# Sticky  Raw Fed Dog Blood work Database



## CorgiPaws

As a raw feeder, I am constantly being asked for blood work, tests, and other "proof" that my dogs are healthy on this kind of diet. (As if gleaming coats, clean teeth, great energy levels, and clear eyes wasn't enough....) I also find that this question comes up quite frequently in discussions online in forums, message boards, and groups. 
I know many of us have annual blood panels done on our raw fed animals, and I thought we should have a collective place to post them. A place to send people who so desperately need to see numbers to feel better. No one is going to pay for data gathering because with PMR there is no money trail, but us advocates of raw feeding can at least gather our own data to put out [email protected]

Please include: Breed, Age, and length of time on raw diet along with your results.


----------



## CorgiPaws

Mousse
Great Dane
1 year, 7 months
4 months of Prey Model Raw feeding


----------



## RawFedDogs

The problem with this premise is that bloodwork does not measure the health of a dog. It does not measure how good his diet is. All it measures is how good certain organs are performing at the very instant that the blood was drawn. It can vary widely from time to time depending on what the dog just ate and when he ate it. It does not measure muscle tone, health of bones, endurance, or how well the body is functioning other than those few organs. You can't prove the worth of a diet by these blood panels. All you can prove is whether or not the liver, kidneys, and pancreas are functioning normally at that very instant that blood was drawn. 

Anyway, I don't have copies of Abby's blood panel and I don't think I have ever had one run on Thor. 

OK, I'll stop raining on your parade. :biggrin: Carry on. Can you tell im just not a big fan of random blood panels?


----------



## CorgiPaws

RawFedDogs said:


> The problem with this premise is that bloodwork does not measure the health of a dog. It does not measure how good his diet is. All it measures is how good certain organs are performing at the very instant that the blood was drawn. It can vary widely from time to time depending on what the dog just ate and when he ate it. It does not measure muscle tone, health of bones, endurance, or how well the body is functioning other than those few organs. You can't prove the worth of a diet by these blood panels. All you can prove is whether or not the liver, kidneys, and pancreas are functioning normally at that very instant that blood was drawn.
> 
> Anyway, I don't have copies of Abby's blood panel and I don't think I have ever had one run on Thor.
> 
> OK, I'll stop raining on your parade. :biggrin: Carry on. Can you tell im just not a big fan of random blood panels?


All points I understand. 
BUT. 
It's just further data on Raw fed dogs that can easily be gathered and shared. As much as you or I or anyone else might know that raw is wonderful, the lack of "data" (read also: useless) is one thing that makes a lot of people hesitate when it comes to taking the reins on their dog's diet. 
A blood panel shows PART of the dog's overall health, and we all know diet plays a role in overall health. 

I'm not generally a fan either, and only have them done if I see reason (Mousse's was done today prior to being under anesthesia for PennHIP) but I know a lot of people do bloodwork frequently.


----------



## DaneMama

Bill is correct in saying that a random blood panel doesn't show much, other than at the time of the blood draw how organs are functioning. But if something is very elevated or low, you can pull more extensive tests to help diagnose the issue. But usually if things are elevated blood work is being drawn because the animal is sick or old. 

Also, repeated annual, or semi annual blood work is when you start to see trends in organ function. If for years and years blood panels always look fantastic you can assume that a raw diet is as ideal as it seems (and is from what I believe lol). I'm an advocate for routine blood work PAIRED with extensive physical examinations.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## D'Lynn

It would take a lot of data accumulation, in other words, people posting results for their raw fed dogs, but eventually there would be data to point to norms for raw fed dogs vs kibble fed dogs. Doctors pay a lot of attention to numbers.


----------



## nykea

RawFedDogs said:


> The problem with this premise is that bloodwork does not measure the health of a dog. It does not measure how good his diet is. All it measures is how good certain organs are performing at the very instant that the blood was drawn. It can vary widely from time to time depending on what the dog just ate and when he ate it. [...] All you can prove is whether or not the liver, kidneys, and pancreas are functioning normally at that very instant that blood was drawn.


But the functioning of the organs forms a very important part of the health of our dogs! Of course, it doesn't say everything, but it it an indicator. Also, there are some guidelines for certain blood tests, and although when something is wrong the vet will take the sample here and now, most of the "planned" blood pannels are done on either full or empty stomach. at least I was always told not to feed the dog (or to feed, depending on the type of test) up to 6/12 hours before the test. 
As people said, it's not telling you everything, but I wouldn't think say they're totally useless. 

And they definitely give the arguments against die hard kibble feeders. For example the myths about too high protein content, or difficulties with Ca balance....


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Maxy24

I think it's a great idea. People like numbers, people like SOLID proof, and this would give it. It might not say that this diet is best, but it will quiet those who say it's dangerous because it's not giving the dog everything he needs. 

Now as Magicre was saying "normal" for a commercial fed animal might not be "normal" for a raw fed animal. Since the majority of pets are fed commercial food, the normals vets use might not apply perfectly to raw fed dogs . I remember that when I was reading about raw for cats I read that cats on raw can have higher BUN levels (though still in "normal" range, just the high end of normal) and a few other things and that this is not a sign of illness, it is what should happen to a cat being fed more meat.

However I think anything way above or below normal would still be a red flag. I also think it's important to look at things over time, if things stay stable and the dog shows no signs of illness then his numbers are normal for him, right? And in any case you'll have a data base with trends between many raw fed dogs which would be interesting to see.


----------



## MollyWoppy

Here are Mollies results from her first ever blood test 4/2011. I can't remember exactly when she started on raw full time, probably 18 months or so.
Note: She was not fasted - she had eaten 2 hours beforehand and she was extremely nervous, panicking almost.
I'm not sure which values would or could be affected by nervousness and non-fasting though.

View attachment 3299


----------



## D'Lynn

magicre said:


> i was thinking about this...and the values for a healthy raw fed dog would be different than what is used now.
> 
> these are pretty much arbitrary numbers, just like cholesterol in humans...normal was 250, then 200, now some are changing to 150, which i think is ridiculous, but that's me....the same goes for LDL and HDL, etc...
> 
> so, for raw fed dogs, i believe the numbers for the lab work would have to change....because if you change a diet, the blood values will change....and that would not play well into the vet's hardwired belief system..
> 
> i'm not knocking blood values. i think they are important...and enough of them saying pretty much the same thing, in spite of it not conforming to what is considered normal.....a raw fed dog would create its own normal...if enough were taken and turned into a database....
> 
> plus, pictures, which are also objective, measurements of the dogs, health issues if any...there would have to be a list of objective findings over the lifespan of the dog...
> 
> if we had a programmer who could create a database and each owner would be part of the study and fill in the blanks, with whatever we decided were the pertinent questions....and let's say once a week or once a month, fill it in...you'd have several thousand people and that would be something....really something....
> 
> granted, it's a rough thought....but refined and it would turn some heads.


