# How do you feel about Euthanasia?



## nortknee (May 5, 2011)

Since we're moving, I've been looking at part-time job openings in College Station, TX. I came across an opportunity with the Brazos Animal Shelter looking for Animal Care Techs for the Fall. I decided to do some more research and found that they're a kill-shelter.

I don't really know exactly how I feel about that. In one thought bubble I think, well, that's to make sure that the public is safe from potentially dangerous dogs that would otherwise be adopted, and then in the second bubble, I think, isn't the point of a shelter to help those unwanted dogs become "wantable" again?

What do you think?

I haven't applied yet, because it makes me a little sick to think about having to drag heavy, black, plastic bags out the back door...if you catch my drift. :\


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

I wouldn't take that job.

I can see it becoming extremely emotionally difficult to deal with that every day.

While it is a necessary evil, I just couldn't handle it in such quantity.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

I have mixed feelings.

Many "no kill" shelters act like they have a higher calling than a kill shelter, yet they send their unadoptable dogs to a kill shelter to do their dirty work for them. The Humane Society in Indianapolis sent surplus dogs over to Animal Control to be put to sleep and then bragged about how they were "no kill."

So if you go down to College Station and go to work for a group that doesn't kill, maybe they are doing the same thing. It just seems hypocritical to me. I'm sure not all of the no-kills do that, though.

There are people on this board that do euthanizations. It IS an important job, unfortunately. It's really up to you what you can handle. 

I think everyone who buys a dog from a puppy mill, pet store, or backyard breeder should have to work in a kill shelter for a week, hauling those bags out.


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## nortknee (May 5, 2011)

I agree with both of you. I think it's a Catch 22, no matter what way you look at it, and it's up to the individual to decide how much they can handle emotionally.

The reason I'm still considering it is that I'm going into Nursing. I have 2 or 3 pre-reqs to complete before I apply to nursing school.
Buuuuut, I also have a thing against dead people/things...they creep me out. A LOT.

I guess I'd be hoping that dealing with the dead/sick/scared would help me with some of my "issues", before I start dealing with humans who have the same problems.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

xellil said:


> I have mixed feelings.
> 
> Many "no kill" shelters act like they have a higher calling than a kill shelter, yet they send their unadoptable dogs to a kill shelter to do their dirty work for them. The Humane Society in Indianapolis sent surplus dogs over to Animal Control to be put to sleep and then bragged about how they were "no kill."


Another note to make is that some "no kill" shelters run out of room and funds to properly care for all their animals. So the animals live in deplorable conditions because as a shelter they don't want to turn animals away.

It really is a double edged sword. I too have applied for kill shelters, with the thought process that perhaps I could help change the norm. like fighting for dogs that would/could make great pets and perhaps even arranging transports to other rescues before their kill date so they could have more of an opportunity to get adopted. But that would be dependent on the shelter you work for, not all of them would actually allow this. And like others have said I am not sure I could do it day in day out and not get broken down from the experiences. We all know its not just the un-adoptable dogs that get PTS...


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## kady05 (Jul 29, 2011)

I volunteered and photographed the dogs at a no kill shelter for 2yrs. and I honestly am not a big fan of them. Sure, I don't like seeing dogs given only 7 days to find a home. But on the other hand, I also hate seeing dogs let rot in a kennel for over a year sometimes. It's ridiculous. I watched so many perfectly stable dogs literally go insane from being in a kennel environment for extended periods of time. I watched dogs who were human aggressive continued to be displayed to the public on the adoption floor (Btw- IMO any HA dog should be euthanized, and especially not be put out on the adoption floor!). I could go on. I had to stop taking their dogs pictures because I was getting fed up with the staff and the "save them ALL" mentality. I couldn't handle it anymore.

