# He won't eat today..



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

Well since I'm new here I'll post my intro again, just to give the back-story.. 

"Hello everybody! My name is Tom, I live in Ca. My girlfriend and I adopted a miniature poodle (or possibly mix) last year and recently have begun experimenting with making food for him. I have been all over the net looking for ideas and advice, but figured nothing beats being able to ask questions so I decided to find an appropriate forum.. 
Looking forward to learning from you all, I'm sure I've got a great deal of good information to read here without even asking. 
What we're doing now is buying whole chickens for ourselves, breaking them down into multiple bags for the freezer. Breasts, legs, thighs for us; necks, wings, backs, and giblets for the dog. 
I grind all his parts (bones and all) very small, and use 20% veggies in the mix. Current veggie mix was sweet potato, broccoli, and apple. I add a splash of apple cider vinegar as well. 
I package up 1/2 cups for his meal and they go in the freezer and he gets 2 a day. 
So far we have noticed he has much less anxiety, though I'm not too fast to attribute causation. I think mainly he just doesn't eat dog food unless he's starving, and I know I get cranky and obsessive when I'm hungry too, lol. So I think it's just a matter of him liking what he's eating more than any magical benefits at the moment. 

Any advise and ideas are appreciated! 

Thanks.."

Everything seemed to be going well (third day, though day one was half and half kibble and raw), but today when I offered his food, he turned away from it. 
My girlfriend walked him this morning (no poop) and told me he's very interested in eating a ton of grass. 
I came home just now to try again- won't eat, and then a walk and all he wants to do is eat grass. 

He's not really acting sick in any other way, just kind of lazy and won't eat his chicken. 

I wonder if he's just constipated- Maybe the pasty stuff I'm feeding him just isn't moving the way that kibble would have? We still have his kibble and I could feed him half and half for a while, but he's not interested in anything for the moment. 

Is this pretty normal when getting started?

Thanks in advance..


----------



## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Yes, the "pasty stuff" coulld very well be the problem. It's another reason not to feed ground food. Fast him for a day and see if he doesn't produce a little stool. Be sure he has plenty of water available.


----------



## Lynn In Tenn (Aug 20, 2009)

Hey tom e,
I just started the raw diet yesterday and did it cold turkey.No more kibble. Just raw chicken. I'm not seeing any problems yet, and my dogs are all standing and waiting at my feet at feeding time. Not even any trouble with the old 15y/o girl.
Now I must admit, I'm not going to be a very good "Poop Police":smile: That's kinda hard to do on a farm.


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

Thanks for the answers. 
Looks like we'll be buying more chickens soon! I'd hate to waste all that meat I ground up, do you think maybe a half serving and two wings would work for a meal? 
Yeah Lynn, we definitely notice the bowel movements since we're coming home from the walk with an empty poop bag, lol. Anyway, I already knew something was fishy since he didn't devour the chicken with gusto that he normally does. 

Maybe we'll just skip Kung Fu tonight and take him to the park to run around crazy, see if we can fix him up that way.


----------



## Lynn In Tenn (Aug 20, 2009)

Good luck tom e:smile:


----------



## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

I would read the sig. in RFD's page and follow those suggestions to feeding raw, there really is no reason to add the veggies to a carnivore's diet, just plain ol raw meat will do great. Good Luck!


----------



## BGBY (Sep 22, 2009)

Yeah, I thought I read somewhere <so many things I've been reading> that ground bone will cause constipation. Also, once you start RAW you should not feed kibble because it can back the meat up in the gut and make it rot and give tummy troubles because the kibble takes longer to digest than RAW. 

Hope he takes a good dump soon and can get back to eating RAW.


----------



## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Yeah, I'd say fast him for the day and then see how he does with just raw food (pasty stuff and wings). You don't want to waste it, and while ground raw pretty much takes a lot of the benefits of raw away, it is still way better than kibble could ever hope to be.


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Yeah, I'd say fast him for the day and then see how he does with just raw food (pasty stuff and wings). You don't want to waste it, and while ground raw pretty much takes a lot of the benefits of raw away, it is still way better than kibble could ever hope to be.


Thanks rannmiller, that's what I'm thinking too. I can't fathom tossing out that good food just cause it's got a little bit of veggy juice and pulp in it. 
He's back at the food again though folks. Ate a bunch of grass and took a dump and was ready to eat again, lol. 

Honestly I think his problem is more exercise related than the food. My GF and I were talking about this and even though we were more aware of it than usual yesterday (because we're just nervous about starting a new diet) this has happened quite a few times in the past. It's just that usually it's more of an oddity that we don't really fuss over. He really wants to be a very active little dog, and our walks are just 3 times a day around the block + a bit of chase the squeeky toy inside. 

We decided to start really taking him to the dog park at least 3 times a week to let him get some serious sprinting in.


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

You know, I thought now would be a good time for me to finally mention what problems Jax has been having that led us to looking for other foods.. I'm curious whether others have seen things like this go away with proper feeding.

Jax has runny eyes like lots of poodles, maybe a little bit worse than most actually. He's also got this weird thing with his throat where he's gulping all the time and swallowing- sort of licking the air as he does it. It was sort of funny at first, but then one day when I had a cold coming on, I noticed that as my throat was getting sore, it swelled up and wasn't feeling right inside. As a result I kept sort of reflexively swallowing as if I could fix it by getting something down that was in the way.. It was kind of an epiphany, and I do think that he has something similar to that. Maybe allergy related. We had taken him to the vet, they gave him a course of antibiotics for kennel cough and it had no effect whatsoever on the problem. They've also felt his throat for tracheal collapse and he doesn't seem to have that problem (thank god). 