I've designed databases.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## BrownieM

I have Henry's thyroid bloodwork results. They are classified as OFA Normal. While not a CBC bloodwork, I still think this could be good info to add to this thread.

Free T4 2S: 11

Thyroid Stimulating Hormone: 12

OFA Classification: NORMAL

Total Thyroxine (T4): 49

Total Triiodothyronine (T3): 1.0

Free T3: *4.4 L*

T4 Autoantibody: 13

T3 Autoantibody: 5


----------



## gorge77

my girl's test report taken last year

Breed: Toy Schnoodle
Age: 2.5yrs at the time of the blood test
Length of time on raw diet: 2 years at the time of the blood test


----------



## neuhaus

Hi

I am new to this page so am having a litle problem getting my e mails out. I see u were using or questioning raw foods. I have an 9 wk old Maltase female. I am wondering if I can feed her COOKED beef heart, for now, as a reward/treat? If yes, then what age is recommended to say incorporate cooked carrots (which she loves) & the cooked beef heart, along with say some Iiams dog food.?


----------



## MollyWoppy

Here's the results of Mollies 2nd yearly bloodtest. Our vet called and said the results were perfect, so I am as happy as Larry. The only thing I can see is her lymphocytes are low (he didn't seem concerned at all) and her urine Specific Gravity was high, but apparently that can be caused by dehydration.

Page 1









Page 2








I'm Happy.


----------



## DaneMama

Penny- A high specific gravity is GOOD...a low SG is bad. As specific gravity measures the concentration of urine! You want it to be nice and concentrated. 

What time of day did you collect that urine sample?


----------



## MollyWoppy

About 8am, the first pee of the day. The appointment was at 10am, so I collected it in a sterile container and (after spilling 3/4 of it on the driveway) put it in the fridge.
Thanks for that Natalie, makes me even happier!


----------



## DaneMama

Then it makes sense that she was somewhat dehydrated as most dogs don't drink a lot of water overnight!


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## xellil

*Snorkels' bloodwork*

Here is her blood panel from yesterday. The vet says he sees nothing to be alarmed about for a dog her age. He thinks everything is perking along well.

I guess the question I have is - if all these are really normal values, why aren't they within range?


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## MollyWoppy

I don't think the values are really that high on the scale to worry about too much. Was she fasted? Was she very stressed and/or dehydrated, and did you get a urinalysis done at the same time? I'm about to launch into an elevated liver enzyme research mission as my friends old pug has quite elevated liver levels, just waiting to get a copy of his test results. So, if I find out anything, I'll let you know.


----------



## xellil

MollyWoppy said:


> I don't think the values are really that high on the scale to worry about too much. Was she fasted? Was she very stressed and/or dehydrated, and did you get a urinalysis done at the same time? I'm about to launch into an elevated liver enzyme research mission as my friends old pug has quite elevated liver levels, just waiting to get a copy of his test results. So, if I find out anything, I'll let you know.


Snorkels? Fast? HAHAHAHA! Well, no  - she didn't get a urinalysis and no dehydration since she drinks alot of water with her food. Her pee is normal and clear. 

And yes, very stressed as going to the vet is difficult for her. She normally shakes all the time we are there and makes a run for the front door if she gets any opening at all.

Sorry about the pug - are they really high? The ALT and the BUN are the two that are sometimes high with Snorkels, although they are also sometimes in the normal range. I'm not sure about the other ones, I don't remember them being out of normal range before. i need to go back and dig up her last senior panel - I know the last blood test was just the simple one, and nothing was out of range at all.


----------



## GoingPostal

Jersey's results from her surgery yesterday (TPLO) 7 years old, 2 months on raw, fasted 
ALKP 12 , Ref range 23-212 U/L
ALT 10, Ref range 10-100 U/L
BUN 13, Ref Range 7-27 mg/dl
CREA 1.3, Ref Range .5-1.8 mg/dl
GLU 135, Ref Range 74-143 mg/dl
TP 7.5, Ref Range 5.2-8.2 g/dl


----------



## schtuffy

This is for Louis, Japanese Spitz, drawn on his 2nd birthday, 1 full year on PMR




CK was a bit high because he was training with me for my race :smile:


----------



## xellil

schtuffy said:


> This is for Louis, Japanese Spitz, drawn on his 2nd birthday, 1 full year on PMR


that's pretty much perfect!


----------



## wolfsnaps88

I have had Sarge on full time raw for a little over two weeks now. As a concerned and loving pet parent, I want to make sure he is doing well. His coat is not the kind to shine, its not been long enough to see a difference really, and I don't know what difference I would see in the future other than maybe decreasing his weight and better fur growth (he has very odd fur). I want to get a blood work done on him. Do you just randomly ask your vet to do this? When they ask me why should I tell them I have him on raw? I don't want to change vets and I don't want any drama. How much does a complete blood panel cost? I know each vet is different but I need to know a ballpark. I will happily post his results. When should I do this as Sarge hasn't been on it for long.

Thanks for answering my questions.


----------



## xellil

wolfsnaps88 said:


> I have had Sarge on full time raw for a little over two weeks now. As a concerned and loving pet parent, I want to make sure he is doing well. His coat is not the kind to shine, its not been long enough to see a difference really, and I don't know what difference I would see in the future other than maybe decreasing his weight and better fur growth (he has very odd fur). I want to get a blood work done on him. Do you just randomly ask your vet to do this? When they ask me why should I tell them I have him on raw? I don't want to change vets and I don't want any drama. How much does a complete blood panel cost? I know each vet is different but I need to know a ballpark. I will happily post his results. When should I do this as Sarge hasn't been on it for long.
> 
> Thanks for answering my questions.


A tech can answer this better, but I've gotten two kinds of blood panels. A short one that's somewhere between $30-$50 and the "senior panel" which I just paid something like $120 for.

I get the shorter tests run routinely a couple times a year. If my dog is acting sick, I ask for the more extensive one. And sure, you can go in and ask. 

It's also a good idea, i think, to get a blood panel done as a baseline in a healthy dog. That way you have something to compare to later if your dog gets sick.

And on the fur - I would be surprised if it didn't get better. Even my bald Dobie's coat is much better since we started raw. his peach fuzz is alot thicker and softer 

Oh, and it's your call to tell them about the raw. Personally, I always tell because I think it's only fair to a vet that they know everything. But just for a blood panel, it really doesn't matter.


----------



## CoverTune

wolfsnaps88 said:


> I want to get a blood work done on him. Do you just randomly ask your vet to do this? When they ask me why should I tell them I have him on raw? I don't want to change vets and I don't want any drama. How much does a complete blood panel cost? I know each vet is different but I need to know a ballpark. I will happily post his results. When should I do this as Sarge hasn't been on it for long.
> 
> Thanks for answering my questions.


How old is Sarge? Generally, bloodwork is recommended prior to spay/neuter (or any anesthetic), and then yearly after the pet reaches 7 years of age. You can certainly ask to have it done any time though.