I have friends that have worked for animal controls, or shelters that were "kill" shelters. They were able to handle it. I've never been in that situation so I'm not sure how I'd do. You have to decide if that's something you're going to be able to mentally deal with.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Another note to make is that some "no kill" shelters run out of room and funds to properly care for all their animals. So the animals live in deplorable conditions because as a shelter they don't want to turn animals away.
> 
> It really is a double edged sword. I too have applied for kill shelters, with the thought process that perhaps I could help change the norm. like fighting for dogs that would/could make great pets and perhaps even arranging transports to other rescues before their kill date so they could have more of an opportunity to get adopted. But that would be dependent on the shelter you work for, not all of them would actually allow this. And like others have said I am not sure I could do it day in day out and not get broken down from the experiences. We all know its not just the un-adoptable dogs that get PTS...


That is how Snorkels was saved. She went straight from intake to death row on Thursday. Sat there all weekend with no food, water, blanket, or potty breaks. Was scheduled to be euthanized on Monday.

On Monday, a volunteer noticed her, called the weenie dog lady, and asked her if she would get her out. If that volunteer hadn't been there, Snorkels would have had no chance in hell at life because she was deemed unadoptable and not worth even the price of food over the weekend.

It was just someone like you who saved her, there to help and do what she could.


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## bett (Mar 15, 2012)

your title was a bit misleading , as i do believe, for sick-not gonna get better-put out of misery animals, euthanasia is necessary.

beyond that, i couldn't take that job.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

That's why I have mixed feelings. Say Snorkels was in a no kill shelter. And no one adopted her.

What kind of life would she (or any dog) have sitting in a cage month after month, year after year? 

Horrible. Honestly, I'd rather a dog be euthanized before doing that.

And that is why I get so angry at people who breed willy nilly litters, or buy dogs from the paper, the internet, or pet stores. 

They are the ones who keep condemning these dogs to one horrible death or the other. There are not enough people to adopt them all.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Its funny you say that. My mom was just telling me that this lady a work who regularly fosters animals just purchased a puppy from a pet store. Even my mom, who is not what I would consider an animal lover, could not believe it.


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## nortknee (May 5, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Its funny you say that. My mom was just telling me that this lady a work who regularly fosters animals just purchased a puppy from a pet store. Even my mom, who is not what I would consider an animal lover, could not believe it.


Wow. :tsk:


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Its funny you say that. My mom was just telling me that this lady a work who regularly fosters animals just purchased a puppy from a pet store. Even my mom, who is not what I would consider an animal lover, could not believe it.


It's even worse when someone who knows better does it. If she fosters, she knows where the problem comes from.

I knew there was something wrong with pet store dogs the first time I stuck my face up to the glass at the store in the mall when I was about 9 years old. Why do so many people not get it? There's something not right about selling a dog in box like a pair of shoes.


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## 7766 (Sep 20, 2011)

I agree with Sprocket. I think it is a necessary evil, but I couldn't work around it. Things are backwards here. Our Human Society is a "Kill Shelter" and will not let rescues pull sick dogs. They will put them down instead.

Our Animal Control on the other hand, while it is a kill a shelter, once an animal goes up for adoption, it is safe from being put down. They also have a rescue hold. For example, if an animal comes in HW + they will hold the animal and not put it down and hold it for a rescue group. If the dog is to far gone from a disease then yes it is put down and I am sure dogs that don't make it to the adoption list, get put down. But I know the director and he does all he can to make that a last resort.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Pit bulls and mixes there of generally do not do well in shelter situations. I worked for the local shelter here and I've seen dogs go from perfectly adoptable dogs to something completely different... Some end up so frusterated they act out, so when you go to take them out they are so overstimulated they start nipping you and the leash and they are just off the wall, it's not something that cant be solved but it does make it much harder for them to be adopted. Or they go in the other direction and shut down completely. It's just sad.

We had some cruelity cases. One where the dogs would never be adopted out but couldn't be PTS until the case was completed. One or two of these dogs bit employees (at the fault of the employee) they really weren't bad dogs, just dogs traped in a bad situation and then once in kennels they went "crazy".. 

We had another one where they came in as puppies and by the time the case was over they were adults, no one was sure how they would do in a home environment because they had lived in cages for sooo long but from what I understood they did try to adopt them out..


