# Henry's Lip turned Pink and Swollen!



## BrownieM

Slightly concerned because one side of Henry's inside, lower lip went from black to pink yesterday. It also appeared a bit swollen last night. Can't tell if it is swollen today still, maybe a little. He is acting fine. I did schedule a vet appointment for Monday.

Any ideas on what this could be? On Wednesday (2 days before his lip changed) I did apply Frontline. Also, last night I gave him a small sample of The Honest Kitchen, Embark. I added it to his venison muscle meat. He did eat a cow trachea on Thursday. These are the only things that he has been exposed to that are different from usual.

Henry's lips when it was black, taken a few weeks ago.







Henry's lips now pink















The other side - still black.


----------



## whiteleo

Are you sure he just didn't bite his lip or something when he was eating the trachea?


----------



## RawFedDogs

As long as he's acting normal, I wouldn't rush off to the vet. I give it a couple of weeks and not sure I would go then.


----------



## D'Lynn

he might have snapped at a bee.


----------



## BrownieM

whiteleo said:


> Are you sure he just didn't bite his lip or something when he was eating the trachea?


That's definitely not what happened. How would that cause his lip to lose its pigment? It's not like an irritated red, it just suddenly lost pigment.

The vet does want to see him because she said a sudden lost of pigmentation that is not gradual is not usual. Also, I found a patch of hair missing on his leg, an inch oval with scaley skin. I can think of a few issues that occur in standard poodles that both of these issues could be related to, so a vet visit is definitely in order.

Hopefully it's just some weird reaction, though!


----------



## whiteleo

I couldn't really tell what you were talking about until I really studied it, now I see that it has changed from black to pink around the corners of his mouth. I hope it all turns out O.K.


----------



## CorgiPaws

Could be an allergic reaction to something maybe? 
Annie once had an allergic reaction to something that caused her vulva (usually blackish) to turn bright pink and swell up about 3x normal size. No, it wasn't a heat or anything, she was spayed long before... and had other swelling on her face. 
Keep us posted on the vet visit. 
Sending good vibes!


----------



## DaneMama

Honestly his lip looks a little swollen, the pink is from the inside of his mouth and since his lip is swollen the inside is now showing on the outside. And to be honest again, its not something that I would take him into the vet for. The vet is saying he wants to see him because he probably has no idea what you're describing and really has to say that he should because he doesn't know just to be safe. 

Just keep an eye on it for the next few days to a week.


----------



## BrownieM

DaneMama said:


> Honestly his lip looks a little swollen, the pink is from the inside of his mouth and since his lip is swollen the inside is now showing on the outside. And to be honest again, its not something that I would take him into the vet for. The vet is saying he wants to see him because he probably has no idea what you're describing and really has to say that he should because he doesn't know just to be safe.
> 
> Just keep an eye on it for the next few days to a week.


The vet wants to see him because pigment loss can be a sign if thyroid issues. He needs to go for an annual checkup/bloodwork anyway, so I might as well take him. I also found a patch of skin with hair missing, and that is concerning to me, too. I like peace of mind.  I am bringing Tiger, too, because he needs his microchip.


----------



## DaneMama

Make sure to have a full blood work check on both dogs too....even the puppy :thumb:


----------



## BrownieM

Okay, it's now crusty on the bottom. Still swollen. I am glad he's going to the vet.


----------



## DaneMama

Freya gets this crusty lip issue sometimes, and my vet doesn't really know what triggers it. I think it has partially to do with not getting enough omega fatty acids in the diet because once we started giving salmon oil every day, she hasn't had an issue. 

It could be just dry climate, has it been dry there lately?


----------



## BrownieM

DaneMama said:


> Freya gets this crusty lip issue sometimes, and my vet doesn't really know what triggers it. I think it has partially to do with not getting enough omega fatty acids in the diet because once we started giving salmon oil every day, she hasn't had an issue.
> 
> It could be just dry climate, has it been dry there lately?


I live in one of the most humid parts of the country. It feels like I am walking into a rainforest when I go outside.

I give LOTS of fish oil. Who knows!!!!!!


----------



## BrownieM

The vet truly has no idea!

Well, the patch of skin missing on his arm is just scar tissue from dew claw removal - ha! I am a crazy mommy!

The pigment loss is odd, she agrees. He now has a pink spot on the front of his muzzle, just below his nose. This was not here yesterday. She suspects possible bacterial infection, because of the tiny bit of crustyness. Apparently bacteria can get stuck in the fold. I am supposed to wipe his mouth off for the next week or so after he eats, and see if this helps. If this IS what it is, I'd be willing to bet it happened from drinking the nasty pond water at the barn where my mom keeps her horse. But, the fact that he has a pink spot on the outside of his face now makes me wonder...

Other possibility is a possible contact dermatitis. Not sure what from. She said that this would most likely NOT be from exposure to the plastic drinkwell that I had bought (but have returned) because it would take more exposure to develop an allergy or to show an allergic reaction.

Finally, I insisted on the OFA Thyroid panel. She strongly believed that he exhibited no signs of thyroid issues, and she does not see it in young dogs. However, I find it odd that he has gained 7 pounds (he is now 64 pounds!!!!) within the past couple of months. She is a holistic vet and thus has not had a lot of experience with health testing (I don't thikn many people bring breeding animals to her or anything. She specializes in cancer and nutrition). Anyway, she had never heard of this OFA Thyroid panel. Once she saw it, and saw that it would test for Thyroiditis, immune mediated thyroid problems, she thought it was a very good idea to be testing Henry for this, as it is a possibility too.

