# Husky question



## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

My pal has a male husky (9 mo) which she is unfortunately thinking of ditching due to behaviour issues. The dog is left loose in the house and if this is for longer than about 2 hours he starts to destroy things like doors walls kitchen cabinets etc.

My advice has been to provide more stimulation for the dog to crate train and provide dinner that takes hours to eat (like a rack of ribs). 

What they have done is decide to take him for longer walks (and I do mean walks here not running), and they don't like to crate him as he howls and annoys the neighbours.

The have finally decided to bring him back to OB classes (once a week) which is a start. Is there anything I can suggest to them that would help - this might just need me to reword what I am saying. They have much more doggy experience than me and know that I have only been a dog owner for 7 months.

I would take the dog for some of the time to crate him but my partner is allergic to most dogs (him included) so it is not possible to have him in the house :-(.

Any help appreciated as it would be a shame for them to give up or rehome the dog


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Sigh, yeah most people who get huskies end up at that point. Mostly because they only see the pretty and forget they are hardcore working dogs that need a job and ridiculous amounts of exercise.

Too long of walks or running is not very good for growing joints. Especially on concrete and asphalt.

At 18 months they could get a good backpack and start him carrying weights. A 20oz water bottle on each side is usually sufficient. I have a Ruffwear pack myself and I think Lily is currently packing cans of diced tomatos.

Once he's fully grown (12-18 months) they could get a treadmill and teach him to run on it. Always supervised of course. Really a fully grown husky needs at least 3-5 miles of running a day. Not walking, running.
Teaching him to run beside a bike is another thought. Same time frame of course.

A flirt pole would be a great way to get more exercise in a low impact way. Sibes have high prey drive usually so if you put a hunk of fur on cow hide or a favorite toy on the end shouldn't have a problem getting him to chase it.

Crate training is absolutely a must with these dogs. They will eat your house if they are not contained. They are bred to run literally all day, can you blame them for getting bored being a house pet?

Never ever leave them unattended in a yard if they are not safely and properly attatched to something immoveable either. I don't buy that "husky proof" fence b.s. personally.

OB training is an awesome idea. Not only basic, but take it further so he's got an actual "job". Maybe rally?

If he's got sound joints (OFA or PennHip x-rays from a good vet would be a good idea) weight pull might be something the dog would enjoy once he is done growing.

I think feeding project meals is an awesome idea. Maybe kongs with frozen goodies while they are away.

Feeding in the crate would really help. He needs to see it as home and not a place where he goes when they leave and he then throws a hissy.

I have such a hard time not laughing when they throw a hissy fit. Lily pretty much only likes to do it during OB drills when there are witnesses so they can clearly see what a mean mommy I am. I guess she gets it on both sides because GSD's are known for hissy's too. Whatev's I like a challenge. She's special. :biggrin1:


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## stajbs (Jun 5, 2010)

I have to second everything stated above. Having huskies involves commitment, a fair, firm loving approach, and a willingness to adapt to any challenge they throw your way. They are creative thinkers, and problem solvers. They are escape artists and can be challenging to contain. You have to always think one step ahead of them. Some trainers will even call them stupid but that's a lack of understanding as to how to train them.

Crate training is essential, and when they carry on in the crate it HAS to be ignored. If you respond it rewards their behavior and they will continue to vocalize and carry on. Perhaps feeding the pup in his crate will help teach him it's a good place also. 

The age of this pup is unfortunately about the time the cuteness is over and they become difficult to manage. In reality at this age they are the human equivalent of an adolescent. Now is the time they begin to retest your authority. 

Fair, firm and loving, plenty of mental stimulation, low impact exercise, and NILF. Re-assert your leadership with the nothing in life is free buddy. Expect them to sit for treats, for their meal and for toys etc. 

It's good to be going back to obedience class.


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## MissusMac (Jan 6, 2011)

All the above is great info! I just want to reiterate how efficient NILIF is, especially as I've seen it implemented with huskies. 

I have a husky about that age (8 months yesterday!), and consistent mental and physical stimulation is key. 

Again, crate training is crucial... I don't know if I'll ever be able to trust Miko alone in the house for extended periods of time, but then again he is crate trained so it is not that big of a deal.

