# Misinformation and Rampant User Error



## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

Just so you know...I decided to join the Doberman Forum (I own a 12 lb Doxie) and responded to a post wherein one of the Doberman owners was going out of their way to fail at raw feeding, their dog was clearly having issues, and the owner was trying to switch the dog back to kibble.

I encourage all of you to please post on your breed specific boards and educate the forum members to feed PMR correctly. All I did was to include Natalie's link for How to get started | Prey Model Raw

For anyone who has not frequented some of the breed specific forums, you would be shocked to read what others are feeding their respective dogs in their attempts to provide a "RAW" diet. 

I definitely feel alot of the criticism of raw is simply due to dog owners who have not been educated in the correct methods of feeding and introducing PMR. 

-- Tara (who just did her good deed for the day...)


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

Natalie and I used to spend a lot of time on the Danes Online Forum (Great Dane Club of America) helping the members with raw until we were both banned from there by a close minded moderator


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Yep, we got banned because I posted a link to our PMR blog. All because there's a link to this forum on the main page. The moderator there said we were "spamming" for other forums. Total


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## luvMyBRT (Mar 8, 2010)

I do the same with the Black Russian Terrier yahoo group. There have been a few members that have been interested in raw and I provided them with info and links. I am actually in the process of hopefully helping one of Duncan's litter mates begin the switch to raw. I am really hoping they decide to give it a try. :thumb:


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## luvMyBRT (Mar 8, 2010)

DaneMama said:


> Yep, we got banned because I posted a link to our PMR blog because there's a link to this forum on the main page. The moderator there said we were "spamming" for other forums. Total


Just wanted to clarify....I don't "like" yours and Jon's post because you got banned. I "like" it because you were trying to help and spread the good word on raw. That moderator must have been a total moron.


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

Uh oh! I hope I don't get banned from my poodle forum! I just created a thread with helpful links for anyone wanting to switch to a homemade diet. I included the link to Natalie's PMR site.


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

luvMyBRT said:


> Just wanted to clarify....I don't "like" yours and Jon's post because you got banned. I "like" it because you were trying to help and spread the good word on raw. That moderator must have been a total moron.


She's a complete idiot. I was actually banned for life for sending a link to DFC through PRIVATE MESSAGE. The owner claims that PMs aren't read by moderators but there's no other way they would have known I sent the link... total crap

The owner said he'd look into it and get back to me since I felt the ban was uncalled for. He stopped responding to emails a week later. I've tried following up for the past 6 months but all of the emails never receive a response.


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## martye (Mar 9, 2011)

I'll post this over at the Weimaraner forum, I've got to say there's a pretty active group
of raw feeders over there, they helped me quite a bit when I was first starting to ask
questions.
Natalie, I've got your blog bookmarked, found it pretty early on in my research, didn't
know that was you until just now (sometimes I KNOW my weim is smarter than me).

Marty


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## Kofismom (Sep 14, 2010)

> The owner said he'd look into it and get back to me since I felt the ban was uncalled for. He stopped responding to emails a week later. I've tried following up for the past 6 months but all of the emails never receive a response.


What a sad thing for that forum. 
I originally learned about raw from my bulldog site. The raw feeders there are very helpful, but we don't even begin to have the wisdom about raw that this forum does. Most of the raw feeders there love this site and recommend it whenever we get the chance.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

I personally think Jon and I got banned not for sharing information but for personal reasons. I feel that she had it out for Jon and I from the get go...which is a shame that other forums are governed by people who let their emotions drive their actions and not justifiable ones It's almost like she was fishing for a reason to ban us both and pounced at the first opportunity. Many other people had posted links to our blog/website but never got banned for it. So why us? Why not give a warning saying "please don't do that again"???

Oh well, I think we made a large enough impact while there in the raw forum that people still pay attention to better raw feeding techniques. My ban is up in November so I'll be back LOL

Sara- I know want you meant by your "like" and I appreciate it :thumb:

Marty- Yep the PMR website is owned and operated by Jon (jdatwood...who is also my SO) and I. I felt there wasn't a good thorough guide to get started on raw out there that included EVERYTHING in one spot. I'd love to know how many people it's helped...but I see plenty of people helped by it here which is good enough for me :wink:

And I know I haven't been good about updating the blog lately....Just been overly busy. I will make a post tonight if I get a chance!!! Let me know if anyone has any requests for a blog post!