At our clinic, the most common blood tests are the Pre-Anesthetic Screen (basic blood counts and organ function) which is $69, and a Full Senior Profile (full panel and urinalysis) that's about $180.


----------



## wolfsnaps88

Sargeant is 8. OMG, he is 8!!!! Sigh. They have never asked to do bloodwork other than preop. I am thinking of doing the full panel even though the husband will think I am a whackjob. I just don't know when to?


----------



## xellil

wolfsnaps88 said:


> Sargeant is 8. OMG, he is 8!!!! Sigh. They have never asked to do bloodwork other than preop. I am thinking of doing the full panel even though the husband will think I am a whackjob. I just don't know when to?


Dogs are considered seniors at 7, and you have a large dog. Just my opinion, but I think you should get a full panel now. Not necessarily to find problems, but to have a comparison if he gets sick and the bloodwork when he is ill shows something abnormal. You will be able to tell if it was like that when he is healthy.


----------



## CoverTune

Yep, I'd go ahead and get a full panel done now, and then again in 6 months. After that.. every 6-12 months probably.


----------



## DaneMama

I'm personally a fan of doing routine blood work with all physical exams regardless of the age of the animal. A physical exam can only find so much....doing blood work is a "physical" exam of the internal organ function which is VERY important to overall health. Doing ONE panel randomly isn't going to give you much information, but repeated blood work gives you LOTS of information over the lifespan of a dog/cat.


----------



## wolfsnaps88

xellili No, the dog in my pic is Dozer. And yeah, big dog. The dog I have on raw, Sargeant, is this dog:










See how he has red skin? That comes and goes. And to show you his weird fur I mentioned:

















Sorry, not trying to bogart this thread. I will put it on my list of things to do. Thanks everyone. Will let you know what happens when it does.


----------



## xellil

He is adorable - I am such a sucker for long eyelashes 

I see what you mean about the coat. I have two dogs with coat issues, and both of them are hugely improved on raw. In fact, I didn't think my Dobie was any better until my cousin, who hadn't seen him for over a year, saw him and said he's a million times better. And then I realized hairs aren't breaking off in my hands any more. his coat is much softer, and it's also thicker. Even though he's still bald


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## CoverTune

George's blood and urine results, after 3 months on raw - note, these results are NOT good/ideal. (Sorry they're so huge, but I wanted them to be legible)


George Bloodwork 3/19/2012


George Urinalysis 3/19/2012


----------



## DaneMama

Um....what's not ideal about them? 

Am I missing something?!


----------



## xellil

I see three values that are barely out of range. Snorkels results were off more than that, and the vet says she is in great shape. You said he's acting normally? Is he still dribbling?


----------



## DaneMama

Urea (aka BUN: blood urea nitrogen) is usually slightly elevated for raw fed dogs just due to the nature of the protein exclusivity of the diet. Higher protein diets will produce higher blood urea nitrogen levels. As long as his urine is nice and concentrated (Specific gravity is well above 1.010 which means a good concentration....1.030 is considered normal) there's really not much to worry about with regards to his kidney values. IF is BUN was elevated AND his urine were dilute....then that would be reason to worry. 

Hematocrit (total blood cell volume in blood) is low...but barely. Usually the hematocrit is elevated in raw fed dogs, but it doesn't mean a huge problem if its slightly low. It may just mean he's especially well hydrated at the time. Remember that these blood values are just a snap shot of body function IN THAT MOMENT IN TIME. These values don't necessarily mean that his hematocrit is always low.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## rannmiller

Squamous epithelials could also be caused by the method of collection via catheter. While it is a pretty clean procedure it isn't always 100% sterile and usually there is some contamination of the sample. Squamous epithelial cells found during urinalysis are generally caused by contamination rather than any real issue, so rest easy on that point! The rest I'd agree with Nat about, looks good to me!


----------



## CoverTune

Well the Dr has me freaking out about internal bleeding and kidney problems. There is no UTI, but he's been PU/PD for a week now.. it's definitely not "dribbling", it's full on "wetting the bed" puddles. He's also lost a tiny bit of weight in the last week or so, and his BP is high (170).

Dr did an in-house urinalysis (free catch) and found protein, so wants to send another sample to the lab. We're also going to recheck the blood on Monday.

ETA: George will occasionally get a couple pieces of raw veggies when I'm eating them.. but that's maybe once or twice a month, at most.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## xellil

magicre said:


> i don't blame you for freaking out.....
> 
> i just wish your vet could be a little more definitive, especially if he's suspecting internal bleeding and kidney problems.
> 
> maybe there's another test?


It seems vets always describe the worst case scenario. I'm surprised he already hasn't suggested antibiotics.


----------



## CoverTune

Antibiotics for what though?


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## CoverTune

It seems that he's fine now, and the Dr was just being a jackass before. Hematocrit is still off a touch, but apparently that's not a concern. Kidneys are good, so we're just treating with cranberry extract tablets to see if that helps with the urine leaking issue.

Here's today's results:

George Bloodwork March 26/12


----------



## faustao

Farley has been on raw for 4 years (he's 6 now) and we just had a blood panel done. His BUN is 18 and his creatinine was normal. Any insight?


----------



## DaneMama

We would need to know the reference ranges to know if 18 was elevated or not.


----------



## faustao

Hi Danemama,

My vet didn't mention a reference range over the phone- but I requested the full results be e-mailed to me, so I should have them by tomorrow.
I found several "normal" ranges online, and they were all *roughly* 6-27ish. 
Would my vet have different reference numbers? Why?
Thanks!


----------



## DaneMama

faustao said:


> Hi Danemama,
> 
> My vet didn't mention a reference range over the phone- but I requested the full results be e-mailed to me, so I should have them by tomorrow.
> I found several "normal" ranges online, and they were all *roughly* 6-27ish.
> Would my vet have different reference numbers? Why?
> Thanks!


Seeing that you're from Canada, sometimes different countries use different values or measurement units for the blood work results. 

Examples: 

mg/dl
mmol/L
μmol/L
pmol/L
ng/mL

The same blood test can be run but results can be shown in several different ways depending on where you're located. 

Once you get full results, you should post the image up here for us to see :thumb:


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## faustao

Thanks, DaneMama.

You're right, the units are in mmol/L, not mg/dl. The upper normal limit for BUN in mmol/L is 9, and his was 18.
I found an online converter that says 18 mmol/L of urea corresponds to 50.42 mg/dl. So, that is definitely higher than normal, even for a raw fed dog. As I said earlier, his creatinine and all other levels were normal. I should add that before the blood collection, he had a full hour of very vigorous exercise so he was definitely dehydrated. He also had a raw meal 16 hours before the blood draw. 

Thanks!

ETA: I am picking up the full results today and will scan and post them.


----------



## faustao

I've got his full lab results here- a reminder to everyone else keep in mind most of these are in different units than what are used in the states.