Good luck, I hope this husky doesn't end up homeless because your friend couldn't commit


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## stajbs (Jun 5, 2010)

I love NILF. I also like verbal praising for good behavior as soon as you see it. I found giving a treat for everything correct that they do also makes them tend to only cooperate for a treat when you want them to respond/cooperate because it's you and they love you too. Also remember they usually love nearly everybody. A husky who doesn't love people has a temperament problem in my view. 

Always, always remember behind those beautiful blue eyes which sometimes look soft, and sometimes look devilish, or the soulful brown or amber, or parti colored eyes lurks a beautiful soul with a zest to experience life and ALL it has to offer. They are adventurers. We love their spirit, we love the challenge they present, you have to be willing to have a dog that will sometimes look at you and say I don't wanna do it and accept that, and you have to also pick and choose your battles. 

The only thing about the breed that sort of bums me out is the lack of ability I have to trust them off leash. In part that is my fault because perhaps with further training it might be possible to achieve a reliable recall, but with their prey drive you may not be able to override that no matter how reliable their recall is.

Just another round of my two cents. Hope your friend can work through it, they are so much fun to share your life with ifyou can commit to them.


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## MissusMac (Jan 6, 2011)

stajbs said:


> The only thing about the breed that sort of bums me out is the lack of ability I have to trust them off leash. In part that is my fault because perhaps with further training it might be possible to achieve a reliable recall, but with their prey drive you may not be able to override that no matter how reliable their recall is.


I know hwell:, I'm a member of a husky raw feeding forum and too many of the people on there rely on recall and "excellent training" and take their husky off-leash in many places. I argue that they are still a dog with an adventurous spirit and incredibly strong prey drive... I will never take my dog off-leash in an unfenced area... I love him too much!


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## xxshaelxx (Mar 8, 2010)

Just another case of owner stupidity…getting a dog on looks and not researching the breed.

They must, must, MUST either crate train the dog or get a VERY sturdy kennel with a cover, because Siberians are INFAMOUS for not only their escape artists status, but also their separation anxiety. No matter if they take that dog for longer walks, start weight pulling, do sledding, agility, or what have you, if they leave it in the house alone, it WILL destroy the place. If they had done ANY research on the breed, they would KNOW this. -.- It's the most COMMON problem in Sibes, and the most common reason for their abandonment. I repeat, THEY MUST CRATE TRAIN THAT DOG OR GET A STURDY KENNEL!!! The neighbors will have to deal with the howling for a few days to weeks, because that's what Siberian Huskies NEED in order to be a healthy, great companion dog. It also has to be a SECURE crate. Amaya has escaped her SECURE crate on numerous occasions now, and if I leave her in Ryou's crate, she'll be out within an hour. If your friend does not crate train this dog or get a secure kennel to keep it in while they are gone, this dog will see more than its fair share of new homes. It won't just be the next person after your friend. Or the dog may even lose its life due to your friend's negligence to read up on the breed and understand that there is a LOT of work behind that pretty face.

Siberian huskies are not stupid by any means like many people would like to say. They are amazingly intelligent. I have a high IQ (not genius or anything, but above average), and I constantly find that my dogs are outsmarting me, especially Amaya. They are also amazingly stubborn. If they want it this way, it takes a LOT of convincing otherwise, which is the reason why many, many, MANY Sibes cannot be taken off-leash, because if you call them back, no matter WHAT treat you have, they're going to stop, look at you, laugh, then continue on their way if that's what they want. These dogs are perhaps more independent even than wolves, because I know even wolf hybrids have been known to have amazing recalls. Certainly not my two rascals...sometimes I have a hard time getting them to come in from the backyard!


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## MissusMac (Jan 6, 2011)

Huskies do have separation issues because they are such social animals... very pack-oriented, so having another pup to keep them company if you are gone a lot is also recommended.


