are feeling the effects of rising meat prices in the U.S. Transfer that across the water and it's 5 times worse. Over the last few weeks I have seen the prices skyrocket, and every time I step foot in the grocery store now I get more and more depressed. I was getting end cut pork chops for $2.49 lb, now they are $3.99. Same for pork ribs and the cheapest roasts. Forget about beef.......

I just know that chicken,ground turkey, sardines and eggs do not make up a balanced diet.

Add that to the fact that I have had resistance from the start from my hubby :frown: So now I really can't justify spending between $4-$5 a day on food depending on what I buy. I would need almost 3lbs of meat a day since the addition of Layla.

So I am trying to weigh my options, because no matter what, they will get at the least a 50/50 diet.

I am going to order the beef HK to see if Kai can tolerate it, and to be able to offer beef at all to the others.

ETA: I should have put this in the Canned/Dry Food Section
There is a kibble that is available in our grocery store that seems pretty good, so I wanted to get your opinion on it. I already have Layla 50/50 on this food (hubby insisted)

Holistic Health Extension Grain Free
Ingredients

Organic Chicken, Chicken Meal, Deboned Turkey, Turkey Meal, Potatoes, Chickpeas, Chicken Fat (Naturally Preserved with Mixed Tocopherols), Fresh Whole Sweet Potatoes, Alfalfa Sprouts, Pumpkin, Pea Fiber, Fresh Whole Carrots, Dulse, Sea Salt, Whole Blueberries, Whole Cranberries, Potassium Chloride, Spinach, Tomato, Beets, Parsley, Chicory Root Extract, Sage, Basil, Apple Cider Vinegar, Green Tea Extract, DHA, Ginger, Primrose Oil, Glucosamine, Chondroitin, Colostrum, Blue Green Algae, Dl Methionine, Vitamin A Acetate, Vitamin E Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement, Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Coral Calcium, Vitamin D, Magnesium, Niacin Supplement, Choline chloride, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Folic Acid, Vitamin C, Biotin, Inositol, Omega 3 / Omega 6 Oils, Polysaccharide Complexes of Zinc, Iron, Manganese, Copper and Cobalt, Calcium lodate, Sodium Selenite, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Pectin, Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product Dehydrated, Lactobacillus Casei, Enterococcus Faecium Fermentation Product Dehydrated, B. Subtillus, Bacillus Lichenformis, Bacillus Coagulins, Aspergillus Oryzae and Aspergillus Niger

How important are ingredients? Check out our Ingredient Index.
Nutritional Information

405 KCal/cup
3565 KCal/kg
Guaranteed Analysis

Crude Protein, Not Less Than
27%
Crude Fat, Not Less Than
18%
Vitamin E, Not Less Than
150IU
Phosphorus, Not Less Than
1.0%
Omega 3 Fatty Acids, Not Less Than
0.5%
Glucosamine HCL, Not Less Than
400mg/kg

Crude Fiber, Not More Than
5%
Moisture, Not More Than
10%
Calcium, Not Less Than
1.20%
Omega 6 Fatty Acids, Not Less Than
2.5%
Chondroitin Sulfate, Not Less Than
200mg/kg

But I'm not sure if this or the HK is the better choice. For me I would rather stick to the HK than feed kibble.
I'm going to compromise with the hubby for now, but my goal will be to get them back to PMR as soon as possible

Thanks for your ideas/opinions


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i read your post twice, thinking i could come up with some glib answer for you.

but the truth is, i've only visited the bahamas. i've not lived there nor have i tried to feed my dogs raw.

i did want to wish you well...sometimes things don't go as we plan or desire.....

just don't beat yourself up....

finances are a fact of life.....and we all do what we can. i know you love your dogs.....

i'm sure someone better versed in kibble ingredients will come along to help you pick out an appropriate kibble...

and in your heart, you're one of us...so it's fine that you posted here.

most of us, at one time or another, fed kibble....so i'm sure there are plenty of knowledgeable raw feeders who can steer you in the direction you need to be.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

You shouldn't feel bad. You've posted prices before and they are so sky high I wonder how people manage unless they are rich or own a five pound dog. 