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## Adam76 (Dec 24, 2010)

I have to say that I'm really glad I found this site, everyone hear is the best. Thanks:happy:


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## CavePaws (Jan 25, 2011)

That blog is what got me interested in PMR. :] Definitely provided me with a wonderful guide to start with. Then there was everyone here.

So thanks to Natalie and Jon for having an awesome blog on PMR. It sucks you guys were banned from a forum over dumb personal stuff. Banning someone for posting a link full of information...Sounds pretty personal. >:|


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## Boxers&Pom's Mom (Jan 17, 2011)

tem_sat said:


> Just so you know...I decided to join the Doberman Forum (I own a 12 lb Doxie) and responded to a post wherein one of the Doberman owners was going out of their way to fail at raw feeding, their dog was clearly having issues, and the owner was trying to switch the dog back to kibble.
> 
> I encourage all of you to please post on your breed specific boards and educate the forum members to feed PMR correctly. All I did was to include Natalie's link for How to get started | Prey Model Raw
> I do that all the time. Even in the Yahoo Groups are a lot of misinformation.
> ...


I do that all the time adding the link to Natalie's website and even here to some posts. Even in the Yahoo Groups are a lot of misinformation.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

jdatwood said:


> Natalie and I used to spend a lot of time on the Danes Online Forum (Great Dane Club of America) helping the members with raw until we were both banned from there by a close minded moderator


Shoot, I got you both beat. I was banned from there years ago. I can't remember how long ago but I'm thinking 5 or 6years. :biggrin:


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## Northwoods10 (Nov 22, 2010)

Oh I know all too well about getting "warned" for ridiculous accusations all because they have a personal problem with me! Have yet to be banned...but I've been "very close" apparently. 

*rolleyes*

I'm active on the lab board & GSP forums and this one is by far one of the most friendly. Have not found a lot of "drama" here.


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## Boxers&Pom's Mom (Jan 17, 2011)

Adam76 said:


> I have to say that I'm really glad I found this site, everyone hear is the best. Thanks:happy:


Amen! Also Adam I am happy that I found you.


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## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

In some ways I'm really lucky as raw feeding is rife amongst the rotti owners on rottweilers.net. One of the most active members is the author Carina McDonald, so she brings a lot of backing to the raw way of life. Ok she is still in the BARF days but any start is a good start.


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## Foxy (Jan 21, 2010)

I don't feed raw, but I pass on the info on a large Boston Terrier forum, I tell people looking for good info on RAW to check out this forum and there are no complaints about it there. WoofBoard.com for those with Bostons.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Thats their loss for banning you and Jon, for sure. I have been to a doberman forum in the past, and they were the most closed minded people in the world. If you weren't part of their "click" you were nothing to them. Needless to say, I found a great bunch of folks here!


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## Boxers&Pom's Mom (Jan 17, 2011)

naturalfeddogs said:


> Thats their loss for banning you and Jon, for sure. I have been to a doberman forum in the past, and they were the most closed minded people in the world. If you weren't part of their "click" you were nothing to them. Needless to say, I found a great bunch of folks here!


Same thing happen to me in the Boxer's Forum. You need to be very careful what you write there. Also, some Yahoo's Groups


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## tracydr (Feb 25, 2011)

There is a very good raw feeding sticky on the Doberman Talk site and many of the regulars feed a good PMR diet. That one person, though, was really destined to fail, I think, despite good advice.


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

Boxers&Pom's Mom said:


> You need to be very careful what you write there. Also, some Yahoo's Groups


Yep, I was banned from the Yahoo raw feeding group for using the term Prey Model Raw...


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## KlaMarie (Dec 30, 2010)

I've had experiences from both ends of the specturm on forums. The GSD forum has been absolutely great for me though (and of course this forum:wink . They have a pretty strong raw feeding sub-forum that has alot of good info. 

And then there are others.......that I probably never post on just because some of those people are so viscious and the mods are not involved at all. 

But this forum has been a great resources, so thanks!!!!


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

jdatwood said:


> Yep, I was banned from the Yahoo raw feeding group for using the term Prey Model Raw...


When did that happen? I haven't been banned from there yet. :biggrin:


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> When did that happen? I haven't been banned from there yet. :biggrin:


I'd have to look and see. Was sometime last year... I posted a response to someone's questions and they attacked me saying that my response seemed like too much of an "ad" for the PMR website. Then they went off on a tangent saying that they didn't support the term Prey Model Raw because Tom Lonsdale didn't approve of it... It ended by them telling me that maybe the list wasn't the right place for me LOL

Here's the reply I made to someone and the "moderators" response to me...