----------



## KittyKat

If blood panels are cheap enough I may get one on Piper around her 2nd birthday when she gets spayed.


----------



## MollyWoppy

faustao said:


> I've got his full lab results here- a reminder to everyone else keep in mind most of these are in different units than what are used in the states.


What did your vet say? Was he concerned at all? I would say that as the creatinine is normal, then your pup's kidneys should be ok. It could pay to get a urinalysis done, just to check the gravity, that will help to confirm if there is anything to worry about.
Actually, if you have a look further back in this thread, you'll see where I posted Mollie's first blood test and some of her results were a bit off, which made me more than a touch concerned for 6 months or so. But, on her latest test, everything is absolutely hunky dory. 
Anyway, I'm just an amateur, I'm sure Danemama will give you her opinion pretty shortly, but I'd be surprised if there's anything to worry about.


----------



## Kat

Is it always best to fast a dog 12 hours or more before bloodwork is done? And collecting the first pee of the day and bringing it into the vet office is better than the dog peeing there?


----------



## MollyWoppy

Kat said:


> Is it always best to fast a dog 12 hours or more before bloodwork is done? And collecting the first pee of the day and bringing it into the vet office is better than the dog peeing there?


 Going by what I've learnt from Danemama, it's a big YES to both of your questions. In fact, 18 hours of fasting is better, if you can. 
Since you've got a pug though, I totally get it that 12 hours of fasting has them thinking they are being abused. 
Just try to make sure the pee container is sterilised first.


----------



## DaneMama

faustao said:


> Thanks, DaneMama.
> 
> You're right, the units are in mmol/L, not mg/dl. The upper normal limit for BUN in mmol/L is 9, and his was 18.
> I found an online converter that says 18 mmol/L of urea corresponds to 50.42 mg/dl. So, that is definitely higher than normal, even for a raw fed dog. As I said earlier, his creatinine and all other levels were normal. I should add that before the blood collection, he had a full hour of very vigorous exercise so he was definitely dehydrated. He also had a raw meal 16 hours before the blood draw.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> ETA: I am picking up the full results today and will scan and post them.


That is elevated, that is for sure. But not so much to really cause concern. I would however get a recheck done within the next few months just to see if this is a trend of single event reading. Keep us posted! 



Kat said:


> Is it always best to fast a dog 12 hours or more before bloodwork is done? And collecting the first pee of the day and bringing it into the vet office is better than the dog peeing there?


Yep to both! 



MollyWoppy said:


> Going by what I've learnt from Danemama, it's a big YES to both of your questions. In fact, 18 hours of fasting is better, if you can.
> Since you've got a pug though, I totally get it that 12 hours of fasting has them thinking they are being abused.
> Just try to make sure the pee container is sterilised first.


You're such a good student...A + :thumb:


----------



## Caty M

KittyKat said:


> If blood panels are cheap enough I may get one on Piper around her 2nd birthday when she gets spayed.


I paid around $175 here in Alberta for a senior panel.. not sure what it would be like in Ontario.. if you're in Toronto it's probably similar, less if you're in rural ON.

I thought Piper was going to be shown?


----------



## KittyKat

Caty M said:


> I paid around $175 here in Alberta for a senior panel.. not sure what it would be like in Ontario.. if you're in Toronto it's probably similar, less if you're in rural ON.
> 
> I thought Piper was going to be shown?


She was shown, and she's already got her champion title. Now we are focusing on lure coursing. She's racing this weekend actually... out of a box!

Now we also have Flynn and I don't want to neuter until he's over a year old as well. Fun fact: Flynns balls never dropped!


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Kat

Here are Rubys results for her blood work. I just copy and pasted it from my online vet account so hopefully it works. Some things are a bit above normal range, I dont know if its something to be worried about or if its fine though... The lymphs one worries me, shes at 34% when the normal range is 12-30%... its not much higher than the average, but I dont get what could cause it to be higher. Im expecting a call from my vet to discuss the blood work results. The normal range is in the brackets ()
And the ALT(SGPT) is 331 when the norm is 12-118.. but I dont know what that even stands for. 

Test Result Normal Ranges 
Phosphorus 1.20 mmol/L (0.81-1.94) 
Alk Phosphatase 35 U/L (5-131) 
Bun/Creatinine Ratio 111 Ratio ( - ) 
GGTP <5 U/L (1-12) 
Total Protein 61 g/L (50-74) 
ALT(SGPT) 331 U/L (12-118) 
Globulin 25 g/L (16-36) 
Albumin 36 g/L  (27-44) 
AST(SGOT) 54 U/L (15-66) 
Albumin/Globulin Ratio 1.4 Ratio (0.8-2.0) 
Bilirubin,Total 4.1 umol/L (0.0-5.1) 
Creatinine 85 umol/L (44-141) 
BUN 9.4 mmol/L (2.1-11.1) 
Glucose 5.1 mmol/L (3.9-7.7) 
RBC 7.6 1012/L (4.8-9.3) 
Sodium/Potassium Ratio 31 Ratio (27-38) 
Chloride 111 mmol/L (102-120) 
Lipase 561 U/L (77-695) 
Amylase 317 U/L (290-1125) 
WBC 7.7 109/L (4.0-15.5) 
CPK 146 U/L (59-895) 
Cholesterol 7.84 mmol/L (2.38-10.0) 
Hemoglobin 185 g/L (121-203) 
Neutrophils 59 % (60-77) 
Hematocrit 56 % (36-60) 
Platelet Estimate Adequate (Adequate) 
Eosinophils 4 % (2-10) 
Monocytes 3 % (3-10) 
Basophils 0 % (0-1) 
Absolute Lymphs 2.62 109/L (0.69-4.50) 
Bands 0 % (0-3) 
Accession Result ID MIAA04918737 () 
Superchem ( - ) 
Potassium 4.6 mmol/L (3.6-5.5) 
Sodium 144 mmol/L (139-154) 
Complete Blood Count ( - ) 
Triglycerides 1.45 mmol/L (0.33-3.32) 
Absolute Monocyte 0.23 109/L (0-0.84) 
Absolute Bands 0.00 109/L (0-0.30) 
MCHC 330 g/L (300-380) 
Calcium 2.54 mmol/L (2.23-2.85) 
Absolute Neutrophils 4.54 109/L (2.06-10.60) 
T4 48 nmol/L (10-45) 
Magnesium 0.9 mmol/L (0.7-1.3) 
Platelet Count 326 109/L (170-400) 
Lymphs 34 % (12-30) 
MCH 24 pg (19-28) 
MCV 74 fL (58-79) 
T4 ( - ) 
Absolute Basophil 0.00 109/L (0-0.15) 
Absolute Eosinophil 0.31 109/L (0-1.20)


----------



## xellil

I believe the ALT is liver function but I could be wrong. That one would worry me a little because it's so far out of range - I will be interested to see what your vet says. Since DaneMama is on vacation we can't get her thoughts.


