# Raw Diet



## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

Hello. I am new to the whole raw diet thing. I had a few questions. Right now I am transitioning my dog to raw. I will be feeding him Primal Raw Dog Food. What are the benefits of raw, and when he is on raw, can I change formulas without transitioning?


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## JayJayisme (Aug 2, 2009)

Congrats on your decision but this forum is mostly dedicated to the prey model raw diet, where we feed whole animal parts, not commercially prepared pet food (whether raw or not). You might post your question to this forum where people have more experience with commercial raw pet food products.

BARF and Alternative Feeding


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

I responded in your other thread to make sure the Primal you'll be feeing is complete & balanced as some of theirs are for supplemental feeding.

I do disagree with JayJayisme; I don't this forum is dedicated to prey model only, I've seen others come here with pre made raw questions. I can't imagine where else you'd go; I don't think I've seen forums dedicated to pre mades. JMO.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Most raw feeders here feed feed prey model, while a few do feed some pre made. Pre made doesn't have the dental benefits of prey model by no means, and it is still commercial. Look closely at the ingredients, since some do add more ingredients than what is really needed, but at the same time I still feel it's better than kibble.


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## JayJayisme (Aug 2, 2009)

InkedMarie said:


> I do disagree with JayJayisme; I don't this forum is dedicated to prey model only, I've seen others come here with pre made raw questions. I can't imagine where else you'd go; I don't think I've seen forums dedicated to pre mades. JMO.


I put a link to the "BARF and Alternative Feeding" forum in the post above specifically to point the OP to the correct forum. If you "can't imagine where else you'd go", click on the link. I don't know how long you've been active here but the "BARF and Alternative Feeding" forum was created specifically for those feeding commercial/ground/other-than-PMR raw diets. I figured the OP would just get more helpful information there from others using that or similar products than they would get from us PMR feeders.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

if you are going to feed a pre made and only have one dog, i would recommend darwins pet food. you can google it.

having said that, dogs need to be transitioned from kibble to raw, be it prey model or pre made or barf.

may i ask why you are going with a pre made?


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## Celt (Dec 27, 2010)

Most raw diets have the benefit of smaller stool. Depending on your premade (i don't really know about primal), body condition and coats can show improvements. Most dogs, i know, prefer a raw diet over kibble which can help with picky eaters. Feeding a premade raw, doesn't offer the dental benefits found in chewing bone-in meals but this can be addressed by giving recreational bones or switching in bone-in meal for a premade one. Depending on what is in the ingredients list, you may or maynot be feeding a meat only diet. You do need to make sure that you premade is a complete diet (not having veggies/fruits listed doesn't make it incomplete). Meat only premades need to have the "whole animal" in the ingredients list (i.e. meat, organ and bone) not just the meat. I can't really answer on the transitioning, as I've never truely transitioned a dog, but I don't see where there would be a problem switching formulas.


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

JayJayisme said:


> I put a link to the "BARF and Alternative Feeding" forum in the post above specifically to point the OP to the correct forum. If you "can't imagine where else you'd go", click on the link. I don't know how long you've been active here but the "BARF and Alternative Feeding" forum was created specifically for those feeding commercial/ground/other-than-PMR raw diets. I figured the OP would just get more helpful information there from others using that or similar products than they would get from us PMR feeders.


I completely missed the link but that's not even active. I don't know how much help he'll get there.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

magicre said:


> if you are going to feed a pre made and only have one dog, i would recommend darwins pet food. you can google it.
> 
> having said that, dogs need to be transitioned from kibble to raw, be it prey model or pre made or barf.
> 
> may i ask why you are going with a pre made?


Because I don't even cook for myself haha.


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

That's the beauty of PMR, TD! No cooking. 

Step 1: Take dog to back porch, or other designated eating place.

2: Open package of meat. Hand meat to dog.

3: Put the rest of the meat in the refrigerator for the next meal, or transfer it to a ziploc baggy and put it in the freezer.

My dogs are fine with eating their meals totally frozen (more chewing work). A lot of raw feeders take something out every other day or so to thaw in the refrigerator. *No cooking necessary.*


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

tonkasdad said:


> Because I don't even cool for myself haha.


i get it. i do. 

look, there are people who swear by a prey model diet and there are people who swear by a barf diet.

if you want convenience and the benefits, or at least some of them...NOT ALL.....then darwins is your choice, in my opinion.....

plus, you will have to supplement with teeth cleaning bones.

what kind of dog? how old? how much does he weigh?

and, you really really want to consider feeding raw that you get from co ops, stores, etc.....simply because it is the most species appropriate. 

i get that you want the convenience of kibble, only raw. i get that.