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## stajbs (Jun 5, 2010)

Missusmac, be very very careful or you will find yourself experiencing potato chip syndrome. You can't have just one. That's how we ended up with 6 sibes at one time, and 7 total in our lives so far. lol 

Our local dog training club did not appreciate me when I showed up for a summer class many years ago. I found out it was outside and part of the class involved off leash work. I refused...good Lord my guys were trained to run, and that little chihuahua looked almost like lunch to my one girl. The instructor and I worked it out though. They kept my money and I came back for the winter class which was indoors. I was still uncomfortable someone would open a door and the chase would be on but we made it through class, and did so-so on the off leash work. Jewel found the little terrier mix in that class verrrrry intriguing. That was a little edgy too, but Jewel was more food motivated than some of my guys. I doubt she would have hurt the dog but I still worried about the look I saw in her eyes on occasion. It was one of those times where I tried to remain calm inwardly while staying very keyed in on her and keeping her focused on me.

For the original poster I would not feel comfortable recommending more than one sibe unless they can get over the crate training hurdle first. I sympathize in a way because Jewel hated being in her crate when we went to weight pulls that were held indoors. She could have the loudest most dramatic grumbly hissy fits and I often had to cover the front of her crate to keep her settled. If we were at outside events she could be on a drop line off the outriggers at the truck and then she would carry on like a fool for a while. Eventually she would settle and almost put herself in her version of time out. She would turn her back to the action and chill till her weight class was up. Unfortunately she was pulling in the pro classes pretty quickly and she had to wait for the 40-60 pound class because novice class and smaller dogs were usually first.

If the original posters friend can get over a few hurdles and beliefs they will have a wonderful companion. Finding a job/outlet for the dog as it matures physically would help a lot to release some tension for the dog and give the pup the conditioning and exercise they need. Tell them to hang on and enjoy the ride of a lifetime, but not to let the dog control the ride totally. They have to be the sibes leader.


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## MissusMac (Jan 6, 2011)

stajbs said:


> Missusmac, be very very careful or you will find yourself experiencing potato chip syndrome. You can't have just one. That's how we ended up with 6 sibes at one time, and 7 total in our lives so far. lol


Trust me, I've been "hounding" my husband about adopting a big brother or sister for Miko since we got him, since there are several husky rescues in Texas, and I guess that means I definitely have potato chip syndrome! 

We got one because my husband's parents have one that he helped raise, and we did a ton of research and decided we were up for the job... but they are a breed not to be underestimated!


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## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

Thanks for all the replies.
Fist off I would like to say how ****off I am with them over the situation. Both our pups are the same age and I was considered silly one for buy a rotti buy most of the people we met (trainers included, bar the one I am still with). I spent months researching which dogs would fit my home and after deciding on which one spent further months looking into all the issues I could think off.

I also agree that intelligence is only rated on how easy it is to train an animal. I my mind that does not show intelligence. Like rotti's and akita's they have to want to work with you not simply run after a ball endlessly because they think its fun.

Their pup when out of the house is actually pretty well trained (for a 9 month old dog that is), he has a strong bond to humans and an excellent recall, they are happy to have him off the lead (yes if you judgement is skewed then this might not say a lot). I will reiterate to them about crate training and hope to christ they listen to me!!! and pass on all the helpful hints that you've all posted above.

I would not like to see him re-homed :-( as he is such a great dog and so true to his breed!


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## stajbs (Jun 5, 2010)

Good luck with encouraging the crate training and getting them to ignore the drama behavior in the crate. It is very difficult to ignore, but it's imperative. That means not even firmly telling them to hush up because that rewards them too, ignoring the behavior is the only way to go. Perhaps if they try ignoring and it doesn't work, maybe covering might work. I didn't like to do it, but the drama I got when indoors at an event made me feel like someone would think I was the evil mom. So I guess that was my hangup. But covering the crate settled her down and her reason for carrying on was excitement to get in her harness and get on with the business of weight pulling which she loved.

Sounds like you are doing the best you can, it will be up to them to realize and accept what must be done. Good luck.


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Yes, its really easy to forget oneself and shoosh them in the crate. Best of luck and hope they take the time to actually work with the pup. Ugh not good they are letting it off leash. Great way for it to get lost or hurt. Its all well and good until the split second it isn't and they run for it.

I lock my foster's kennel with caribiners when I leave. She knows how to open it, but usually only does when she's having an SA episode or her tummy is upset. So I just head it off at the pass by using the caribiners. She has some Sibe in her, but is mostly Terv/GSD and was from a sled dog hoarding bust as a pup. I'm like her 3rd home?