----------



## Kat

Just got off the phone with my vet. She said the other levels are normal, even if they are ever so slightly elevated, but not by much at all which she said is common in raw fed dogs.

For the ALT, she said it is liver function, and it could be possible she has an infection with her liver. I have two options, either just leave it and re-check it in a month because it could just be a one time thing, or put her on Clavomax for 2 weeks and in case there is an infection and recheck it 2 weeks after the antibiotics are done.

I dont like using antibiotics if I really dont have to. If this was your dog, would you do the antibiotics then recheck, or would you just recheck in a month? 

She says its only slightly worrying, if it was over 500 then it would be something really serious. But yeah, those are my two options, advice please? Im trying not to panic/worry too much, but its hard not to.


----------



## xellil

Kat said:


> Just got off the phone with my vet. She said the other levels are normal, even if they are ever so slightly elevated, but not by much at all which she said is common in raw fed dogs.
> 
> For the ALT, she said it is liver function, and it could be possible she has an infection with her liver. I have two options, either just leave it and re-check it in a month because it could just be a one time thing, or put her on Clavomax for 2 weeks and in case there is an infection and recheck it 2 weeks after the antibiotics are done.
> 
> I dont like using antibiotics if I really dont have to. If this was your dog, would you do the antibiotics then recheck, or would you just recheck in a month?
> 
> She says its only slightly worrying, if it was over 500 then it would be something really serious. But yeah, those are my two options, advice please? Im trying not to panic/worry too much, but its hard not to.


Don't panic! I'm sure all will be well, especially since she said it wasn't super high.

Why don't you ask over in the holistic area and maybe Liz or someone else can tell you how to calm the liver? I know six months ago I would have done the antibiotics, but I bet there is a better way.


----------



## CoverTune

Milk Thistle is a good liver supplement...

Personally, I would just leave it and re-check in a month.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## MollyWoppy

If it was Mollie, I'd leave it and retest her again in a month. Then, if the levels were still high, or hadn't come down, I'd start her on milkthistle which is great for the liver. Then retest to see if that's made a difference. If it doesn't, then you start the diagnoses as to why.
But, don't worry, your pup is young, I'd be very surprised if there was something wrong. One of Mol's ALT was high the first time she had her tests done, (not as high as your's though), but it was right back to normal on the next test.
Did your pup have a lot of beef or beef liver or salmon before the test? From what I've read, that can cause a temporary increase as well.


----------



## xellil

I am coming to believe those test ranges are not made for dogs eating raw food.

i think the milk thistle is a wonderful idea. Wish I'd thought of it


----------



## Kat

I will list her Sunday and Monday meals,

Sunday:
Breakfast - sardines with egg
Dinner - bone in chicken with lamb liver

Monday:
Breakfast - Pork with beef
Dinner - Bone-In chicken with lamb liver

Lamb liver was a new intro since Friday also, I used to do chicken liver. 

She was fasted for 15 hours before blood work, and she didnt drink any water for 12 hours (She doesnt drink water if she hasnt eaten anything). 

I was thinking of right away using Milk Thistle or whatever Liz suggests to flush the liver then retest in a month. It costs 80$ to retest, so I would prefer to do the liver flush then retest instead of doing nothing, and retesting, because if its still high then I would have to do the flush and pay another 80$ to retest again. 

Magicre, so its ok that her lympholytes are slightly elevated? I was worried about that as well.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Kat

I got her up to get full amount of 2.80 oz a week of liver. Should I maybe just stick with chicken liver? Or is it ok to continue with lamb liver? I wanted to intro lamb heart and kidney next week too (im getting an order of lamb heart, kidney, and liver). 

Thats what my vet said too, it could have just been a one time thing with her blood work. She called it a "fluke" lol. 

Making sure she is hydrated is difficult when she is fasted, because she doesnt drink water unless she has eaten, shes always been like that, even on kibble. Should I give her some no salt added chicken broth on the morning of her next blood test? Also, with her meals, I do add water into her bowl too, especially with lamb and sardines, since the lamb is more bloody and the sardines give the water flavour too.

Here is her entire feeding schedule, with supplements listed at the end

MONDAY
Breakfast: Pork (4 oz.)
Dinner: Bone-in Chicken with Liver 
(3.50 oz. + .50 oz.)

TUESDAY
Breakfast: Sardines with Farm Fresh Egg (4.50 oz.)
Dinner: Lamb with Beef 
(3.50 oz. + .50 oz.)

WEDNESDAY
Breakfast: Pork 
(4 oz.)
Dinner: Bone-in Duck with Liver 
(3.50 oz. + .50 oz.)

THURSDAY
Breakfast: Lamb 
(4 oz.)
Dinner: Pork with beef 
(3.5 oz. + .50 oz.)



FRIDAY
Breakfast: Turkey and/or Rabbit 
(4 oz.)
Dinner: Bone-in Chicken with Liver 
(3.50 oz. + .50 oz.)

SATURDAY
Breakfast: Pork with Beef 
(3.50 oz. + .50 oz.)
Dinner: Lamb	
(4 oz.) 

SUNDAY
Breakfast: Sardines with Farm Fresh Egg
(4.50 oz.)
Dinner: Bone-in Chicken with Liver
(3.50oz. + .50 oz.)

Supplements: 
- ½ teaspoon organic extra virgin coconut oil once per day
- Sprinkle of acidophilus capsule once per day
- ½ teaspoon organic apple cider vinegar every other day diluted with 1 teaspoon water


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Kat

No, 5.60 oz is 10% for her organs. 2.80oz is for liver, and 2.80oz for kidney. Should I do organs as 5% of her diet then? So it would be 2.80oz total organ per week?

Canned sardines yes, the Brunswick brand packed in spring water. I also rinse them with bottled water a few times, then let them site in bottled water in the dish for 2 minutes, rinse again, and feed. 200mg of sodium per 84g drained can.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Kat

Really? Im surprised, Iv read others on this forum feed the Brunswick canned sardines. But that is good to know. Wouldnt they be naturally salty anyways though, since they are salt water fish? So... should I not feed any fish in Rubys diet anymore and just use fish oil? I have SISU brand salmon oil. 

So I should still stick with the 10% organs weekly?


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Kat

She wasnt a fan of fish anyway... so Im sure if Ruby knew how, she would thank you for telling me to stop the fish :tongue: I will use up the rest of the Sisu salmon oil, then switch to nordic naturals, I know my friend sells that one at her store. have not seen the carlsons brand there though.

Ruby was getting sardines breakfast sunday and breakfast tuesday. I switched it to turkey with quail or chicken egg sunday and rabbit tuesday, both days using one capsule of salmon oil. Is that ok?


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Kat

Thanks Re, this is the one I have now SISU Products and it is soy free. When I am done the bottle I will look for the one you suggested 

Also, I dont think you gave me an answer to this question, should I still stick with the 10% organ (which is 5.60 oz a week) or should I decrease the weekly organ amount?