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Pit bulls and mixes there of generally do not do well in shelter situations. I worked for the local shelter here and I've seen dogs go from perfectly adoptable dogs to something completely different... Some end up so frusterated they act out, so when you go to take them out they are so overstimulated they start nipping you and the leash and they are just off the wall, it's not something that cant be solved but it does make it much harder for them to be adopted. Or they go in the other direction and shut down completely. It's just sad.
> 
> We had some cruelity cases. One where the dogs would never be adopted out but couldn't be PTS until the case was completed. One or two of these dogs bit employees (at the fault of the employee) they really weren't bad dogs, just dogs traped in a bad situation and then once in kennels they went "crazy"..
> 
> We had another one where they came in as puppies and by the time the case was over they were adults, no one was sure how they would do in a home environment because they had lived in cages for sooo long but from what I understood they did try to adopt them out..


Thus perpetuating the stereotype of the breed. I'm sure some breeds do better sitting in a cage than others although it's horrible for all of them. But some probably don't get aggressive. 

Then when one gets aggressive, people can point and say "see I told you pit bulls are mean dogs."


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## xchairity_casex (Oct 8, 2011)

i am not against putting animals to sleep,it really is unfotunatly a neccessary evil that needs to be done alot due to the over-population of pets sometimes even wonderful pets need to be PTS becuase there is not enough people to care for all of these animals it is horrable,horrable,horrable and i hate it i hate every bit of it but if we didnt put them to sleep what kind of life would they have? most of them im sure owuld end up just sitting in tiny kennels and cages untill they died of natural causes what kind of life would that be for anything?

but i appluad the people who are capable fo doing this horrable deedi can only imagine the mental toll it takes on them i could not do it no matter how hard i tried i know for a fact it wouldnt be long before i broke down.

all we can do is do our best to help the animals we can, teach the people we can, and nothing more theirs alot of ignorant people out their who see animals as nothing more then objects and unfortunatly we cannot fix that.


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## twotonelover (Jan 10, 2011)

I work at a "kill" shelter. The shelter I work at does not have time limits on our animals, so as long as they remain healthy and adoptable, they can stay there until we find them a home (the longest a cat has stayed was 1yr, for a dog 6 months). The animals we put down are animals that are aggressive, unsafe, feral or sick. We work a lot with rescues for animals that may not be adoptable in a shelter setting, but would do well with some work in a foster home. I don't think I could work at a shelter that had a time limit for their animals. I couldn't put down a healthy, friendly cat/dog simply because his "time" was up.

I could never work at a no-kill shelter. I am not at all a fan of "warehousing" animals just for the sake of not euthanizing them, which is what many no-kill shelters do. Like others have said, many dogs go bonkers even after a week or two in a kennel. While I am sure there are good no-kill shelters out there, I personally have not had one positive experience with one. Our shelter took 6 dogs from a no-kill shelter that was being investigated for neglect. There were 50 or so dogs total. All of the dogs had coccidia and other parasites, most of them had severe dental disease, and some dogs were living in crates in the basement. Just not a good situation at all. A no kill shelter that is down the street from us has had a dog with them for 5 or 6 years, shes 8 now. That dog gets walked a couple times a day, but is otherwise in a kennel. Is that a good life for a dog?


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## lovemydogsalways (Mar 4, 2012)

I worked in a shelter for 6 months or more that was a kill shelter. It was horribly emotional on us workers. I was absolutely horrified at some babies that were PTS, for space. I don't know why I didn't quit sooner. I felt I was doing good for the cats, that was where I worked was stray cat room.

ETA: I am not against euthanasia, but when it is 6 week old kittens that were put down because of "ringworm" then that cuts me.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

nortknee said:


> I agree with both of you. I think it's a Catch 22, no matter what way you look at it, and it's up to the individual to decide how much they can handle emotionally.
> 
> The reason I'm still considering it is that I'm going into Nursing. I have 2 or 3 pre-reqs to complete before I apply to nursing school.
> Buuuuut, I also have a thing against dead people/things...they creep me out. A LOT.
> ...


death is not always the enemy. i would certainly want to know how death is caused before doing anything.

and then i would feel as if i'm in a concentration camp.

i could not do it.

on a patient by patient basis, yes. i believe in euthanasia.....i would not want any animal or human to suffer especially if terminal.

but mass death? day in day out? no.

if you are going to be a nurse, best to think about that. because death is all around you unless you work for an eye doc.

dead bodies abound. for nurses, docs, and ancillary staff....just taking someone down for x ray and the patient can croak. these people are in the hospital for a reason.


