# Found a breeder close by...they feed raw~!



## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

I am ecstatic!! 

My first experience with a breeder left much to be desired...it wasn't a negative experience per se, but I felt like Louis was just a business transaction to her. She never really followed up or responded to emails after we got him. So I said I would never do that again...

Anyways, so I've been browsing breeders and shelters for huskies and sammies...and I came across a couple within reasonable driving distance. However, I just put the websites on the back burner...I mean after all, it's so hard to judge a breeder by a website sometimes ya know? Well today Victor linked me one of the husky sites I checked out earlier in the week and mentioned that they feed raw. How did I miss that!!!??? I mean, what's better than a breeder feeding working/northern breeds what they were meant to eat?

I turned in my 2 weeks notice today and I will have a couple weeks of down time before I start my new job. I'm definitely going to go check out this breeder! So! super! excited!!! :biggrin:


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

When I first got married, my husbands family had Sammies and one of them 'adopted' me and came to live with us. She was our first dog together and people used to ask me if she was a white chow (little did I know way back then how that would play out!!)

I LOVE Sammies.....but huskies too. I'm so glad you've found a breeder that might work out for you. Gotta love all the northern breeds!!


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

So have they got a website? I'm curious now! You best take pictures...

I hope you are prepared to take up running! I think those of us who love sled dogs probably classify as a sick and twisted bunch, but I so would not have it any other way! :biggrin:


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

I'm so happy for you! Its hard to find breeders who feed raw. I hope it works out for you!


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

monkeys23 said:


> So have they got a website? I'm curious now! You best take pictures...
> 
> I hope you are prepared to take up running! I think those of us who love sled dogs probably classify as a sick and twisted bunch, but I so would not have it any other way! :biggrin:


Victor runs at least 7-10 miles a day and I try to do 4-5, so we figure he could take the husky and I can take the puny Louis on our runs. Plus there's always dog parks and such...definitely something we've been mentally preparing for.

Here's the site:
Celtic Acres Farm

We just want to visit first...see the dogs, see the environment...see if their huskies are right for us etc. (oh yes...and allergies :frown. I'll let you guys know how it turns out! Getting an actual dog is still far away (at least that's what I'm telling myself :sing


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Eh, looking at them... I would pass on by. I see a LOT of red flags there. No health testing (only thing DNA reg does for you is make you able to prove parentage), they don't work their working breed , they bred their "wooly" (not acceptable under breed standard!!!!! Not okay for the betterment of the breed!!!) and tout the most popular (b&W, r&w) and an "unusual" (the piebald, its really not that unsual and there is a specific distance race line that is heavy piebald, but these dogs aren't related to them  ). To me all these are big red flags.

Please for the sake of Northern breeds, be a lot of more picky (even if it means a kibble fed kennel) about support an actual reputable breeder. Please! 

Have you looking into reputable rescues at all? So many Northern breeds get hosed every day.... and its better to get your dog of meh background from a reputable rescue than it is a less than stellar breeder. A nice young bitch would be able to starting too. :smile:

Frankly unless I started working at a good mushing kennel I would never get a Northern breed from a breeder. Too many crappy quality dogs bred only because they are pretty. And yeah I live with two of them that I got through rescue. Poor Scout is an extreme example of why to be picky, those poor Camp Husky dogs are so screwed up. You can't fix genetics unfortunately.

And I know this is a hot button with ya'll  , but IMO dog parks do MUCH more harm than good. Bikejoring or something would be a better outlet, but 7-10 miles of running (once its 12-18 months old.... be very careful not to overwork a puppy even if it is obnoxious) would be great too. Flirt pole and spring pole are AWESOME outlets for that prey drive and nonstop energy too.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i thought you were more interested in a samoyed.....


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

monkeys23 said:


> Eh, looking at them... I would pass on by. I see a LOT of red flags there. No health testing (only thing DNA reg does for you is make you able to prove parentage), they don't work their working breed , they bred their "wooly" (not acceptable under breed standard!!!!! Not okay for the betterment of the breed!!!) and tout the most popular (b&W, r&w) and an "unusual" (the piebald, its really not that unsual and there is a specific distance race line that is heavy piebald, but these dogs aren't related to them  ). To me all these are big red flags.
> 
> Please for the sake of Northern breeds, be a lot of more picky (even if it means a kibble fed kennel) about support an actual reputable breeder. Please!
> 
> ...


Sorry, I meant to respond to this yesterday but I saw your post on a bus ride back from NYC and I got home really late :frown:

So I wanted to thank you for the info! I do look at the rescue sites often...there was this girl in the shelter I wanted to visit a couple weeks back, but she already found a home hwell: Other than her, I haven't seen one that would be a good fit yet, but I will continue to check. I'm just worried with all the hoops some adoption agencies make you jump through, like the home visits and such. I feel like the fact that we live in a townhouse with no yard would go against us. But honestly I'm not especially keen on doing the whole puppy thing over again. Louis was already 12 weeks when we got him...this time if we got a dog from a breeder it would most likely come home at 8 weeks...that's 4 extra weeks of puppy torture! 

So the reason I was looking at breeders was because of health. I know to ask for OFA, SHOR info etc. If a breeder that we go to does not offer it, I will not get a puppy. But the problem with adopting...is that will be out of my control, right? 

And I hear what you are saying about the dog parks and I don't disagree. For the most part out dog will be our jogging companion. If all this doesn't work out, I could always wait until we can afford to move to a place with our own yard. I will still visit the breeder though, because I do want to find out how our allergies are with huskies. If I can play with a bunch of raw fed ones, that should hopefully give us an accurate idea of our allergy level.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

magicre said:


> i thought you were more interested in a samoyed.....


