# What do you supplement when feeding a prey model raw diet?



## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

I have about two bags of their pre-made raw food left and decided to use the rest of it before switching to prey model raw. I am still kind of confused as to what exactly you give them, I mean, if I were to go out and by chicken quarters and give my dogs each one of them, is that their entire meal? I've heard some people say you need to mix in organs and eggs and egg shells and I just want to make sure that their balance is going to be as balanced as it is now with all the supplements that they need. Is there any place that has a "recipe" of sorts, by that I mean, something that tells you say 1 chicken leg, a half of egg shell, and whatever else....
I don't want to dive into this not knowing what I'm doing and make a mess of things...

For those that feed prey model raw, do you give any supplements along with it? If so, which kinds? And how often do you rotate your protein sources?
Do any of you add any fruits or vegetables of any kind into your dogs diet ever? I know, for the most part dogs don't need fruits or veggies but mine really enjoy them on occasion so I'm just wondering if I switch to prey model raw if those are going to be out the window now or if they are still ok?

Thanks for your time and patience with me! I'm still trying to learn all of this and just want to make sure I do it right.....


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## EnglishBullTerriers (Sep 10, 2008)

I know that we say this a lot, but go to RawFedDog's tagged pages in the signature part. It will give you tons of info. If you have small yorkies, then the amount of food to feed a day will be less then a leg quarter. You will probably feed a wing or two for a day of food. The size of the meal is aporximate and not exact. You will start with chicken and not feed anything else for quite a while. The rest of that stuff will come in time.
I have just recently realized that I am having to feed a little more then the 1lb a day for my un-nutered EBT because his metabolism is higher with the high activity and hormones. Once you start feeding exclusively raw, you don't have to keep feeding kibble or anything else. I am thinking about giving fish oil supplements, but that is only because Owen doesn't like eating the fish. Supplements are only needed if your dog HAS to have them, but that might change on the prey model diet also. 
Good luck!!


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Check out RFD's website: Skylar, Zack, and Abby on the WEB

He explains it all really well. 

I don't supplement my dogs except with fish oil pills every now and then, but I'm starting to hate them because it makes their stools enormous. So long as you feed meat, bones, and organs, your dogs' diets will be balanced, no need to supplement unless they have a serious health condition that requires it. 

Chicken leg quarters would be far too huge for your pups, you'd want to start out with chicken necks and wings and stick with those only for the first two weeks. After that ... well read that link, he spells it out really well and simply. 

You can still feed your pups fruits and veggies on occasion like how you can still eat candy and desserts on occasion. It's a treat with little to no nutritional value, but if you like eating it then it's ok in moderation on occasion. 

I usually try to give my dogs a different protein source twice a week (fish on Mondays, something else on Fridays) with an egg or two per week as well. This is only because other protein sources are pricey and my dogs are larger than yours. It certainly wouldn't cost you as much to give your tiny dogs steak and pork and lamb more often than I can (lucky!). But you don't want to add too much variety too soon, so wait until your third week before you do this and even then for only one meal a week, then work them up to it.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Its ok to feed fruits and veggies for snacks or treats. They won't get any nutrients from them so don't feed so much as to take up valuable stomach room that would otherwise hold meat, etc.

I feed my dogs something different every meal. They get a chicken back in the morning but for my dogs a chicken back is no more than a snack. I have 2 Great Danes that weigh 145+ lbs each. For dinner they will get chicken quarters, or turkey, or a pork roast, or beef heart, or fish, or venison when I have it, sometimes beef when I can get some cheap. I would feed goat and lamb if I could find some cheap. They might occasionally get chicken quarters 2 nights in a row but usually its something different each night. I look in the freezer and pull out something that I haven't fed in a few days.