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## nortknee (May 5, 2011)

magicre said:


> death is not always the enemy. i would certainly want to know how death is caused before doing anything.
> 
> and then i would feel as if i'm in a concentration camp.
> 
> ...


The way I see it, it's my job to prevent death, or at least ease it as much as humanly possible. I enjoy caring for others in need, whether they're four or two legged. I just have a hard time managing the idea of that being's "stuff", essence, soul, or whatever you want to call it, vanishing off the face of the earth without a thought. Especially in the case of an animal who was abandoned...how unfair.

I'm not religious...maybe that's where I went wrong.


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## RRs (Aug 31, 2011)

I'm all for euthanasia! Let's start with puppy mill owners.
Oh wait......You mean animals. I couldn't do it.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

RRs said:


> I'm all for euthanasia! Let's start with puppy mill owners.
> Oh wait......You mean animals. I couldn't do it.


HAHA! Now that was funny.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

RRs said:


> I'm all for euthanasia! Let's start with puppy mill owners.
> Oh wait......You mean animals. I couldn't do it.


i'm all for that LOL


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

nortknee said:


> The way I see it, it's my job to prevent death, or at least ease it as much as humanly possible. I enjoy caring for others in need, whether they're four or two legged. I just have a hard time managing the idea of that being's "stuff", essence, soul, or whatever you want to call it, vanishing off the face of the earth without a thought. Especially in the case of an animal who was abandoned...how unfair.
> 
> I'm not religious...maybe that's where I went wrong.


i think you're going to find out that your job is not to prevent death, per se. plenty of patients come into a hospital who are dying. so making their passage as easy as possible might be the job of the day.

it depends on what the client needs and in what way you can be their liasson....

easing their way...great way to put it.

i believe in souls...having watched enough people and dogs die...when that light goes out, the soul leaves too..but that's me....where the soul goes.....it's not for me to say..i have my own theory but it's not for everyone.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

nortknee said:


> The way I see it, it's my job to prevent death, or at least ease it as much as humanly possible. I enjoy caring for others in need, whether they're four or two legged. I just have a hard time managing the idea of that being's "stuff", essence, soul, or whatever you want to call it, vanishing off the face of the earth without a thought. Especially in the case of an animal who was abandoned...how unfair.
> 
> I'm not religious...maybe that's where I went wrong.


One of my best friends is a nurse and I considered going down that path once. My thing is, I'm scared of blood :shocked: You sound like you've got what it takes, just be prepared...there are those patients who enjoy making your job hell too :tape:



RRs said:


> I'm all for euthanasia! Let's start with puppy mill owners.
> Oh wait......You mean animals. I couldn't do it.


:rofl:


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Keep in mind that our shelters where I live aren't as heavy traffic as some more densely populated areas of the country. That said they still get pretty full.

I'd MUCH rather work for a kill shelter that did and excellent job of evaluating dogs and screening owners.

Unfortunately its very hard to appropriately screen owners at a shelter, especially for breeds that need it like pit bulls, northern breeds, high energy sporting breeds, and herding breeds. There is just not enough manpower and funching. I keep an eye on things and I've seen inappropriately placed dogs bounce in and out and in and out of the system without end. Its just sick. There are so many of them. The worst I saw when I was volunteering was the grossly obese and very low key 5yr old BC girl who was returned for being "too active." She was so flippin' mellow and well mannered. Seeing Sibes go into pet homes and knowing they will be itchy and painful from cheap food because they are so sensitive to cheap crap... and that they'll be purposefully made fat so they won't want to run or just returned if they start doing things bored huskies do.... or worse die being hit on the road because they weren't properly kept or someone thought it was fine to leave them ouside in the fenced yard. UGH!