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## Herzo (Feb 5, 2011)

of course I do cook for myself and 2 of my dogs at least part time but I don't see why you can't do pre made part time and give also just raw meat. It is very easy as someone else has said to just give the dog a bone. Ok I mean a chicken leg a piece of liver or pork better yet some elk steak.

Why not at least part time at least tell you get more use to it. I can certainly see why one would want to go to a pre made so it was easy.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

magicre said:


> i get it. i do.
> 
> look, there are people who swear by a prey model diet and there are people who swear by a barf diet.
> 
> ...


He's a King Charles and he's 26lbs


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

magicre said:


> i get it. i do.
> 
> look, there are people who swear by a prey model diet and there are people who swear by a barf diet.
> 
> ...


How often should I give him raw bones for his teeth?


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## smaughunter (Apr 27, 2012)

Hi! Welcome to raw!!! It is awesome! I feed Kiora primarily pmr but I have tossed a pre made meal her way now and again, I did this especially when we first started. IMO, depending on the brand somewhat, premade offers almost all the benefits pf pmr. It is fresh and bioavailable, highly digestible for dogs. You should definitely see the dfference in your dogs stool, coat, energy level and musle tone. I will say that while the majority of the time pmr doesn't take longer for me than premade it does take a few hours every other month or so when I restock my freezer to defrost, cleave, portion and label her meals. Sticking with premade would avoid this. 

I also recommend the addition of some raw meaty bones to get that dental benefit out of the raw itself. My Kiora is 22 lbs and some of the rmb I offer her are chicken necks, drumsticks or wings, pork ribs, duck necks, and occasionally I can even find lamb ribs at the store. I have found that turkey back or ribs she can handle but turkey wings and drumsticks are too much. 

I would say offering rmb 3 times a week or so should be sufficient for dental benefits. 

Congratulations! I don't think you will regret choosing raw!


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

magicre said:


> i get it. i do.
> 
> look, there are people who swear by a prey model diet and there are people who swear by a barf diet.
> 
> ...


Just wondering why is Darwin the best?


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

tonkasdad said:


> Just wondering why is Darwin the best?


I feed Darwin's, off & on. I chose it for a variety of reasons, one being that I have it in my hands 3-4 weeks after its made. You can only order from them. i get it two days after its shipped & its frozen solid. They don't use HPP either. I don't particularly like the only local store that sells frozen raw so I'd have to drive 40 min, one wAy o buy it. I sit home & it gets delivered. 

Natural, Raw Dog Food, Grain-free Dog Food - from Darwin if you're interested. They have a $14.95 intro special. They will ask you to sign up for auto delivery. You can cancel or change the amount,protein, schedule with a phone call. You can do it all on their site but I call. I change the order sometimes.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

I was curious...isn't raw chicken bad? Because of salmonella.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

Nope
All raw meat has salmonella. Your dog's gut handles the bacteria quite well.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

SuperPug said:


> Nope
> All raw meat has salmonella. Your dog's gut handles the bacteria quite well.


Reason I ask, today i had to take my dog to the vet because if bacteria infection. I tried to put my dog on primal dog food. Within 4 days of his transition he got extremely sick. He was vomiting and had diahreah. The food seemed like it was contaminated. I don't know if I shod continue on raw


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

did you fast for 24 hours?
Digestion for kibble is different than digestion for raw. It is recommended to fast for 24 hours so the digestion resets. That is what I read anyways.


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

tonkasdad said:


> I was curious...isn't raw chicken bad? Because of salmonella.


No. Dogs have digestive tracts that are designed to cope with certain bacterias that human are more vulnerable to. Example: my Annie slurped up a dead bird off the sidewalk-- no telling how long it had been there-- she crunched it right down faster than I could blink-- and she never got sick. At all.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

Fundog said:


> No. Dogs have digestive tracts that are designed to cope with certain bacterias that human are more vulnerable to. Example: my Annie slurped up a dead bird off the sidewalk-- no telling how long it had been there-- she crunched it right down faster than I could blink-- and she never got sick. At all.