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

EnglishBullTerriers said:


> I know that we say this a lot, but go to RawFedDog's tagged pages in the signature part. It will give you tons of info. If you have small yorkies, then the amount of food to feed a day will be less then a leg quarter. You will probably feed a wing or two for a day of food. The size of the meal is aporximate and not exact. You will start with chicken and not feed anything else for quite a while. The rest of that stuff will come in time.
> I have just recently realized that I am having to feed a little more then the 1lb a day for my un-nutered EBT because his metabolism is higher with the high activity and hormones. Once you start feeding exclusively raw, you don't have to keep feeding kibble or anything else. I am thinking about giving fish oil supplements, but that is only because Owen doesn't like eating the fish. Supplements are only needed if your dog HAS to have them, but that might change on the prey model diet also.
> Good luck!!


I read his page and he says to start with chicken backs...should I still do this even with my dogs size being so small? Also, my dogs are used to eating three times a day so, what do I do, let them chew on the bones for a while and then take them away and give them back? Do you guys that feed prey model raw only feed once a day?

I don't feed them kibble now, I feed them the pre-made raw food by Natures Variety and Primal....however, both of those foods have other things in them besides just meat content so that was why I was wondering what I needed to supplement....

I noticed on raw fed dogs page it said you needed to feed organs after a month....I'm wondering though, with their pre-made dog food there is liver and organs mixed in that now....won't they be missing those things for the month they are just getting meat?


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Check out RFD's website: Skylar, Zack, and Abby on the WEB
> 
> He explains it all really well.
> 
> ...


Thanks, I read his page and it is very helpful.... I'm trying to figre out if I would feed chicken backs to my dogs because they are so small....you said I should start with chicken necks and wings? Also, you mentioned feeding an egg, I'm guessing you don't cook it right? I don't know if my dogs will touch a raw egg by itself, do you mix it in with something?

Thanks for all the help, I appreciate it...


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> Its ok to feed fruits and veggies for snacks or treats. They won't get any nutrients from them so don't feed so much as to take up valuable stomach room that would otherwise hold meat, etc.
> 
> I feed my dogs something different every meal. They get a chicken back in the morning but for my dogs a chicken back is no more than a snack. I have 2 Great Danes that weigh 145+ lbs each. For dinner they will get chicken quarters, or turkey, or a pork roast, or beef heart, or fish, or venison when I have it, sometimes beef when I can get some cheap. I would feed goat and lamb if I could find some cheap. They might occasionally get chicken quarters 2 nights in a row but usually its something different each night. I look in the freezer and pull out something that I haven't fed in a few days.


I see....so once your dogs are used to eating prey model raw you can rotate the protein sources as often as you like? Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there some "prey model raw" feeders out there that add in vegetables and fruits on a daily basis with the raw food? I'm thinking I've heard of this before but can't remember exactly what they call it....if I am right in hearing this, what exactly is their science behind that?


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## EnglishBullTerriers (Sep 10, 2008)

Don't feed backs to your dogs, they are too small and I would be afraid that the back would eat your dogs back! 
Don't worry so much about the little things once you start. To start off with, just feed a wing, neck, leg of a chicken and then after a month, come back and see what to do next. No supplements, no organs, no nothing. Only chicken for a month and then you can work on the rest. Because your dogs were on the pre-packaged, you won't notice as much of a change at first. Once you start other things, thats when it gets fun. 
You can also give veggies, but I wouldn't worry about adding 'filler foods' until after they are on full raw.


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

EnglishBullTerriers said:


> Don't feed backs to your dogs, they are too small and I would be afraid that the back would eat your dogs back!
> Don't worry so much about the little things once you start. To start off with, just feed a wing, neck, leg of a chicken and then after a month, come back and see what to do next. No supplements, no organs, no nothing. Only chicken for a month and then you can work on the rest. Because your dogs were on the pre-packaged, you won't notice as much of a change at first. Once you start other things, thats when it gets fun.
> You can also give veggies, but I wouldn't worry about adding 'filler foods' until after they are on full raw.


Ok...thanks! Yes, that was what I was thinking too!!
Wings, necks and legs it is....guess I'm just over thinking the whole thing :redface:before I even get into it...I'll do what you said as soon as they run out of their pre-made raw food....probably about another week or so....and will come back for the next set of instructions after a month :smile:


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Don't worry about it being "balanced" every single day. I'm sure I don't eat a balanced diet every single day, but so long as I get the nutrients I need in the course of the week, I count myself as healthy. I may eat more veggies than protein or carbs one day and visa versa, it doesn't mean I'm malnourished because I'm going to get those nutrients soon enough. 

