# Another recall coming?



## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

Just came back from my vets office and while there she had a notice about the jerky problems posted on the door. I started talking about it with her and she told me a lot of dogs are getting sick again and she said in speaking with other vets it's not just the treats. She said a lot of the owners didn't feed them treats in question. Makes me think something is a brewin. Also got me wondering why there isn't some sort of vet network. I mean think about it, they are the first ones to find out about the illnesses and test for toxins, why they can't communicate and get it on the web? Even before we hear from the fda, like a cautionary alert. Suppose the feed companies would be hostile to it and try to give monies to the vets so they wouldn't speak poorly of their food. Sad.....hwell:


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

I would be very, very afraid to feed my dog any processed food right now. I remember in 2007 there were all these "rumblings" before the full-blown problem made itself known.

The pet food companies are NOT going to be proactive about letting people know. Remember, there were estimates of up to 80,000 deaths in 2007 but only a few "official" deaths from the food.

And I agree - vets should be able to share this stuff. If i were a vet and I was seeing a bunch of kidney damage all of a sudden, it seems I would want to warn my peers.

Thanks for sharing this. It sure would be nice to prevent deaths rather than have to watch your own dog die, and read about it on the news after thousands are dead.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

Same as Xellil....I dont know how ya'll do it!:wacko:
I remember after the '07 one...I was, and have continued to be SOOOO paranoid!
I would be OH SO paranoid...heck I am and I dont have any of my personal pets on any processed foods!hwell:

I will be on the look out, and keep my ears open in case I hear something from around the globe where I have people I am in contact with....I always do though, seeing as how I have family members who still feed even grocery store brands!!uke:

Thank you for the heads up, I will write a couple people I know in the vet community and see what they are hearing!!


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## kathylcsw (Jul 31, 2011)

Is it just dogs right now or cats too? Both my cats eat a combo of dry and canned food. One of them did have a couple of episodes of vomitting and diarrhea but I never saw which one it was and it seems to have resolved. With cats how would you even identify lethargy?? Mine spend 99% of their time curled up somewhere sleeping!

I worry about my family and friends dogs too. I am the only raw feeder I know so all the other dogs are on some form of kibble. I would say luckily they all eat fairly quality kibble but that doesn't necesarily mean anyhting. I hate the thoughts of pets suffering and dying in the name of profit... It is just pure evil in my opinion. All the physical pain of the animals and the emotional and financial pain for the owners.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

kathylcsw said:


> Is it just dogs right now or cats too? Both my cats eat a combo of dry and canned food. One of them did have a couple of episodes of vomitting and diarrhea but I never saw which one it was and it seems to have resolved. With cats how would you even identify lethargy?? Mine spend 99% of their time curled up somewhere sleeping!
> 
> I worry about my family and friends dogs too. I am the only raw feeder I know so all the other dogs are on some form of kibble. I would say luckily they all eat fairly quality kibble but that doesn't necesarily mean anyhting. I hate the thoughts of pets suffering and dying in the name of profit... It is just pure evil in my opinion. All the physical pain of the animals and the emotional and financial pain for the owners.


unfortunately, I would suspect both. The plants that process the food do it for both cats and dogs, I believe. And yes, for unexplained illness in an otherwise healthy dog - I would be looking straight at the food.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

I didn't realize food was involved now too...?


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

I would just only support companies who source from the US or Canada and not from China. They just don't have the same quality control. Maybe we should list companies that do that here so people know?..


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

Caty M said:


> I would just only support companies who source from the US or Canada and not from China. They just don't have the same quality control. Maybe we should list companies that do that here so people know?..




agreed! Abbie is eating Hi-Tek right now which is made in the US. Will look for other companies when I pick up her next bag of food too...


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

I'm down to Fromm and Champion. No others, period. 

Its not because I feel like their ingredients are outstanding(though for the most part, I think they are).

Its because I trust them and because of this crap that we continue to see.


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## DDBsR4Me (Jan 23, 2012)

Caty M said:


> I would just only support companies who source from the US or Canada and not from China. They just don't have the same quality control. Maybe we should list companies that do that here so people know?..


Ok, I know this may sound ignorant, but what do you mean by companies who source from US or Canada? Do you mean their plants are in the US or Canada...or their products only come from the US/Canada? 

How can you find out where the products come from?


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

DDBsR4Me said:


> How can you find out where the products come from?