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## wolfsnaps88

Here is Sargeant's blood work. Sorry for the terrible picture quality, I do not own a scanner. 






























His cholesterol is a little bit high and his MCHC is low (can someone tell me what that is?). Other than that, everything is in range. 

He has been fed raw part time since 2007 and full time for four months.


----------



## wolfsnaps88

On the first picture (his urine test Multistix) I cut off part of the page. For blood it says small +.

So, blood in the urine? That can't be good.


----------



## xellil

MCHC is hemoglobin level I think. It is barely, barely low. I don't know that i'd even consider that out of range.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## wolfsnaps88

What do you make of the elevated cholesterol?


----------



## xellil

wolfsnaps88 said:


> What do you make of the elevated cholesterol?


I have no idea about the cholesterol - I know Donna's dog has so much cholesterol in his blood before they started raw the vet was amazed. 

Now, this is what my vet told me about it last time Rebel's was done - he said often large dogs have fat in their blood that makes it hard to "spin" to do the test. I don't know whether that's bad or good, but that's what he told me. 

Rebel actually had very little so I wonder what food issues on raw would cause high cholesterol - my dogs eat more fat than probably 99% of dogs on raw.


----------



## wolfsnaps88

Sarge gets some fat but for the most part, he eats the leaner cuts so I am not sure what to do really. His results show only a slight elevation but you know how overly worried we dog parents can be....


----------



## xellil

wolfsnaps88 said:


> Sarge gets some fat but for the most part, he eats the leaner cuts so I am not sure what to do really. His results show only a slight elevation but you know how overly worried we dog parents can be....


I couldn't see that number. I didn't realize it wasn't elevated very much. I think it's probably like the other stuff, not worry-worthy even though of course we can't help it!

I wonder if dogs are like people - it seems like some just have a genetic predisposition to higher cholesterol levels.


----------



## wolfsnaps88

The cholesterol is in the third pic down. Normal ranges is 98 - 300 ans Sarge is at 355. My vet did tell me its only slightly elevated and she didn't seem concerned...but...my middle name is concern/worry and when its about my dogs it is a capital C for concern and when it is about Sargie Padoodles.....well.....it's CONCERN. 

LOL


----------



## xellil

wolfsnaps88 said:


> The cholesterol is in the third pic down. Normal ranges is 98 - 300 ans Sarge is at 355. My vet did tell me its only slightly elevated and she didn't seem concerned...but...my middle name is concern/worry and when its about my dogs it is a capital C for concern and when it is about Sargie Padoodles.....well.....it's CONCERN.
> 
> LOL


I know what you mean! For some dogs, everything either is a crisis, can turn into a crisis, or is a crisis waiting to happen.


----------



## DaneMama

I wouldn't worry about cholesterol being slightly elevated. If it were through the roof, then yes. But if you're that worried about it have blood work rechecked in a month or two.


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## twotonelover

Got Rosey's blood work back today. Her Potassium, A/G Ratio, MCHC and Lumphocytes were high (barely). Her TCD2(Bicarbonate) and NA/K Ratio were low, but again..barely. She got her blood work done at 10:45 am, and she hadn't eaten since 6 or 7pm the night before (she had pork that night, tripe and pork fat that morning). Anything you guys see that I should be concerned about? I know nothing is REALLY out of range, but I'm wondering if anything could be fixed with a few tweaks to her diet. I know she needs more organ variety (only eats liver and kidney atm). I'll be getting her urinalysis back soon. Whoever ran it the first time messed up so I have to bring in another sample...


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## twotonelover

Its hard to say what her staple is honestly. I suppose venison and beef? She has venison once a week at least, but the rest is generally a toss up of whatever is easiest to grab from the freezer haha I alternate bone-in with boneless meals generally. Her "meds" are just ACV 3x a week, fish oil daily, connectin every other day

The past two weeks looked like this:
S Chicken back, boneless venison
M Boneless venison, liver, egg, kidney
T Whole quail
W Boneless pork
T Boneless beef, duck foot
F Boneless beef
S Whole sardine
S Boneless beef, chicken foot
M Boneless venison, liver, egg, kidney
T Turkey neck
W Boneless venison
T Pork, tripe, pork fat
F Cornish hen quarter
S Boneless beef, pork fat


----------



## magicre

:usa::usa::usa::usa::usa::usa:


----------



## Nana52

Let's see if I did this right. Of course, there aren't really "raw fed" lab work, but the messed up liver/pancreas/triglyceride, blah, blah, blah that I've been rambling about for Kody.


----------



## xellil

Thanks. I bet DaneMama or another vet tech will give you an analysis of this - it's always good to see the whole thing.

From an absolutely layman's point of view it looks to me like things are drastically improved.


----------



## twoisplenty

Nana52 said:


> Let's see if I did this right. Of course, there aren't really "raw fed" lab work, but the messed up liver/pancreas/triglyceride, blah, blah, blah that I've been rambling about for Kody.
> 
> View attachment 7834
> 
> 
> View attachment 7835
> 
> 
> View attachment 7836


I would be very happy with these test results. There is vast improvement from March until June. I wouldnt worry, stick to your Raw feeding and retest in 4-6 mths time.


----------



## Nana52

I'm pleased with the alk phos for sure. Not normal but all things considered, much much better. The other crap is making me insane. 

Okay. I'm going to seriously try to calm down and go close my eyes for a while (with my boys cuddled in the bed with me).


----------



## gorge77

just sent my 2 dogs for their blood tests. everything is normal except for BUN which is pretty elevated. I don't know if it's considered "normal" for raw fed dogs & the fact that both dogs had similar elevated BUN levels. there hasn't been any change in their diet. is there any way to lower their BUN level?


----------



## naturalfeddogs

If I'm not mistaken, the BUN usually is higher in raw fed dogs. I know something is, just can't remember exactly which but it is normal.


----------



## Kat

Bun and creatinine is higher in raw fed dogs.


----------



## gorge77

but if BUN level is 2 x more than the normal range? should i be concerned?


----------



## MollyWoppy

RawDietBloodwork

Info on a Raw Food Diet Study and it's effects on Bun, Creatinine and Hematocrit levels is near the bottom of the article.


----------



## Boxers&Pom's Mom

MollyWoppy said:


> RawDietBloodwork
> 
> Info on a Raw Food Diet Study and it's effects on Bun, Creatinine and Hematocrit levels is near the bottom of the article.


I have a question for you. My daughter was asking me how I know that my dogs are getting the vitamins and minerals that they need with Raw Food? She said it is not in the regular bloodwork. How you will answer it?


----------



## naturalfeddogs

If I'm not mistaken, the blood work does only show how the organs are working at that time. Without the correct nutrition, the organs aren't going to function correctly. By feeding variety, you are getting all the correct vitamins and minerals needed for the organs to work correctly. If that makes any sense. Someone who knows more about that part will hopefully correct me, and clarify a bit.