I forgot to fast him, so I am taking him in tomorrow morning for the bloodwork.

So, in the meantime, I know only as much as I knew before going to the vet. I hate when that happens! :/ I want vets to have answers!!

I am not counting on his pigment to return, which is very sad, because he looks kind of goofy.


----------



## magicre

that would drive me crazy, not getting an answer...
i don't suppose it could be him getting older....i realise that's over simplistic...just a thought.

i only say that because malia had that blue spot on her tongue, like chows have and a few years later, it got smaller.....just like that.


----------



## BrownieM

magicre said:


> that would drive me crazy, not getting an answer...
> i don't suppose it could be him getting older....i realise that's over simplistic...just a thought.
> 
> i only say that because malia had that blue spot on her tongue, like chows have and a few years later, it got smaller.....just like that.


It is somewhat normal for dogs to lose pigment as they age, but it is not normal for a dog to have black lips in the morning and pink lips that same night. It is also weird that he has a pink spot on the outside of his muzzle now. It is a skin reaction of some sort, I have a feeling.


----------



## magicre

BrownieM said:


> It is somewhat normal for dogs to lose pigment as they age, but it is not normal for a dog to have black lips in the morning and pink lips that same night. It is also weird that he has a pink spot on the outside of his muzzle now. It is a skin reaction of some sort, I have a feeling.


i knew i was reaching, but sometimes we do that, eh? 

sounds like a skin reaction, but the loss of pigment from morning to night...wow, never have i come across that one. 

please let us know as you dig into this mystery.


----------



## CorgiPaws

Annie has gotten the lip crusties before, usually with some swelling or pinkness to the jowl. 
My vet isn't sure what triggers it, nor am I. She hasn't had it since I lived in my apartment and ran the heater, so I had once blamed that. She hasn't had it in several months.


----------



## DaneMama

Vets don't always have the answers....neither do human doctors. 

And he may have gained weight over the past few months because his daily food intake requirements are changing as he ages.


----------



## BrownieM

Are there any dietary imbalances that could case a sudden loss of pigment?


----------



## magicre

BrownieM said:


> Are there any dietary imbalances that could case a sudden loss of pigment?


the only thing i read and it was more nose related, was a possibility of a contact dermatitis with plastic bowls.....

Home Remedy for Pink Lips | eHow.com


ChowChow.org • View topic - Loss of pigment around mouth?

Causes of Pigment & Color Changes in the Skin & Coat in Dogs

i found these, but not sure if i'm helping or confusing the issue....


----------



## BrownieM

magicre said:


> the only thing i read and it was more nose related, was a possibility of a contact dermatitis with plastic bowls.....
> 
> Home Remedy for Pink Lips | eHow.com
> 
> 
> ChowChow.org • View topic - Loss of pigment around mouth?
> 
> Causes of Pigment & Color Changes in the Skin & Coat in Dogs
> 
> i found these, but not sure if i'm helping or confusing the issue....


He has had zero exposure to plastic bowls. The only plastic bowl in the house was that Drinkwell fountain, (that I returned), but he lost this pigment before I ever bought that fountain. But, I wonder if eating off the plastic bottom of his crate could cause the same effect? 

I will look at those other links, thanks! :smile:


----------



## magicre

to tell the truth, i start googling and eventually, i'll find something that either makes sense or makes me dig further


----------



## BrownieM

Wellll....

Yesterday I took Henry to another vet. This vet recognized within seconds that Henry had Pyoderma - a skin infection. He is on Prednisone for the swelling for a week (his lip was pretty darn swollen) and an ointment for a few weeks. 

Millie came with...because I suspected an ear infection..and sure enough, she has a pretty severe bacterial ear infection (no yeast at all).

So then..

Today Tiger wakes up, shaking his head like mad, too, all day. So..back to the vet I go. Tiger, too, has a very severe bacterial (no yeast) ear infection in BOTH ears. The vet said it is actually quite odd to see them both have the same bacterial ear infection, without yeast, especially when yeast is usually the cause of in ear infections in poodles.

So, Henry has a bacterial lip infection, Tiger has two bacterial ear infections and Millie has an identical bacterial ear infection. WHAT is going on with my poodles?


----------



## magicre

BrownieM said:


> Wellll....
> 
> Yesterday I took Henry to another vet. This vet recognized within seconds that Henry had Pyoderma - a skin infection. He is on Prednisone for the swelling for a week (his lip was pretty darn swollen) and an ointment for a few weeks.
> 
> Millie came with...because I suspected an ear infection..and sure enough, she has a pretty severe bacterial ear infection (no yeast at all).
> 
> So then..
> 
> Today Tiger wakes up, shaking his head like mad, too, all day. So..back to the vet I go. Tiger, too, has a very severe bacterial (no yeast) ear infection in BOTH ears. The vet said it is actually quite odd to see them both have the same bacterial ear infection, without yeast, especially when yeast is usually the cause of in ear infections in poodles.
> 
> So, Henry has a bacterial lip infection, Tiger has two bacterial ear infections and Millie has an identical bacterial ear infection. WHAT is going on with my poodles?


is it humid where you live?

that's some catch by the vet.....good.

i hope the babies feel better soon.


----------



## BrownieM

macigre- the past few weeks have had temps ranging from 92-105 with very high humidity. You walk outside and it feels like a greenhouse. I too suspect that this might have something to do with all of the infections. Granted, they spend 99.9% of their time inside...but still...


----------