I think that's a very good question. Do we trust them just because they say so? I think they've proven over and over again they can't be trusted. AND, the processing plants make the food for many, many different brands. It's not like each dog food company has their own little processing plant.


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

I am currently using Champion brand Orijen/Acana and Wellness core and Evangers wet. I just bought Wellness treats and the Charlee Bear treats the three calorie ones. I dehydrate the chicken strips for the dogs along with liver and such and make them homemade peanut butter treats ~well ok~ I don't make them ~ha ~my daughter does~ have to give credit where credit is due! Anyway so far I have had no problems at all with the products I am currently using "SIGH OF RELIEF"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Javadoo (May 23, 2011)

I have been hearing about dogs having kidney issues on NB alot lately.....
2 dogs on one of the lab boards I am on are both on NB and having liver/kidney issues....very sick.


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## Imgliniel (Sep 1, 2011)

Javadoo said:


> I have been hearing about dogs having kidney issues on NB alot lately.....
> 2 dogs on one of the lab boards I am on are both on NB and having liver/kidney issues....very sick.


NB as in Natural balance food?

That is what my uncle's giude dog Larissa eats........


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

This is part of the reason why I don't feed kibble. I won't be so arrogant as to say that my dogs are safe from recalls. Meat can be recalled too but I know exactly where mine comes from so the risk is lower (for the dogs, at least since they are the only ones we an afford to buy privately raised meat for! Ours still comes from the grocery store). 

The problem is, like lots of us here who are aware of recalls as they happen and feed better foods than most (whether it be kibble or raw) I too have lots of friends and family who use whatever's cheapest and don't put much thought into what they are feeding their dogs. Since I have stopped feeding kibble I have realized just how out of the loop I have become on recalls and the like and I feel that I should still be informed. 

Is there any way that the kibble section could have a thread just for recall information? I can never seem to find reliable information on recalls probably since I don't know what to look for. This way, all of us, raw feeders and kibble feeders can be able to warn friends and family bBEFORE their dogs get sick.

I think the raw section should too since there ARE still recalls. I know of two in the past year on meats from Costco and hardboiled aggs in over half the states.


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

Agreed Dude and Bucks mamma we should have a recall section. I go to fda.gov and sign up for email alerts but usually by the time they are on there, it's been awhile. Even lately, there are so many human food recalls, between the salmonella in chicken, e coli in hamburg and now listeria in eggs I don't know what to eat! I had a bad case of food poisoning last year and we still don't know what the culprit was. 
Also I was thinking the illnesses the vet was telling me about were kidney related, I wonder if it is the aflatoxin I keep hearing about. I am going to do a bit of research on it on the web and see what it is found in and where.


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

Oh geez! I just read about aflatoxin:

Aflatoxins are detected in milk, cheese, corn, peanuts, cottonseed, nuts, almonds, figs, spices, and a variety of other foods and feeds. Milk, eggs, and meat products are sometimes contaminated because of the animal consumption of aflatoxin-contaminated feed . However, the commodities with the highest risk of aflatoxin contamination are corn, peanuts, and cottonseed.

It went on to say that a lot of cheap peanut butter has too high aflatoxins for animals! My dogs love peanut butter!


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

wags said:


> I am currently using Champion brand Orijen/Acana and Wellness core and Evangers wet. I just bought Wellness treats and the Charlee Bear treats the three calorie ones. I dehydrate the chicken strips for the dogs along with liver and such and make them homemade peanut butter treats ~well ok~ I don't make them ~ha ~my daughter does~ have to give credit where credit is due! Anyway so far I have had no problems at all with the products I am currently using "SIGH OF RELIEF"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



I'd put Wellness up there with Champion and Fromm, Wags. I didn't mean to say that Champion and Fromm were literally the ONLY brands I trust. Certainly I think Wellness deserves to be up there too. Sabine(Dog Food Project lady) puts Wellness on a high pedestal and speaks real highly of their integrity. So feel good


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## dealwagger (Feb 10, 2012)

greyshadows said:


> Just came back from my vets office and while there she had a notice about the jerky problems posted on the door. I started talking about it with her and she told me a lot of dogs are getting sick again and she said in speaking with other vets it's not just the treats. She said a lot of the owners didn't feed them treats in question. Makes me think something is a brewin. Also got me wondering why there isn't some sort of vet network. I mean think about it, they are the first ones to find out about the illnesses and test for toxins, why they can't communicate and get it on the web? Even before we hear from the fda, like a cautionary alert. Suppose the feed companies would be hostile to it and try to give monies to the vets so they wouldn't speak poorly of their food. Sad.....hwell:


I actually just posted in my blog re: the dangers of contamination from chicken jerky treats manufactured/processed/imported from China. Someone read my blog and said I had potentially saved her dogs life because her dog had symptoms of diarrhea and lethargy...she claims the jerky treats she had been giving him daily were made in China. I'm new to this Forum and don't know if its against terms to list the URL to the article, but it can be found here: blogwagger It's mostly the warning directly from the FDA's website re: chicken jerky treats imported from China. 

On that same blog, I have a link a general, UP TO DATE pet food recall list at Current Dog Food Recalls

Thanks for bringing up this important topic, greyshadows!


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## Jacksons Mom (Jun 13, 2010)

kevin bradley said:


> I'm down to Fromm and Champion. No others, period.
> 
> Its not because I feel like their ingredients are outstanding(though for the most part, I think they are).
> 
> Its because I trust them and because of this crap that we continue to see.


This is kind of how I feel. And I know Champion is not even 100% trustworthy. But out of ALL of these companies out there... I surely will put more faith in them than any other company. As much as I love Fromm, they USED to make their canned food in China - which thank goodness they stopped. But almost every company is going to have something little that people won't like. But still, in general, the three companies I trust at the moment.... Champion, Fromm and Petceruan. 

It's kind of weird you make this thread because for some reason, I've had weird feelings about another big recall potentially brewing. But just a feeling.


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## Jacksons Mom (Jun 13, 2010)

xellil said:


> I think that's a very good question. Do we trust them just because they say so? I think they've proven over and over again they can't be trusted. AND, the processing plants make the food for many, many different brands. It's not like each dog food company has their own little processing plant.


I was amazed to find out how many dog food companies use other places. It seems almost every canned food is made by Menu, and there's another one out there too, I forget.

I like the fact that Champion doesn't have canned foods - they don't have the means to make their own, so they don't offer it. That makes me feel good. Lotus has their own cannery, because when they went looking as to where to make their canned food, they weren't satisfied with what they saw. So they built their own. THAT makes me curious as to why they were all so bad... 

Does anyone know where Fromm makes their canned food now? Since it hasn't been made in China since a few years ago?

I think we should have a thread dedicated to food and WHERE they come from. As in, do they manufacture their own food at their own plant? I know Fromm, Champion, and Lotus have their own.


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## Jacksons Mom (Jun 13, 2010)

wags said:


> I am currently using Champion brand Orijen/Acana and Wellness core and Evangers wet.


Just as an FYI: I don't trust Evangers at all. Last year, they had canned foods that did not even have the meat in them that the label stated. So in another words, you think you are buying "chicken" but instead, there was beef in there. Maybe not a big deal to some, but if a dog has an issue with a certain protein, and you are feeding them one thing thinking that's what it is, and it ends up being something totally different... completely unacceptable, IMO. 

Evangers Vs FDA - Premium Dog Food Company in Hot Water with FDA


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

Fromm makes their canned food in South Dakota


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

I bought Abbie a bag of Pinnacle today, I think Breeders Choice is pretty trustworthy. I wanted Acana or Fromm but there weren't any 15lb bags, so I went with Pinnacle.


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## Makovach (Jan 24, 2012)

Knowing my dogs are getting into my uncles dogs' (IMO) crap food (ol'roy, pedigree, purina, retriever, dads, alpo) It freaks me out. I cant wait to get out and on raw. No more processed anything for my pups...


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## DandD (Jan 4, 2012)

Ok, now I'm worried. We are still feeding Taste of the Wild and I have no idea if they are trustworthy or not. I haven't been able to find decent chicken yet to start our transition to raw. I don't know why chicken is so expensive here but the best price I've been able to find is 2.79/lb which seems really high. I haven't given up though and I'm determined to make this happen.

But, if anyone can help me out with info on TOTW in the meantime it would be much appreciated, as it's the only food my boy has been able to handle with his sensitive system.

Thanks!!