----------



## bett

i'm not really a raw feeder (sometimes some chicken necks, as a snack) but i know as a home cooker, (sometimes that too) i add certain supplements (which i add with kibble too)....so, aren't you supposed to do that?

( i know, in the wild there are no supplements but maybe the animal naturally knows what they need and gets it elsewhere)

just asking,not wanting to start a huge debate. just wanted to know for my own knowledge .


----------



## naturalfeddogs

If you feed PMR, the whole point for all the needed nutrition is variety of different proteins, bones and organs. That is all a dog needs. The more the food is cooked, the more nutrition is cooked out, same as kibble. Therefore supplements are needed. But pure raw, in variety none are needed. In raw form, the meats, bones and organs provide all the vitamens and minerals needed.


----------



## MollyWoppy

Boxers&Pom's Mom said:


> I have a question for you. My daughter was asking me how I know that my dogs are getting the vitamins and minerals that they need with Raw Food? She said it is not in the regular bloodwork. How you will answer it?



I asked this same question a couple of years ago, and this is the written answer I got from a vet tech with many years experience. One I trust explicitly. 
"If bloodwork looks good all round it means the dogs major organ systems are functioning well. If they're not getting enough or the right nutrition, then they wouldn't work well.
Will it pinpoint what is missing or lacking? Not necessarily. It depends on the value that is above or below the normal range. One thing that you must take into consideration is that the normal ranges are based completely on kibble fed dogs. There are some values that are just naturally off a bit with raw fed dogs. PCV or the hematocrit values can be much higher with raw fed dogs. BUN is typically higher as well, same for BUN/creatinine ratio. These are kidney values which will be lower with dogs fed a low protein diet (the average reference range is based on these kinds of diets). Since raw diets are all nearly exclusively protein, these values will just be naturally higher as well. BUT it's a good idea to check urine at the same time because if the BUN values are slightly elevated it can mean mild kidney disease....BUT only if the urine is NOT well concentrated. Almost all of my dogs have had slightly elevated BUN values but highly concentrated urine. Which means their kidneys are working well!"


----------



## Kat

Results of Oscars first blood work. His platelet count it high, and his lymphs are slightly elevated. And hemoglobin is a little low. In the brackets is the normal range 


Details
Test Result Normal Ranges
WBC	11.7 109/L	(4.0-15.5)
Glucose	6.0 mmol/L	(3.9-7.7)
Globulin	21 g/L	(16-36)
Total Protein	57 g/L	(50-74)
Albumin	36 g/L	(27-44)
Comment(s) ( - )
Complete Blood Count ( - )
Accession Result ID	MIAA06052130 ()
Hematocrit	38 %	(36-60)
Alk Phosphatase	125 U/L	(5-131)
RBC	8.7 1012/L	(4.8-9.3)
ALT(SGPT)	18 U/L	(12-118)
BUN	8.2 mmol/L	(2.1-11.1)
Hemoglobin	112 g/L	(121-203)
Pre-Op Screen ( - )
Creatinine	49 umol/L	(44-141)
MCH	13 pg	(19-28)
Absolute Eosinophil	0.23 109/L	(0-1.20)
MCV	44 fL	(58-79)
Platelet Estimate	Increased (Adequate)
Platelet Count	690 109/L	(170-400)
Neutrophils	56 %	(60-77)
MCHC	295 g/L	(300-380)
Bands	0 %	(0-3)
Heartworm Antigen ( - )
Absolute Monocyte	0.47 109/L	(0-0.84)
Basophils	0 %	(0-1)
Eosinophils	2 %	(2-10)
Anisocytosis	Moderate	( - )
Remarks ( - )
Occult Heartworm Antigen	Negative	( - )
Absolute Basophil	0.00 109/L	(0-0.15)
Absolute Neutrophils	6.55 109/L	(2.06-10.60)
Lymphs	38 %	(12-30)
Absolute Bands	0.00 109/L	(0-0.30)
Absolute Lymphs	4.45 109/L	(0.69-4.50)
Monocytes	4 %	(3-10)


----------



## Kat

And Rubys blood work. Sadly, her ALT is still elevated. I may have to keep her on milk thistle long term. First blood work she was at 331, the two months later it went down to 168, now it went up again to 183. 


( - )
Phosphorus	0.83 mmol/L	(0.81-1.94)
Alk Phosphatase	22 U/L	(5-131)
Globulin	29 g/L	(16-36)
ALT(SGPT)	183 U/L	(12-118)
Calcium	2.52 mmol/L	(2.23-2.85)
A/G Ratio	1.2 Ratio	(0.8-2.0)
Glucose	5.8 mmol/L	(3.9-7.7)
Accession Result ID	MIAA06052149 ()
BUN	9.8 mmol/L	(2.1-11.1)
AST(SGOT)	47 U/L	(15-66)
Vetscreen ( - )
Bilirubin,Total	3.5 umol/L	(0.0-5.1)
Albumin	35 g/L	(27-44)
Creatinine	89 umol/L	(44-141)
Total Protein	64 g/L	(50-74)
RBC	7.3 1012/L	(4.8-9.3)
Absolute Lymphs	1.94 109/L	(0.69-4.50)
MCV	71 fL	(58-79)
Platelet Count	371 109/L	(170-400)
MCHC	348 g/L	(300-380)
MCH	25 pg	(19-28)
Sodium	144 mmol/L	(139-154)
Hemoglobin	181 g/L	(121-203)
Absolute Basophil	0.08 109/L	(0-0.15)
Occult Heartworm Antigen	Negative	( - )
Platelet Estimate	Adequate (Adequate)
Heartworm Antigen ( - )
Chloride	111 mmol/L	(102-120)
Sodium/Potassium Ratio	32 Ratio	(27-38)
Cholesterol	9.61 mmol/L	(2.38-10.0)
CPK	155 U/L	(59-895)
Eosinophils	3 %	(2-10)
Monocytes	4 %	(3-10)
Absolute Monocyte	0.32 109/L	(0-0.84)
Complete Blood Count ( - )
Bands	0 %	(0-3)
Lymphs	24 %	(12-30)
Absolute Neutrophils	5.51 109/L	(2.06-10.60)
Hematocrit	52 %	(36-60)
Absolute Eosinophil	0.24 109/L	(0-1.20)
Comment(s) ( - )
WBC	8.1 109/L	(4.0-15.5)
Basophils	1 %	(0-1)
Absolute Bands	0.00 109/L	(0-0.30)
Potassium	4.5 mmol/L	(3.6-5.5)
Neutrophils	68 %	(60-77)


----------



## TanktheMastiff

I got Tank's lab work back yesterday & everything looks great ! She's 11 months old and been on a raw diet for 6+ months now.


----------



## DaneMama

It's been a while since I posted bloodwork on the girls. I've gotten almost all of theirs updated this year, Shiloh is the only one left and isn't due for a few more months. 