Maybe you could feed them bones for their teeth, along with the dry food.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

I can understand things being much pricier on the islands. We've spent a lot of time in the Bahamas and know how expensive things are. I remember seeing a red bell pepper for $5 once. 

The kibble you've listed looks pretty darn good. Lots of dogs do well on mixed raw and kibble diets. Don't feel bad about that because you know for a fact that you'd feed raw if money wasn't an issue.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

Dont feel bad, you are doing the best you can, the kibble looks decent and you can always supplement with some meat or canned fish for variety.


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

The kibble looks good and I would maybe try to get a case of turkey neck or ribs or something to at least help keep their teeth clean. I can't imagine paying those prices and I would be having to feed kibble also and just give raw for dental health or as an extra. I am sorry you are in this position. It is very difficult. It is a beautiful place to live but unfortunately very expensive.:grouphug:


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## IslandPaws4Raw (Sep 7, 2011)

magicre said:


> i read your post twice, thinking i could come up with some glib answer for you.


What you mean you can't swoop in on a yacht with a large cooler with enough meat to last a year?????? Oh no...wait..... that would be Natalie and Jon




> Unosmom
> 
> Dont feel bad, you are doing the best you can, the kibble looks decent and you can always supplement with some meat or canned fish for variety.



I'm glad I chose a decent kibble...I was actually shocked they had such a thing in stock on a regular basis.The owner's son feeds this to his dogs, so that explains them having a decent kibble on the shelf. I will definitely keep up with giving them RMB's, the beef ribs are the best value at under $3 lb. Along with one raw meal a day 

In the meantime I am working on a future action plan for getting my guys the food they deserve. And I'm not going to disappear.....I enjoy this forum way too much :grouphug: and you guys have been so supportive


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i looked for it, but my magic wand is in the shop.


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## shellbell (Sep 24, 2011)

Oh I can only imagine how hard it would be to feed raw in the Caribbean. I'm sure you don't have access to game meat, and that is the majority of what I feed (venison), plus I know people who butcher...


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

IslandPaws4Raw said:


> And I'm not going to disappear.....


You had better not disappear missy, I, for one, will be really, really annoyed if you do. 
To be honest, I often wondered how you could afford to feed raw, but decided you must be independently wealthy. Or, you were a rich mans plaything. 
But, I'd give up almost anything to live where you do, it's as close to paradise as you can get.
Whenever we were meant to leave Fl and go over, friends there were always asking us to bring vast quantities of mainly paper towels and beer, it's a price sticker shock for us spoilt so and so's back here, thats for sure.
So what, you have to go back to kibble, your pup's are still being fed better than 95% of the dogs in the world, I wouldn't stress about it at all. Now, if you had decided to go with Pedigree, there would have been a posse sent out to hunt you down, but you are safe for now!
Just make sure you still stick around, with periodic photo's, ok?


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## IslandPaws4Raw (Sep 7, 2011)

MollyWoppy said:


> You had better not disappear missy, I, for one, will be really, really annoyed if you do.
> To be honest, I often wondered how you could afford to feed raw, but decided you must be independently wealthy. Or, you were a rich mans plaything.
> But, I'd give up almost anything to live where you do, it's as close to paradise as you can get.
> Whenever we were meant to leave Fl and go over, friends there were always asking us to bring vast quantities of mainly paper towels and beer, it's a price sticker shock for us spoilt so and so's back here, thats for sure.
> ...


ound: OMG Penny! You just made my day.......rich man's plaything :madgrin: don't I wish....... then I would have a couple horses as well as a freezer full of buffalo. Pedigree indeed.......I would fully expect a lynch mob for that one


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## wolfsnaps88 (Jan 2, 2012)

Sorry to hear but I totally understand. I made the decision to only feed my smallest raw. I have been getting guilt tripped by my other dogs. Doesn't mean in the future, we can't go back to raw. Times are just tough right now and we have to manage until things get a little better, that's all. The kibble you have looks excellent though. Let us know how they do on it. Just because someone doesn't feed their dogs raw doesn't mean the dog will keel over dead. 

The bahamas.....oh one can dream......