I just had the mental image of a dog going "oo! Yummy! *nom glup*


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

SuperPug said:


> did you fast for 24 hours?
> Digestion for kibble is different than digestion for raw. It is recommended to fast for 24 hours so the digestion resets. That is what I read anyways.


No but I don't think that was the reason he got sick.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

tonkasdad said:


> No but I don't think that was the reason he got sick.


one of the reasons i prefer darwin.....it is the one pre made made for people who want to feed raw and still feed easily....it's a quality product....

when we first transitioned malia and bubba, they had explosive diarrhea. two reasons. they were being overfed and they happened to contract giardia at the same time.

sometimes dogs don't feel well. sometimes they are being overfed. sometimes they get a bug.

or you might have gotten a bad batch of what you fed. unlikely, but it happens.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

magicre said:


> one of the reasons i prefer darwin.....it is the one pre made made for people who want to feed raw and still feed easily....it's a quality product....
> 
> when we first transitioned malia and bubba, they had explosive diarrhea. two reasons. they were being overfed and they happened to contract giardia at the same time.
> 
> ...


That was the first time I've ever seen him that sick. He is a little better today but not 100%. It must have been the primal.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

What proteins are used in Primal? Maybe it's too rich for him right now?
I would attempt to give him some raw chicken(both bone-in/boneless) for a while. If he does well with that for a few weeks, start slowly adding in the Primal.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

SuperPug said:


> What proteins are used in Primal? Maybe it's too rich for him right now?
> I would attempt to give him some raw chicken(both bone-in/boneless) for a while. If he does well with that for a few weeks, start slowly adding in the Primal.


Chicken, Chicken Necks, Chicken Gizzards


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

tonkasdad said:


> Chicken, Chicken Necks, Chicken Gizzards


That's what's in the commercial meal? Maybe the gizzards bothered him? Typically only bone/meat is given in transition. Organ, stomach/intestines are added when the dog has been on the diet and is doing reliably well on it. Tho, I personally, wouldn't give stomach/intestines. Only organ/tripe.

What else is in the meal you've chosen? I'm trying to find what could of bothered your puppy. The possibility that he caught a random "bug" still remains, as it always will.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

SuperPug said:


> That's what's in the commercial meal? Maybe the gizzards bothered him? Typically only bone/meat is given in transition. Organ, stomach/intestines are added when the dog has been on the diet and is doing reliably well on it. Tho, I personally, wouldn't give stomach/intestines. Only organ/tripe.
> 
> What else is in the meal you've chosen? I'm trying to find what could of bothered your puppy. The possibility that he caught a random "bug" still remains, as it always will.


this is the full ingredient list..... Chicken, Chicken Necks, Chicken Gizzards, Organic Kale, Organic Carrots, Organic Yams, Chicken Livers, Organic Broccoli, Organic Apples, Cranberries, Blueberries, Organic Pumpkin Seeds, Organic Sunflower Seeds, Minerals (Zinc Sulfate, Copper Carbonate, Sodium Selenite), Organic Parsley, Organic Apple Cider Vinegar, Salmon Oil, Organic Coconut Oil, Organic Quinoa Sprout Powder, Dried Organic Kelp, Alfalfa, Natural Vitamin E.

I think it may have been contaminated or something.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

There's alot of plant matter in there. I'm worried that the plant content maybe out weighting the meat content. Personally, I wouldn't use the food.

Are you open to giving your own raw diet? All you have to do is provide the meat and veggies/fruits(if you'd like to)


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## smaughunter (Apr 27, 2012)

I agree with Super Pug, it is likely that the primal was simply too rich for him right off the bat. Not sure what the meat to bone to organ ratio is in that or the fat content but when a dog is first transitioning onto raw we usually recommend a doing boney cuts of chicken with the fat trimmed off because it is bland and with the all the bone to help firm up the stool they are less likely to have problems with diarrhea. This formula probably has too much of high meat and fat ratio along with the addition of organ meat which often can cause problems in dogs new to raw. You are right though the portion could be contaminated with something although it is important to remember that kibble often contains salmonella as well and the saliva and stomach acid to of dogs is designed to kill such contaminants. 

Don't lose hope! I would also recommend trying some bony cuts of chicken from the grocery store for a week  or so before trying the premade again with the premade. Especially if he has been on kibble for a long time it can be a longer transition period. Good luck!


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

I dont know....I was kind of thinking of trying Darwin's raw food. But I don't know if I even want to go raw anymore after what happened. Is raw better than orijen kibble?