Everyone has been doing great! Happy, healthy, no problems! 

Bailey:






































Zuri: 




























Emmy: 










Akasha: 










Panda:


----------



## DaneMama

And the Dane Gang!


----------



## naturalfeddogs

Every time I see a picture of your crew Natalie, I just can't help but wonder where there is any room for you and Jon! LOL


----------



## DaneMama

naturalfeddogs said:


> Every time I see a picture of your crew Natalie, I just can't help but wonder where there is any room for you and Jon! LOL


Um...there's hardly any room! But we wouldn't have it any other way LOL


----------



## SonyaBullyDog

Sonya just had her senior panel done to prepare her for anesthesia (dental cleaning and tooth extraction). She is a bull terrier, 4 yrs old, and has been eating raw for 2.5 years.


----------



## BrownieM

T's bloodwork. 2yo male standard poodle, raw fed.















HGB is slightly high, what does that indicate?


----------



## DaneMama

HGB is just the measure of how much hemoglobin they have in their blood. Not a problem at all for your boy!


----------



## britt0325

I love the idea of sharing blood work. 

I just had my dogs blood work done this past week. I had to laugh when the vet called me up and told me that he wished his blood work was as good as my dogs lol. 

I'm extremely happy. Everything was in the normal range. The only things that were elevated were HGB and HCT and those were by points, not even whole numbers. The reference range for the HGB is 12-18g/dL and his was 18.3 and the HCT reference range is 37-55% and his was at 55.7. Everything else was perfect. I did do some reading about the HGB and HCT levels and the only thing I can think is that he was somewhat dehydrated. I had fasted him for over 12hrs from his dinner the night before and he isn't really a big drinker. I usually mix in a little water with his premade just to make sure he gets enough and his urine is always usually a clear light yellow except for first thing in the morning. I forgot to get a urinalysis done but he'll be getting another blood test done in January since I get his blood work done every 6 months so I'll do it then. 

He's been eating a premade raw for the past year. Doing really well on it. Couldn't be happier. 

Although, I am a bit confused about the BUN levels. I was doing some reading about how raw can impact blood work and saw that the BUN can be elevated on a raw diet because of the higher protein. His BUN was only at an 8 though with the reference range being 7-27mg/dL. I mean, I'm not complaining, obviously it's great that his levels aren't elevated and his kidneys are functioning perfectly. Just wondering if that's abnormal on a raw diet.


----------



## buildabetterdog

When an animal(or human) is becoming deficient in something like a mineral, their body will leach out minerals from bones, muscle, and soft tissue to try to maintain the level that is needed. Therefore, particularly from the bones, mineral levels reduce very slowly and may not be reflected in a blood work-up but bone density and strength is suffering.
If you really want to be sure, find the daily requirements for the three major minerals(calcium, phosphorus, and magnesium and find USDA analysis for various meats. I think you will find that the amount going in is about 15 to 40% of daily requirements at best. There is an old computer term, gigo(garbage in, garbage out) meaning if there is not enough going in on a daily basis, sooner or later there is not enough available.


----------



## Dr Dolittle

britt0325 said:


> I love the idea of sharing blood work.
> 
> I just had my dogs blood work done this past week. I had to laugh when the vet called me up and told me that he wished his blood work was as good as my dogs lol.
> 
> I'm extremely happy. Everything was in the normal range. The only things that were elevated were HGB and HCT and those were by points, not even whole numbers. The reference range for the HGB is 12-18g/dL and his was 18.3 and the HCT reference range is 37-55% and his was at 55.7. Everything else was perfect. I did do some reading about the HGB and HCT levels and the only thing I can think is that he was somewhat dehydrated. I had fasted him for over 12hrs from his dinner the night before and he isn't really a big drinker. I usually mix in a little water with his premade just to make sure he gets enough and his urine is always usually a clear light yellow except for first thing in the morning. I forgot to get a urinalysis done but he'll be getting another blood test done in January since I get his blood work done every 6 months so I'll do it then.
> 
> He's been eating a premade raw for the past year. Doing really well on it. Couldn't be happier.
> 
> Although, I am a bit confused about the BUN levels. I was doing some reading about how raw can impact blood work and saw that the BUN can be elevated on a raw diet because of the higher protein. His BUN was only at an 8 though with the reference range being 7-27mg/dL. I mean, I'm not complaining, obviously it's great that his levels aren't elevated and his kidneys are functioning perfectly. Just wondering if that's abnormal on a raw diet.


Brit, That BUN on a raw diet is great! be thankful!


----------



## Dr Dolittle

Dog Fancy is hardly a good place for valid info but I am almost sure I saw a short article in their on a University study had showed raw fed dogs had higher BUN and Creatinine numbers consistently. hey we're higher but still within the so called normal level. As others have said, blood work is just a snap shot but it provides a benchmark or a baseline of what is normal for that dog so as they age we can notice elevations that are a red flag. A healthy dog being fed raw may be working their kidneys a little harder, thus the higher levels within normal it if at an older age we see they aren't concentrating urine and levels are elevated, it is time to lower that protein, increasing the quality and using some non meat proteins, which have no nitrogen waste for those compromised kidneys to deal with. Again, these changes are only needed if the blood work shows renal compromise. One could argue, as I believe, that if you are feeding kibble, changing to a senior or geriatric profile as a preventative seems to make sense and has no down size. I know of dogs and cats with the earliest detected kidney issues that were brought down to normal levels simply by putting them on a renal friendly diet. The blood does tell quite a story. adly, dogs will have a wonderful coat and look fabulous while kidney disease progresses. Most of us wouldn't notice anything till about 2/3 of kidney function is gone. A testament to how well kidneys are designed but really making blood work for geriatric dogs a must.


----------



## MollyWoppy

A bit more info:
Dr. Jean Dodds' Pet Health Resource Blog | UPDATED SECOND PROGRESS REPORT: Study of Microalbuminuria in Dogs Fed Raw Food Diets


----------



## GoingPostal

GoingPostal said:


> Jersey's results from her surgery yesterday (TPLO) 7 years old, 2 months on raw, fasted
> ALKP 12 , Ref range 23-212 U/L
> ALT 10, Ref range 10-100 U/L
> BUN 13, Ref Range 7-27 mg/dl
> CREA 1.3, Ref Range .5-1.8 mg/dl
> GLU 135, Ref Range 74-143 mg/dl
> TP 7.5, Ref Range 5.2-8.2 g/dl


Her results on 9/29/14 before her 2nd tplo

ALKP 34 (23-212)
ALT 37 (10-100)
BUN 34 (7-27)
CREA 1.1 (0.5-1.8)
GLU 111 (70-143)
TP 6.6 (5.2-8.2)
ALB 3.3 (2.2-3.9)
alb/gl=1
bun/cr=31


She had bloodwork done this year before a dental too but must not have gotten a copy.


----------