Wolves in the wild don't eat a balanced diet every day either, they balance it over time. That's what prey model raw is all about: balance the natural way :smile:


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Lovemymunchkins said:


> I see....so once your dogs are used to eating prey model raw you can rotate the protein sources as often as you like?


Yes, exactly



> Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there some "prey model raw" feeders out there that add in vegetables and fruits on a daily basis with the raw food?


Well if you feed "prey model" you might feed some veggies as treats but not as a regular part of the diet. If you feed fruits and veggies daily as part of the meal, you are feeding the BARF diet. A BARF diet is basically trying to mimmic kibble in raw form. 



> I'm thinking I've heard of this before but can't remember exactly what they call it....if I am right in hearing this, what exactly is their science behind that?


There is no science behind BARF. Dogs are carinvores and as such they have no need for plant material, can't digest it, and get no nutrients from it.


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> Yes, exactly
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the information, it makes sense...
On a positive note, we tried out our first prey model raw meal here there other day, Chicken wings for everyone and everyone except for my 2 pound girl ate their wings enthusiastically and really seemed to enjoy them bone and all! As for Jesamine, she would not touch her chicken wing at all and being that she's small I can't really "not" feed her a meal due to blood sugar issues...I'm wondering if I buy a grinder and grind the chicken wing and other meats if that would be a good alternative? She eats the pre-made raw so I'm thinking if I grind the raw meat she would eat it. I know it wouldn't be as good as eating it in it's natural state but, I was thinking it would probably be better than the pre-made raw food with the fruits and vegetables added to it that she is currently eating....what do you think?


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I think that would be a better alternative than the pre-made raw. The only down side is that she wouldn't be getting all the dental benefits of crunching through the bones, but so long as she does chew something else daily (like nylabones or something) and maybe if you brush her teeth with an enzymatic toothpaste, then she should be fine. Congrats on your other yorkies loving it though!


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Yes, I think feeding ground wings is better than feeding the premix stuff but I don't think I would give up after only one attempt. Next time the meal before you feed the wings to her, feed her a smaller meal at the regular meal time before so she will be more hungry. It will be easier on you and better for her if you can get her to eat real stuff in the natural form. It's not unusual for a dog to teke a few attempts before they figure out how to handle the real stuff.


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> I think that would be a better alternative than the pre-made raw. The only down side is that she wouldn't be getting all the dental benefits of crunching through the bones, but so long as she does chew something else daily (like nylabones or something) and maybe if you brush her teeth with an enzymatic toothpaste, then she should be fine. Congrats on your other yorkies loving it though!


That's why I really wanted her to eat the prey model form, for the dental benefits. She does love and chew on bully sticks ALL the time and I do brush all of their teeth daily with C.E.T tooth paste which seems to do a good job keeping tartar and plaque off....I might give it a few more trys with her and see if I can't get her to eat it...she is the pickiest thing though, and because she is small I can't really play "hard ball" with her so to speak... it's very frustrating


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## Lovemymunchkins (Feb 3, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> Yes, I think feeding ground wings is better than feeding the premix stuff but I don't think I would give up after only one attempt. Next time the meal before you feed the wings to her, feed her a smaller meal at the regular meal time before so she will be more hungry. It will be easier on you and better for her if you can get her to eat real stuff in the natural form. It's not unusual for a dog to teke a few attempts before they figure out how to handle the real stuff.


I will try to do that, maybe half of her regular portion...she's pretty stubborn though. I really would prefer for her to eat the meat like the other three are doing... I was surprised how fast they took to it. 
I'll keep trying but I figured if she absolutely would not eat it, perhaps making my own "pre-made" raw food of sorts would be healthier for her...


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Yes, your own pre-made raw foods will definitely be healthier for her and cheaper for you :smile:


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