> > One of the biggest issues we run into when telling people about feeding raw
> > is they think it's way too expensive.
> >
> > Premium kibbles run $3-4/lb. We feed 4 dogs (70-120lbs) & 2 cats for
> ...





> Hi Jon,
> 
> Sorry to have to reject your first message.
> 
> ...


I was surprised how threatened they were by 
1. the term Prey Model Raw
2. the link to the PMR blog

Reminds me of how close minded the Danes Online forum is...


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

OK, thats not the rawfeeding list, which doesn't like Tom nor does he like them. This RMB list is based in the UK and follows Tom precisely. I used to talk to Jackie regularly and this sounds like her. The lady who owns the rawfeeding list is named Jane Anderson and I think she is in Australia. The main person on the Rawfeeding list is Chris and she would be the one who would ban you from THAT list based on what you wrote. :biggrin:


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## Onyxmom2 (Jan 10, 2011)

DaneMama said:


> Oh well, I think we made a large enough impact while there in the raw forum that people still pay attention to better raw feeding techniques. My ban is up in November so I'll be back LOL!


That is where I first heard of Raw! ;-)


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## Northwoods10 (Nov 22, 2010)

Its amazing what people will do when they have "moderator" powers. First and formost, its a public forum. When you post anything be prepared for all sorts of feedback......both negative and positive. Thats how opinions work, not everyone agrees...but everyone has one! 

I just now, as in within the last few hours got permanently deleted from the forum I used to be on the most...because the guy who runs the forum is friends with the moderator who apparently hates me. Yes, I have a strong opinion and I voiced it....isn't that what public forums are about? The subject happened to be about her...and she didnt like it. So, now...I'm gone. Kind of reminds me of our government sometimes. Sure, you can have an opinion....but will it be heard or allowed?


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

when I first started feeding raw, I searched for a site that would help me other sites I looked at did not have the information that is posted hear or the help from everyone I attempted to gather info from a yahoo site and got no response. I have to tell you I have become well informed just from this site and the info given and I thank everyone that ever responded to any of my questions


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## Loki Love (Jan 30, 2011)

Northwoods10 said:


> Its amazing what people will do when they have "moderator" powers. First and formost, its a public forum. When you post anything be prepared for all sorts of feedback......both negative and positive. Thats how opinions work, not everyone agrees...but everyone has one!


All forums are privately owned and operated - so yes, you are free to post as you like, but don't be surprised if the moderator ends up taking exception to it. Fair or not, it's how it works. I'm actively involved in various forums - some are definitely run better than others. I won't jump onto the forum bashing bandwagon though and start calling out other forums are run though - I'm sure the mods here wouldn't appreciate a thread started elsewhere based on this forum.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Boxers&Pom's Mom said:


> Same thing happen to me in the Boxer's Forum. You need to be very careful what you write there. Also, some Yahoo's Groups


I think I will just stay right here!


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

jdatwood said:


> I'd have to look and see. Was sometime last year... I posted a response to someone's questions and they attacked me saying that my response seemed like too much of an "ad" for the PMR website. Then they went off on a tangent saying that they didn't support the term Prey Model Raw because Tom Lonsdale didn't approve of it... It ended by them telling me that maybe the list wasn't the right place for me LOL
> 
> Here's the reply I made to someone and the "moderators" response to me...
> 
> ...


That is just CRAZY!! I can't believe there are people THAT closed minded. They know you know more than they do, and that scares them. Just my thaughts on it.


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## Herzo (Feb 5, 2011)

Ok don't ban me for this ha ha.But did you say you were new to the sight,I can't remember.It seems to me(and correct me if I'm wrong) some where on this sight there was someone that was warned aganist being to new and putting up web sights.Saying that, because of this thread I went on a Basset forum just yesturday and someone had a question about home cooked because of a health issue, and it was a little old so I posted about this forum.I was very carful to say I was new and since no one had posted to it I was hoping to help and hoped it was ok.So far no one has said anything but that was yesturday and I haven't checked it today.I did say I was going raw with my Basset because of ear problems.But I said there is home cooked dry and canned.There is a person that looked on the sight and was very happy I had suggested it.So maybe there will be another Basset person on here.Be it home cooked or just that they will look for better nutrition.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