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## smaughunter (Apr 27, 2012)

I can definitely understand your reticence after seeing your dog react so poorly to the Primal. I would encourage you though to give it another shot, not with Primal, obviously. 

Many dogs do have some trouble initially simply because their systems have forgotten how to deal with what they were designed to eat, it can take time to remember. I was pretty lucky in that Kiora has an iron stomach and was able to handle everything except for raw smelt, which gave her explosive diarrhea. 

I do believe that raw is worth the trouble though, Kiora was always in good health on very high quality kibble but on raw she just glows. In addition to the tiny stool, the amazing coat, the teeth..etc, she just has an aura of healthiness about her that she didn't have before. Personally I will never go back to kibble and I have never had the amount or confidence in any kibble that I do with raw.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

smaughunter said:


> I can definitely understand your reticence after seeing your dog react so poorly to the Primal. I would encourage you though to give it another shot, not with Primal, obviously.
> 
> Many dogs do have some trouble initially simply because their systems have forgotten how to deal with what they were designed to eat, it can take time to remember. I was pretty lucky in that Kiora has an iron stomach and was able to handle everything except for raw smelt, which gave her explosive diarrhea.
> 
> I do believe that raw is worth the trouble though, Kiora was always in good health on very high quality kibble but on raw she just glows. In addition to the tiny stool, the amazing coat, the teeth..etc, she just has an aura of healthiness about her that she didn't have before. Personally I will never go back to kibble and I have never had the amount or confidence in any kibble that I do with raw.


So if I decide to do raw again, should I do it cold turkey, as in no transition and just put him on it?


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## smaughunter (Apr 27, 2012)

That is what most do. Stop kibble entirely and just go straight into lean bony chicken. When I started Kiora on raw I remember I was not finished with my bag of kibble but was eager to get going with raw, so I started by offering alternating meals of raw and then kibble. If you want to use up what kibble you have you might want do that but it is up to you. Just remember to not feed raw and kibble together in the same meal because raw digests much faster than kibble does.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

smaughunter said:


> That is what most do. Stop kibble entirely and just go straight into lean bony chicken. When I started Kiora on raw I remember I was not finished with my bag of kibble but was eager to get going with raw, so I started by offering alternating meals of raw and then kibble. If you want to use up what kibble you have you might want do that but it is up to you. Just remember to not feed raw and kibble together in the same meal because raw digests much faster than kibble does.


Do I do that if I also get Darwins Raw food? Just do it cold turkey?


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

Going cold turkey is highly recommended because of the difference in digestion.
Give 24 hrs fasting and retry the next day. Going raw is very much worth it. But check the meat, bone/organ content. See if you can find the percentage of each meat, bone/organ. A dog that is new to raw shouldn't be getting any organ until completely switched to raw feeding. I'm in my 3rd month of Prey Model Raw and I just added organs approx 2 weeks ago.

I think it would be easier on your dog to give bone-in chicken for the next coupla weeks or so. Once poo is firm/small, start adding in the premade meal of your choice.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

SuperPug said:


> Going cold turkey is highly recommended because of the difference in digestion.
> Give 24 hrs fasting and retry the next day. Going raw is very much worth it. But check the meat, bone/organ content. See if you can find the percentage of each meat, bone/organ. A dog that is new to raw shouldn't be getting any organ until completely switched to raw feeding. I'm in my 3rd month of Prey Model Raw and I just added organs approx 2 weeks ago.
> 
> I think it would be easier on your dog to give bone-in chicken for the next coupla weeks or so. Once poo is firm/small, start adding in the premade meal of your choice.


My dog has had chicken organs before, but they were cooked.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

Cooking them takes away a lot of the rich nutrients that's in them.

Here is the nutrional info of raw chicken liver:
Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Chicken, liver, all classes, raw

Cooked, simmered
Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Chicken, liver, all classes, cooked, simmered

Cooked, pan-fried
Nutrition Facts and Analysis for Chicken, liver, all classes, cooked, pan-fried


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

SuperPug said:


> I just had the mental image of a dog going "oo! Yummy! *nom glup*


SuperPug, that's about exactly how it went, too. LOL. I didn't even have a chance to tell her to "drop it."