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## StellaLucyDesi (Oct 29, 2008)

I like and trust very few companies anymore....Fromm, Champion to name a few. I've also found a new dog food that I've just started feeding full time (I used to feed their cans and loved them). It's Mulligan Stew. Very few ingredients on the panel for the canned and dry. Vitamins/minerals that come from whole foods and no Asian sourced ingredients or supplements! I do know they don't have their own factory, but I've spoken with the company rep. and I'm very satisfied with this food and company, plus my dogs are doing great on it so far and they're loving it, too! Btw, I was using Fromm but for some reason my oldest Cavalier was having grumbly tummy issues with it. At first I thought it was the high fat in the grain free, so I went back to the regular formulas but still she had the issue. That is why I was looking for another food to feed, and I remembered Mulligan Stew. It seems to have settled her stomach down and the others are even doing a little better on it, too. So....this is my company of choice, for now. They also test each batch of food and give you the results if you want them. This company is also recommended by Susan Thixton (truth about pet foods) and on the whole dog journal (for the past 3 years in a row). They seem trustworthy to me.

Edited to add: I do know about their recall of their canned foods in 2007 (their manufacturer used rice protein without their knowledge! That is when they implemented the batch testing protocol....no problems since. I kinda wish they would have changed their manufacturer totally, but I'm happy with their transparency on the issue and the safety precautions they've implemented.).


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

DandD- for chicken I usually grab the three chicken bags from Superstore when they are on sale for $4/kg and chop them up- keep the breast/thigh for me and the rest for the dogs! :smile:


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## Cliffdog (Dec 30, 2010)

kevin bradley said:


> Its because I trust them


Never trust corporations. I trust them about as much as I trust Purina. A corporation is a corporation and they are ALL out for profit.


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## Cliffdog (Dec 30, 2010)

It's probably been mentioned before (didn't read the whole thread) but meat can be recalled as well, so while your chances are better on kibble of issues, raw feeders aren't exactly safe! Anyone here seen the documentary film "Food, Inc."?


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## Cliffdog (Dec 30, 2010)

DandD said:


> Ok, now I'm worried. We are still feeding Taste of the Wild and I have no idea if they are trustworthy or not. I haven't been able to find decent chicken yet to start our transition to raw. I don't know why chicken is so expensive here but the best price I've been able to find is 2.79/lb which seems really high. I haven't given up though and I'm determined to make this happen.
> 
> But, if anyone can help me out with info on TOTW in the meantime it would be much appreciated, as it's the only food my boy has been able to handle with his sensitive system.
> 
> Thanks!!


TOTW is made by Diamond. They were involved in the 2007 recall but have since really cleaned up their act. All of their ingredients are now from the USA.


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Cliffdog said:


> It's probably been mentioned before (didn't read the whole thread) but meat can be recalled as well, so while your chances are better on kibble of issues, raw feeders aren't exactly safe! Anyone here seen the documentary film "Food, Inc."?


I mentioned it. I said that, while my dogs are (IMO) safer from recalls, nothing we eat will ever be entirely safe. Costco recalled a brand of chicken last year and there was a huge recall of hardboiled eggs within the last month. The thing about raw is that we can actually buy our meat from closer sources. We have control over where the meat comes from, a freedom you don't have with kibble. Sure, you can choose your company but we can choose the individual animal. A lot of my dogs' meat comes from local farmers that we have established a relationship with. But yes, you are right, raw feeders aren't completely safe from recalls, nor do we claim to be. Another advantage is that a lot of us feed human grade stuff and the human food recalls are a much bigger deal to stores than pet foods are. The chicken jerky from China is still being sold in stores but the minute the egg contamination was discovered it was all over the place.

And none of the above was said (or thought in my brain) in a condescending way. I will never claim that my dogs are completely safe from recalls.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Yep, the only way we can be 100% sure is to raise the meat ourselves, and raise the stuff we feed to the meat also.

I like the food I get from the pet food supplier and I get stuff from them I can't get in the grocery store, but I feel like with human-grade meat if there's a problem it's not covered up so much.

Like this stuff from China in treats - they won't recall because they can't identify the poison. Anyone think they would leave human food on the shelves that was killing people because they couldn't identify the problem?


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Exactly. That really bothers me. I see people buying the Waggin Trail jerky all the time and I always tell them what is going on. 90% of the time they will put it back but some just roll their eyes and buy it anyways. It is a huge risk on their dogs' lives but at least I know I said something.


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