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I know many of us have been in this position unfortunately. I know I went through a period where I couldn't afford to feed the dogs more than chicken leg quarters and liver every other week. I'm lucky now that I've got a better-paying job and am more stable in my life, but I would've gone back to kibble if I had to so I don't blame you in the slightest, especially with prices like that! You will do the best you can for your pets and that's all they ask of us :smile:

That kibble looks pretty darn good, I think your pups will do great on it!


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## JayJayisme (Aug 2, 2009)

If I were in your shoes, I'd feed "chicken, ground turkey, sardines and eggs" as you stated. I still think that is better than any kibble by far. Add some offal now and then, and maybe a beef rib or pork every once in awhile when you can score a deal. 

I think a lot of folks here confuse "balanced diet" with "variety". It's a natural human thing to do, after all, "variety is the spice of life", right? But in reality, most dogs in the wild don't get much variety at all. They live in certain areas where the prey they have access to is usually predominate, so that is what they usually eat (such as rabbits). Even primitive humans had a similar situation. They ate what was available where they were, which rarely afforded much variety. There were no supermarkets full of exotic or imported foods. That is a modern concept. Still, they somehow achieved balance. 

The whole "balanced diet" thing that everyone worries about is a product of the pet food manufacturing consortium, and is designed to allow them to justify the myriad of useless ingredients in their products all in the name of a "balanced diet". But the reality is that carnivores need very little variety to achieve balance in their diet. There are many raw feeders who are successful on nothing other than chicken. I say stick with "chicken, ground turkey, sardines and eggs" and enjoy your dog's good health!


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Really, my guys only get chicken, beef heart, liver and kidney. We go for variety when we can but there aren't things on sale very often. I can't imagine feeding kibble again but if I were to face your decision I would do the same as you. Don't feel bad. They will still be getting one raw meal every day!


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## Cliffdog (Dec 30, 2010)

I'm sorry you're going through this tough time.  If I was you I'd switch to kibble and just add RMBs once a week or so for dental health. You do what you can... nobody can expect more than that.


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## IslandPaws4Raw (Sep 7, 2011)

JayJayisme said:


> If I were in your shoes, I'd feed "chicken, ground turkey, sardines and eggs" as you stated. I still think that is better than any kibble by far. Add some offal now and then, and maybe a beef rib or pork every once in awhile when you can score a deal.
> 
> I think a lot of folks here confuse "balanced diet" with "variety". It's a natural human thing to do, after all, "variety is the spice of life", right? But in reality, most dogs in the wild don't get much variety at all. They live in certain areas where the prey they have access to is usually predominate, so that is what they usually eat (such as rabbits). Even primitive humans had a similar situation. They ate what was available where they were, which rarely afforded much variety. There were no supermarkets full of exotic or imported foods. That is a modern concept. Still, they somehow achieved balance.
> 
> The whole "balanced diet" thing that everyone worries about is a product of the pet food manufacturing consortium, and is designed to allow them to justify the myriad of useless ingredients in their products all in the name of a "balanced diet". But the reality is that carnivores need very little variety to achieve balance in their diet. There are many raw feeders who are successful on nothing other than chicken. I say stick with "chicken, ground turkey, sardines and eggs" and enjoy your dog's good health!


So true JayJay. I wasn't at all worried about the "balanced diet thing" until those pork prices went through the roof. I need at least one main meat choice other than poultry, because Ari will start to get itchy eating chicken every day. I am looking into working with a meat supplier in Miami to bring in my own cheap cuts of meat. Stuff like cushion pork roasts, heart, beef heart, cheek meat etc. If I could get bulk items at under $1 lb over there I think I could ship it in myself at a cost I can manage. I just have to get that freezer now if I can make this option attractive to the hubby.


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

Shipping in meat did cross my mind, but you'd have to get it a a really low base price to make it work. Hopefully you can......good luck!


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## Bluey (Nov 16, 2011)

My dog did just fine doing 1/2 raw and 1/2 high end kibble. Even if you can do some RMB every once in awhile, you are still giving them a treat. You do what you can. Things may change 6 months to a year from now. Ba gillions of dogs have done just great w/ kibble all these years. It is what it is.


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