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

tonkasdad said:


> this is the full ingredient list..... Chicken, Chicken Necks, Chicken Gizzards, Organic Kale, Organic Carrots, Organic Yams, Chicken Livers, Organic Broccoli, Organic Apples, Cranberries, Blueberries, Organic Pumpkin Seeds, Organic Sunflower Seeds, Minerals (Zinc Sulfate, Copper Carbonate, Sodium Selenite), Organic Parsley, Organic Apple Cider Vinegar, Salmon Oil, Organic Coconut Oil, Organic Quinoa Sprout Powder, Dried Organic Kelp, Alfalfa, Natural Vitamin E.
> 
> I think it may have been contaminated or something.


Nah, all that stuff makes me poop like crazy too-- and it's supposed to be appropriate to my species! (Sorry, TMI, right?) Anyway, point is, I think all that "stuff" is too much for dogs, especially a dog just starting out on raw.


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

tonkasdad said:


> My dog has had chicken organs before, but they were cooked.


Totally different product.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

Fundog said:


> Totally different product.


Could he have gotten sick because I mixed it with his kibble?


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

You mixed the product with his kibbles?

Kibble and raw have different digestion speeds. Raw digests faster/kibble digests MUCH slower. It's not possible for his digestion to work on the pieces separately. Since he's been eating kibble, both foods likely sat for a long time in his stomach. Probably giving him issues.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

it could well have been that perfect storm. mixing raw with kibble. dog has tummy upset just because.

the ideal , in my opinion, is to take the ideal weight of your dog, feed 1.5% for the first few days to let him get used to eating raw and then go here:

Skylar, Zack, and Abby on the WEB

if you do not want to feed prey model, whatever your reasons are, i would still recommend feeding raw.

even though darwin is a barf model, it is a good product. it is the only one i ever recommend....other than Hare Today, Gone Tommorow and http://www.mypetcarnivore.com, where you can get bony and boneless grounds that are balanced. Tracy at hare today will walk you through her products, should you need.

everywhere you look, there is help.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

Thanks everyone for the help and opinions. I'll try again once my buddy gets better.


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## britt0325 (Jul 11, 2013)

My advice would be to stick with Primal.

I've been feeding my dog premade for about a year now and Primal is my go to food. Sometimes Nature's Variety when I can't make the 15 min trip out to get the Primal. Everything is Organic except the meat which is Human Grade. All the meat is sourced from animals in the USA except for lamb and venison which comes from New Zealand. Nothing is sourced from China.

I mean, to be completely honest, I don't even eat Organic foods or meat that is grass fed. It's just too expensive. So I surely wouldn't spend money on getting organic foods for my dog or getting grass fed beef for my dog. So, knowing that, I feel that feeding Primal is better the PMR for me because the quality of the products he's getting are actually better than anything I could personally provide him with. It's easy and not too expensive for feeding my 15lb dog. Oh, and not all their products go through HPP processing. Only the poultry. So as long as you stick with rabbit and red meats your good to go if you want to avoid HPP processing. 

Although, they have some exotic meat sources such as Quail and Pheasant that I occasionally feed regardless of the HPP.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

What about freeze dried? Is that the same as feeding raw?


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## britt0325 (Jul 11, 2013)

Technically, it is the same as far as ingredients but I'm not sure about what impact it has on nutrition and if anything essential is destroyed in the process.

Most brands that make premade raw also have freeze dried versions. I think if your more comfortable with that then it shouldn't be a problem. Personally I would only buy freeze dried if something went wrong, like Hurricane Sandy last year, or if I was going away with my dog, like on a camping trip. In those cases it's extremely helpful and I have no problem feeding it. 

This is my personal opinion, so others may disagree, but from greatest to not to great, this is my rating of dog food:

1. Real raw feeding such a PMR
2. Premade raw from a quality company. There's quite a few so do your research and find one that you feel is best and is available to you. (Personally, I like Primal)
3. Freeze-dried raw. I prefer using it only on a as need basis but if that's what you prefer over raw then so be it. 
4. Home cooked food
5. High quality kibble

Now, obviously that isn't always the case. Some dogs just don't do good on raw. So in that case I would work down the list and use what ever works best. Since you had a bad experience with premade raw maybe you should try the freeze dried and see if you dog handles that better and then over some time on that work towards feeding real raw.

I'm thinking that it might have just been a detox thing of maybe a stomach upset because you fed raw with kibble. I'm sure someone on here already recommended that you don't feed raw with kibble and I think you should fast your dog for at least 12 hours before trying out raw. So if your willing to try it again, I think you should just give the raw a second chance. That's up to you though.