The shelter I volunteered in changed hands and became a no kill shelter this last year. I helped a family friend find a new dog there. It used to have its issues like any shelter, but overall was very good with only putting out the really solid dogs that would do well in most any pet home. It is 100,000,000 times more disgustingly dirty. The kennels were filthy, the stations with trifectant spray were empty. The yard was horrifying, there was shit everywhere and I can't even begin to imagine how disease must have gone up since these changes for the worse! The animals are warehoused 2-3-4 to a kennel. Even pit bulls.... wonder how many dog fights they get now? I saw one pit bull that was already kennel crazy despite the fact that their turnover has gone up 80% because they got rid of the few screening safety measures put in place for the dogs to ensure good homes. And he was sharing a kennel with a lab mix...They didn't even do a pre-adoption interview for my friend when she adopted her BC mix despite his kennel card saying it was required. We asked more about him than they volunteered. And they let her take him without being neutered.... she came back for his appointment because she's a good person, but they had NO WAY of making her do it as she lives 2hrs away!! So great, more dogs being bred becuase I'm sure she's not the only person they've let do that.... Frankly I'm pretty gd disgusted. And all in the name of people wanting to be able to pat themselves on the back for not euthanizing 2,000 dogs a year. Do they not realize their are dog limit per household laws here? There are no way enough homes for all these animals and more people byb their dogs every damn day.... I think no kill shelters are a big problem.

Oh and the other well established no kill shelter in the area is a real winner too. They are cleaner and better run.... but to give an example of one dog's "happy ending" here ya go. My friend and her husband adopted a really nice Siberian Husky girl from that shelter right after they got married, as well as a big ass orange tabby cat. The cat was great, albiet a total perv cat. I love my best friend, but I would never hand her a husky. Its not the kind of dog that would mesh well with her lifestyle, though she is a good pet owner and good with basic training. Long story short she ended up dumping her back at the shelter after a year because her neighbor complained and she was in danger of being evicted even though the dog DIDN'T EVEN DO WHAT SHE WAS ACCUSSED OF!!!! She didn't tell me until after the fact or I would've held onto the dog and found her an appropriate home. As it was I pointed a husky fancying couple I knew toward her and will feel forever guilty about doing so. At first it seemed perfect.... and then they created MAJOR behavioral problems int his dog. They let their pre-existing Sibe bully her until she finally got fed up and will not tolerate the presence of it at all. I know the reality of the situation because I got to see the build up to this. They made her fearful and insecure from a lack of good leadership and routine to the point where she has tried to bite a few people. This is a damn good dog I spent a lot of time with and let me tell you this dog had zero problems besides maybe being a little pent up before they adopted her!!! Oh and suddenly she's cat aggressive despite living with a cat without being crated for over a year before and coming in my house that had 4 cats at the time and never once looking sideways at one..... yeaaaaah it ain't the dog. So then they are thinking about dumping her on someone else with all these issues instead of fixing the mess they created. At least they asked for my advice first thank goodness. I think they stopped going to that damn e-collar trainer and at least she's on anxiety meds and being rotated with the other animals. They are really nice people that would never purposefully harm a dog and have had lots of previous Sibe experience, buuuuuuut only with one at a time pet rescue sibes. You never can tell.... In fact Scout's previous life before coming to me is eerily similar, except that her bite threshold is the highest of any dog I've ever met and she never ever got to that point despite being put in situations where about any dog would! If I hadn't had Scout already, I'd have taken Nieve off their hands. They call her something else, but I'll always think of her as what I first knew her as. Despite keeping her and working with her, the girl deleted all photos of her off fb except like two from horseback riding (where the dog looks like a nervous wreck and is desperately throwing out a calming signal) and never talks about her. Ugh. And last time I saw her she was overweight and her coat was horrid from eating Purina. Her poor digestive track must be so ouchy. The other dog was in the same condition. She recognized me and went husky retarded she was so happy to see me. Yeah thats a scary dog there guys. *sarcasm!* They recently changed the cats to raw (they went from 1 to 5! Yikes!) so maybe they'll get the poor dogs on real food next. Sure would help given both dogs have massive issues with nearly all kibble.