Anyway other health issues he seems to have is that when he drinks water, invariably he chokes after he lifts his head up. I mean like every time. It's as if the throat is swollen and water is sitting up against the swelling- so that he finishes swallowing, but that bit of water moves down the throat after he lifts his head. It's very strange..

He throws up a lot. Well, not a lot like you would if you had the flu really bad. He keeps most food down. But about 3 times a week maybe and it's usually after a choking fit with the water. Actually that's mostly gone away after we stopped using a really expensive food that I won't name- and switched him to a 'cheaper' kibble- and he HASN'T done it even once since we switched him to raw. 

And lastly he's got really tartar coated teeth. I think he was probably a street dog for quite a while (he had really badly felted hair- like one solid piece- when we picked him up from the pound- I cut and peeled it off him like a coat). I'm hoping that they will come clean just from the meat and bone, and I won't have to have him get a cleaning.. Do you guys think that's a reasonable expectation or would you go ahead and do it and start him off with clean teeth?

Ok sorry for the novel here. We just want to do everything right by him...


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

Sorry for multiple posts! I thought I'd add a picture of him for you all!


----------



## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

tom e said:


> And lastly he's got really tartar coated teeth. I think he was probably a street dog for quite a while (he had really badly felted hair- like one solid piece- when we picked him up from the pound- I cut and peeled it off him like a coat). I'm hoping that they will come clean just from the meat and bone, and I won't have to have him get a cleaning.. Do you guys think that's a reasonable expectation or would you go ahead and do it and start him off with clean teeth?
> 
> Ok sorry for the novel here. We just want to do everything right by him...


The raw diet will clean his teeth up in just a few short weeks. Don't worry about them. If he has cavities, it won't help them but otherwise most any dental problem will go away. I have heard of loose teeth tightening up after switching to raw. Bad breath will disappear pretty quickly also.


----------



## Doc (Jan 17, 2009)

ifn dat old geyser up the way goes raw will his teef titin up? Hesa always yellin at me and Tater when go to da fishin hole by his house. Poor old coot jezt sitz in dat rocker and yells at folk when day pass by. Paw sayz heza bit touched in da haid. I wood lik ta fling a chickn lag at him.


----------



## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

tom e said:


> Sorry for multiple posts! I thought I'd add a picture of him for you all!


He's cute! Yeah I'd say give the teeth a chance to whiten up on their own, it worked for my dogs!


----------



## BGBY (Sep 22, 2009)

He is adorable! :smile:


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

Thanks everyone for the compliments! We love this dog. 
We're still going ahead with everything. He's not having any more troubles at the moment so it's full speed ahead. 
Just came back from the Mexican meat market with some beef liver, chicken legs and they threw in a bag of pork bones for free! Which brings me to my next question..
Is pork ok to feed raw? And pork bones are they fine? These are really large, but I can saw them up for him into workable pieces.
Also I noticed a great deal of people saying that one should start with chicken and give other stuff later. When is an ok time to start other meats? And is there any issue with liver and overdoing vitamins? 
I'm cutting up the chicken into servings in a moment, but all the rest will be portioned out and put in the freezer. 

Thanks again, for all the advice. It sure feels good to give him food that he enjoys.


----------



## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Read the link in RFD's signature, that should answer all of those questions and then some!


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Read the link in RFD's signature, that should answer all of those questions and then some!


Excellent! I read it before but must have forgotten. You're quite right, I just answered questions I didn't even know I had. 

It also reminded me that I have multiple bags of anchovies and sardines in the freezer which I bought from the bait guys at the harbor. 
We grilled a bunch of sardines the day we got them fresh, but the rest I just threw in the freezer not knowing what to do with them. They are completely whole too. Guess I know what to do with them now!


----------



## EnglishBullTerriers (Sep 10, 2008)

tom e said:


> It also reminded me that I have multiple bags of anchovies and sardines in the freezer which I bought from the bait guys at the harbor.
> We grilled a bunch of sardines the day we got them fresh, but the rest I just threw in the freezer not knowing what to do with them. They are completely whole too. *Guess I know what to do with them now!*


Exactly, you can send some this way!! Hehe! :biggrin: 
It sounds like you are getting off to a good start now. Keep up the good work! :wink:


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

I gave him his first whole chicken part with bone today. Really it took about 2 seconds for me to stop worrying. He 'knew' just what to do with it. Right to the edge of the mouth and crunch crunch crunch. I bought chicken quarter legs and divided them up drum, thigh, and back; he got a back today. 

This was after he refused my 'mix' again so I know he prefers to eat the whole meat and bone just as much as you all say it's best for him. 

Now he's rolling around on the carpet, rubbing his cheeks against it and saying 'Grominom, yip- granimom..' Which I think means he's a happy tiny wolf,


----------



## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Awww that's so cuuuuuute! He _is_ a happy tiny, curly wolf! I'm glad it's working so well for you. I had the same experience when my dogs first got whole meat with bone in it. I worried for the first two seconds but when i saw how happy they were and knew just what to do with it, I felt so happy to make them so happy and mad at myself for not doing it sooner!


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

Jumped another hurdle today. I was a little afraid of giving him legs or thighs because of the bigger bone in them. Last night I took out to thaw what I thought was a chicken back though, it turned out to be a leg- so he got it. 
Again I was quickly put at ease. When he crunched the bone, I took the first piece away from him and felt it.. No sharpness, in fact I was surprised at how crumbly and brittle that raw chicken bone actually is. 
Little by little I guess.


----------



## Lynn In Tenn (Aug 20, 2009)

Hey tom e,
How's the throat thing going??? Also the runny eyes.


----------



## tom e (Oct 7, 2009)

Lynn In Tenn said:


> Hey tom e,
> How's the throat thing going??? Also the runny eyes.


Still the same for now, but I'll be watching and be sure to post any changes.


----------