I switched my dog over cold turkey. He had some loose stool the first week and then he was fine. He's been on it for over a year and he's doing great on it. So hopefully, it will work for your dog as well.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

tonkasdad said:


> What about freeze dried? Is that the same as feeding raw?


I think most freeze dried you have to add water back to them. I'm not 100% on that, but I think you do to "activate" the nutrients.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

naturalfeddogs said:


> I think most freeze dried you have to add water back to them. I'm not 100% on that, but I think you do to "activate" the nutrients.


That is what I heard as well...


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

So I called Darwin's Pet Food to ask a few questions. I asked about transitioning and they told me to mix a tablespoon of raw with his kibble. Now from what I've been hearing, it's not good to mix it. So who is right and wrong?


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

tonkasdad said:


> So I called Darwin's Pet Food to ask a few questions. I asked about transitioning and they told me to mix a tablespoon of raw with his kibble. Now from what I've been hearing, it's not good to mix it. So who is right and wrong?


i so wish people would get onto the same page....

there are those who will tell you to wean a dog from kibble to raw...and there are people who say fast for 24 hours and then start raw or 12 hours and start raw.

i think mixing kibble and raw is something i would not want to do, but that's just my opinion, as the digestion times are different...and when intro'ing a new style of feeding, i like to keep things as simple as i can for the dog.

i know people who feed both kibble and raw as a topper....or feed kibble for one meal and raw for another and they say it's fine.

i believe them.

i can only speak for what i would do. skip a meal and start raw.


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

tonkasdad said:


> So I called Darwin's Pet Food to ask a few questions. I asked about transitioning and they told me to mix a tablespoon of raw with his kibble. Now from what I've been hearing, it's not good to mix it. So who is right and wrong?


While some people say don't mix, you still should transition, unless your dog has no trouble doing it. I added a couple, few spoonfuls to the kibble, for a couple days. They had no upset tummies so the third, maybe fourth day, they got a whole serving. 

I know people who do mix raw & kibble with no issues.


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

I definitely would NOT do what that person recommended to you. The digestion speeds are vastly different and can cause upset.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

Ok so no mixing.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

I've got another quick question. So I think I'm gonna go ahead and try Darwin's. Before I switch him to raw, should I let him fast a full 24 hours or just for the night?


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## SuperPug (Mar 5, 2013)

I would do the full 24 hrs


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## Kat (Jul 12, 2011)

Ruby had a 12 hour fast, and I fed Oscar his first tiny raw meal right when I brought him home and he was fine. Personally I think 24 hours is too long.


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

tonkasdad said:


> I've got another quick question. So I think I'm gonna go ahead and try Darwin's. Before I switch him to raw, should I let him fast a full 24 hours or just for the night?


I did a 12 hour fast as one of mine will puke if he misses a meal.


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

I feed mine twice a day, so I just started with the very next meal-- I don't remember which meal it was, but there was a 12 hour fast between, since they get fed twice a day.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

skip a meal and then go raw.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

When he is fully on raw, should I fees him once or twice a day?


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

you can feed him once or twice. i started out with two feedings per day and then switched to one...because i have a pug who only gets a little under 5 ounces per day. to divide that into two feedings didn't give him much to eat per meal.


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## britt0325 (Jul 11, 2013)

I feed twice a day. My dog only gets 4oz a day and the patties are 8oz so he gets 1\4 of a patty twice a day. It doesn't look like a lot of food but he gets sick if his stomach stays empty for too long so it's a must for him.


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## tonkasdad (Apr 15, 2013)

Thanks again everyone...I should be getting his first shipment from darwin's tomorrow. I hope it goes well.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

I don't know that I believe all the digestion rate mumbo jumbo. Does raw digest differently than kibble? Definitely! It requires a much higher PH level in the dogs' stomach. Would I personally ever feed kibble and raw in one meal, probably not. 

That being said most racing greyhounds are fed a mix of kibble and raw and they seem to do just fine.

Just my 2 cents on that factor. 

Tonkasdad I think doing to pre-made to start is your best bet, if all goes well and you get comfortable with that, then transitioning to raw (PMR style) may be an option..But most importantly you need to be comfortable with what you feed.


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## Fundog (Oct 25, 2012)

Good luck, TD! Let us know how it goes. : )


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