Kofismom said:


> What a sad thing for that forum.
> I originally learned about raw from my bulldog site. The raw feeders there are very helpful, but we don't even begin to have the wisdom about raw that this forum does. Most of the raw feeders there love this site and recommend it whenever we get the chance.


if ever there was a breed deserving of raw.....bulldogs are it...: )

tell your bully friends to come on over : )


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

My yahoo groups for bull terriers has many different categories, raw feeding being one of them. They get new people who post questions about how to feed their B.T.'s a raw diet and they are very helpful in telling them that vegetables and grains are of no use to them and they only need; meat, bones and organs, they won't call it a PMR but I think it's pretty good.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Herzo said:


> Ok don't ban me for this ha ha.But did you say you were new to the sight,I can't remember.It seems to me(and correct me if I'm wrong) some where on this sight there was someone that was warned aganist being to new and putting up web sights.


You won't be banned :thumb:

Jon was not new to the Danes Online forum when he was banned, but the exact opposite. He was a "go to guy" for raw feeding help. 

The rules on THIS forum are that if you have/link to a website that advertises a product or service, that you must be an active and constructive member here in order to use the "free advertising"


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## Herzo (Feb 5, 2011)

DaneMama said:


> You won't be banned :thumb:
> 
> Jon was not new to the Danes Online forum when he was banned, but the exact opposite. He was a "go to guy" for raw feeding help.
> 
> The rules on THIS forum are that if you have/link to a website that advertises a product or service, that you must be an active and constructive member here in order to use the "free advertising"


Thanks for clarifying that.I'm sorta new to the forum thing so just getting use to things.I have to say that I don't now if I can stand a regular dog forum.Yesturday on the Basset forum someone was talking about feeding there dog Hill's Science Diet and I always make a face, sitting here all by myself.Now I have to say I've been doing that for years.I call it Science Death.I even have my sister inlaw calling it that.Yuk


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i can't even talk about raw on certain pug forums.....

and the one that does push raw has this recipe she thinks is the bomb..calls it melange something........and i just have to keep quiet...pugs are notorious for eyes, ears, nose, allergies, yeast infections....and yet, all these people can discuss is the allergies...not a single one has ever entertained raw.
costumes? yes. taking the time to feed raw? not on your life. i am not welcome at these forums and i do not push my raw beliefs. it is, however, in my signature, and that's enough to get the coats ruffled.


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## tracydr (Feb 25, 2011)

Well, it looks like the Doberman person in question went back to feeding raw, although in a somewhat haphazard manner. I hope he doesn't get sick from almost 3 lbs of his first taste of green tripe plus organs, after a 3 week long hunger strike or whatever it's been!
The good thing was that nearly everyone was encouraging the owner to stick with RAW, find a better vet and improve the diet.


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## Northwoods10 (Nov 22, 2010)

Loki Love said:


> All forums are privately owned and operated - so yes, you are free to post as you like, but don't be surprised if the moderator ends up taking exception to it. Fair or not, it's how it works. I'm actively involved in various forums - some are definitely run better than others. I won't jump onto the forum bashing bandwagon though and start calling out other forums are run though - I'm sure the mods here wouldn't appreciate a thread started elsewhere based on this forum.


I understand that...and I'm not bashing the Lab Board...I just think it was a pretty shocking move based on the circumstances. Its a long story that I'm not going to get into. The lab board does have some great people and some great advice, as does this forum.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Honestly I wouldn't personally care if someone were to post up a thread on another forum "bashing" this one on the way its run. People are entitled to their opinions but so far, this forum has the least amount of problems and/or drama compared to the other forums I have had experience with. And I don't see it as us "bashing" other forums but just sharing experiences with one another. 

I was banned from DOL for a unjustified reason, but most likely I will go back there once the ban is lifted because its about helping people...not the drama of me getting banned


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## mischiefgrrl (Oct 28, 2010)

This is the only forum I am currently active in. I like it here because we're all here for the same purpose. I tell people about the PMR diet that I meet in person and most are receptive to it - some are not. As I've said before, at least I plant the seed and make them think about it. I hope in the future when their dogs are having "allergy issues" that they remember the conversation and it helps them.


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## dogfoodlover (Mar 13, 2011)

I guess everyone will have their own opinions, but the least people should do is educate themselves and get the proper facts. Oh well, that's life!


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