Same shelter as that lovely personal example above has imported three seperate large batches of small breed dogs from CA shelters. They sell these dogs, I'm sorry this is f'ing selling not adopting!, for $2-400 a pop depending on the popularity of the breed. I guess at least they are spuetered and vacced and chipped, but jeebus are they not aware of the huge small dog byb problem in this valley?!?! There is no shortage of small dogs to adopt at the other shelters!!!! Especially this other big one, its been flooded with small dogs of all ages. Without importing dogs that may or may not have been hw tested prior.... I find this unethical to say the least, especially with the astronomical prices they charge. Only a very small percentage of the population here can afford that.... giving people reasons to turn their attention to those nice byb ads in the paper.... Oh and the blatant lying about the actual breed of some bully breed dogs to make them more adoptable. I've seen the website listing breed change after certain periods of time, just lies to try and move dogs out the doors. That is pretty gd charming. And touting pit bulls for adoption as dog park friendly. That makes me want to beat my f'ing head on a desk.


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

I'm not sure if the little shelter I got Lily from is no kill or not, but is TINY and in an affluent area. Dogs go very fast, they are honest about what the individual dogs need and adopt them out appropriately, and their adoption fee is $23 and change, plus you pay for the s/n when you pick up the dog at the vet they contract with. They don't have cats, but they let me bring mine and test Lily out. They are a really nice little shelter. A year or so before I got Lily they did have to euth everything because of a parvo outbreak. I'm sure that was awful and really hard on employees. Every single employee there said if they didn't have 4 dogs they'd adopt Lily. LOL, she would have made them regret that! She's so good at working people who don't know better, lol. I came really close to adopting a sibe there right before I took Scout. But her owner claimed her!

I wanted to volunteer and perhaps foster for the recently founded bully breed rescue because I love pit bulls. Luckily I always research everything because I'm a giant nerd. They support anti-tethering movements (I'm sorry, stupid a-hole people can abuse any form of containment or equipment... banning it is just as retarded as banning pit bulls, rotties, etc. etc.!!!), go on and on about "its how you raise them," and heavily advertise their fosters as dog friendly and dog park safe. I'm sorry guys, its pit bull 101 that that is the STUPIDIST thing on this planet you can do with a breed that was created specificially for rumbling with other dogs and loving every blessed second of it. IMO these people harm the pit bull as much as the abusive jerks who get them for their egos because they set them up to fail and make responsible bully breed owners look bad AND put everyone who owns them in danger because its a matter of time before BSL when you start having irresponsible behavior that will lead to incidents the media and JQP will go nuts over...

Maybe its not normal, but I'd have an easier time giving a dog its last minutes of love than I would handing it off to someone I know is going to wreck that dog's potential even as a companion and fail it at every turn. And yes it was volunteering in the shelter and seeing how JQP takes care of their dogs and cats needs while I'm out exercising my girls (what I've seen along the backyards of the pricey subdivisions was some of the worst examples too....) that made me this cynical. Not surprising I kept the stray I took in as a personal foster instead of having AC come pick him up. At least I know 100% that he is in his perfect forever home and being given a job with someone with good experience.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

mokeys23, that's some pretty awful stuff. Like you, I'd rather see a dog put to sleep than live its life the way many dogs end up, with the wrong owners and miserable. 

And shipping dogs in when you are overpopulated already? That's just crazy. 

I went with my cousin to adopt a dog from our local animal control - I was surprised they did no screening whatsover. Anyone with $60 could walk out with whatever dog was in there.


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Sorry I kinda went off, lol. Yeah I just don't get it. It should be about animal welfare, not people's stupid egos and pocketbooks.

Its that way with nearly all animal control or city shelter places. They just don't have the manpower or funding or whatever to do it. Its just too bad.


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Personally, I see it as necessary. We don't have room for all of the dogs that people so stupidly dump at shelters. Many can be adopted but they don't in the short time they have at the shelter.

I couldn't take that job. In addition to what Xellil said, I have always felt that those who take a dog to the shelter to hand over to be someone else's problem should have to spend a week working there so they can see what they are abandoning their dog to. Not that people don't anonymously dump dogs off at shelters but still... Ugh.


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