Still thinking and researching :biggrin: We want to meet and play with as many dogs as we can...I don't want to rush this decision, so this will be at least 6 months away...I hope


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

It's not necessarily true you won't know the background - when I got Rebel he came with AKC papers and I could research his original breeder. I also got information on his early life and later life before I got him.

Now, it wasn't good news - the breeder had been banned from the AKC for falsifying paperwork. It seems she was either a backyard breeder or has since gone out of business. So his bona fides are definitely suspect! But he doesn't have any genetic issues except his blue coat, and has been healthy since I got him.

Not all dogs are strays picked up off the street. Alot have been well loved - Rebel had a happy and well-socialized life with his original owner until she died when he was about four. It was what happened afterward that screwed him up, but because he had such good beginnings he is almost back to normal except for some minor neuroses that are manageable.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

I'll keep these things in mind when I'm looking...I think if I didn't already have a dog, I would be less picky. If I got a dog that needed some work with training and behavior, I could direct all my undivided attention to it. But since I have Louis, the last thing I want is to adopt a dog, and then realize for some reason that I can't care for it or that it has some behavioral issues and won't get along with Louis. Obviously I will do all that I can for a rescue dog that comes my way. And obviously if I did adopt or get an 8 week old puppy, I would never turn it away because it develops some unforseen health issues, I would just rather the odds be somewhat in my favor... hwell:


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

yep I agree - and one thing to keep in mind - I don't know how it is with alot of breeds, but with Dobermans genetic problems often show up as adults, but before they get older - like 2-3 years of age. 

since I got my dog when he was 6, I am pretty sure he won't drop dead of cardiomyopathy like alot of Dobies do at a relatively young age.

In the end, i think it's a crapshoot. Personally, I would rather get a little older dog where alot of problems would have already turned up, but then I haven't bought from a breeder so don't have that perspective on what a realistic expectation would be if the ancestors are ok.

good luck! I know you'll get the perfect companion for Louis.


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

I have a good hunch what Lily's background is and I know Scout's (which wasn't good!).

Most Northern breeds that end up in rescue are simply a case of the pet owner being completely unprepared for owning a smart athelete like that. Its pretty easy to get them acclimated to what you need.

If any rescue/shelter won't let you bring Louis and do introductions in a neutral place before any paperwork takes place.... go elsewhere! They should absolutely not only approve, but require the new dog meet the existing animals.


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## KlaMarie (Dec 30, 2010)

My breeder was the one who actually got me hooked on raw feeding :smile:

But quite of few red flags for me too on that breeder, just going by the website. The 3rd sentence on their home page tells you what their focus is: 

"We have all coat colors, coat patterns and eye colors. We even have the rare piebald husky puppies on occasion." 

It's all about the market for specific colors to them, not health or temperament. And over *20* breeding females!!! Wow, even if some of them are retired and others are too young to breed.....that's a lot of females and a LOT of litters at any one time. I would want a breeder who would be able to give each litter the attention they need, for early socialization and evaluating each pup. Not to even mention health certs and working ability. 

If you do decide to go with a reputable breeder, I'm sure there is one out there taking the time to do all the little (and big!) things necessary to have a quality breeding program, plus keeping their dogs on a good diet. Believe me, I did NOT have a dog when I was doing my research which made it even harder to resist the cute puppy faces. But patience, persistence, and not compromising my standards definately paid off in the end.

Good luck!! And I definately expect pics when you do add another dog/pup to your family :smile:!!!


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

From what I have read (and I really have no experience) is that a truly good breeder has a litter per year or less, is truly obsessive about where the pups go to, and never breeds for dollars.

There are alot of things I like about my trainer and I go to him for specific things, but i HATE that he breeds several litters of GDS a year, he has I think three bitches, and sets out the pens during training classes with the puppies to advertise the dogs. THEN you can continue to pay him for training!

Maybe he's good, maybe not. But I know I cringe when I see all the MORE puppies coming into the world.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

KlaMarie said:


> It's all about the market for specific colors to them, not health or temperament. And over *20* breeding females!!! Wow, even if some of them are retired and others are too young to breed.....that's a lot of females and a LOT of litters at any one time. I would want a breeder who would be able to give each litter the attention they need, for early socialization and evaluating each pup. Not to even mention health certs and working ability.


Actually, that thought crossed my mind too! I was looking at past litters and thinking how on earth do they have so many litters per year? Oh right...they have like 40 dogs... Ehhhh hwell:


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## KittyKat (Feb 11, 2011)

Yeah, a lot of females (eeep), and they are just using their own males(?!?)... which to me suggests inbreeding. I'm not seeing any with other kennel names... aka "Awesome Kennel's Flying Ben" or anything to suggest they are bringing in dogs from other locations for breeding.

Etc etc... a lot of red flags. I mean they (Celtic Acres) could be well intentioned or great breeders... but their site is lacking some serious information.

Edit: Upon looking at each page, it seems a few of them come from other kennels... one of which is still related to their own dogs (why?!). Seems like Piper actually comes from championship lines (but the key word is lines... her mom/dad are not champions).


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Yeah one random champion in a ped does not a good dog make...


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Here's a website from a reputable breeder as a counterpoint: Kaylenberg Siberian Huskies


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

monkeys23 said:


> Here's a website from a reputable breeder as a counterpoint: Kaylenberg Siberian Huskies


They devote as much information to their rescue work as their breeding on their home page. 

They have a bunch of weenie dogs too. Can't beat that!

Edited to add:
I'm really glad you posted that site - they give a great description of the websites of ethical vs. unethical breeders:
http://www.kaylenbergsiberians.com/

Which is timely considering what we were talking about in the pet store thread and i went out and found a teacup poodle site:
http://www.teacuppoodles.net/forsale.htm

Exactly what they said - no mention of parents, focus on puppies and not showing or working etc.


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