I'm really glad Lily is half GSD. Just saying. Its very nice to have that devoted desire to please their person that GSD's have.


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## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

Well this is my rant of the year. 

Basically I got more or less blown off from offering any kind of help. Fine if they think they are right then they can live with a dog thats going to eat them out of the home quite literally. I might not be an experienced dog owner but at least I try and learn.

Well yesterday my dog walker (I use her for socialisation reasons rather than time issues) comes to the house with a sore hand, I obviously ask what the problem was and she was bit by the husky.

This was not a playful bite, this was a full on growl then bite, pretty bad cuts and bruising. Now quite often I blame the people for not understanding dogs etc when they are bit, but all she was doing was putting the lead on after a walk.

I am really at a loss as he was a great puppy and would still make a really good dog if someone would put the time in :-(. I fear now that he really has a limited time left.

Not happy with his owners in the slightest.


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## MissusMac (Jan 6, 2011)

This is so sad and frustrating. I hope he can find a home to work with him


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Thats really upsetting. I'm sorry they ruined the dog so badly.

I had to deal with a really upsetting situation... my friend had to rehome her Sibe that was a bad fit almost two years ago and I tipped off a Sibe owner I knew that was thinking about getting a second... On paper they were perfect, but in reality they ruined her with improper e-collar use and bad management. They made her fear aggressive redirection, dog aggressive with their other dog (this is 100% bad management on their part, I saw how they let their other dog act... don't blame this poor dog for deciding she hates her...), and massive food aggression. I'm so disgusted. She wanted to rehome her, but I said hell no not with that aggressive behavior... that would be very irresponsible, what if she bit a kid? So supposedly they have her on anxiety meds, are rotating the dogs, and have her in training. I'm not sure how much I believe though. It disgusts me massively. That was a damn good dog before they ruined her. I wish most people who think they want Northern breeds would have the good sense to just not do it.


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## nortknee (May 5, 2011)

monkeys23 said:


> I wish most people who think they want Northern breeds would have the good sense to just not do it.


That's the problem. Most people don't have enough sense to look past the pretty and see that they are still very much a working, some might say "feral" dog breed.
I'd never own a Northern Breed dog. They're too much dog for one, and I don't have the patience to put up with their stubborn antics, as well as the fact that I think they're more "bite happy" than other breeds. Not that they're bad dogs, it's just a HUGE committment to have one, and only for experienced owners.


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## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

nortknee said:


> That's the problem. Most people don't have enough sense to look past the pretty and see that they are still very much a working, some might say "feral" dog breed.
> I'd never own a Northern Breed dog. They're too much dog for one, and I don't have the patience to put up with their stubborn antics, as well as the fact that I think they're more "bite happy" than other breeds. Not that they're bad dogs, it's just a HUGE committment to have one, and only for experienced owners.


This sums up the owners in a nut shell. They have no experience with northern breeds and I think they have learnt nothing in the year they have had him. I am hoping that the dog walker walking into the house with blood dripping of her hand on to their floor might have opened there eyes a bit to the problems they have.

I spent ages looking into buying a rotti before I got my pup, and read just about every book both breed specific and general that my library had. These people did nothing just liked the cute little face and wolf like features all in 25 kg pet package. 

I could rant about them for ages so I will stop.

This was from the last time I was out with him










He really would make a fantastic dog :-(


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## stajbs (Jun 5, 2010)

Oh gosh, this angers me so badly and breaks my heart. What a gorgeous boy. He needs a home with a true leader. The whole gosh he's gorgeous I want him and not having done your research on siberians is why so many are in shelters and why I spent 16 years in sibe rescue so far. Seems it will never end. I used to feel bad when I thought I was being a bit challenging with potential adopters but siberians are a challenge. Someone has to want to deal with a challenging breed, and the quirks that go along with it. I've had one or two sibes I thought for a while would just drive me insane but you have to be willing to look at yourself and how you can change and adapt to what this breed throws your way. My guys all had pretty good bite inhibition so even in the 3 fights in all our years that I broke up I only ever suffered an abrasian. As soon as the dog realized it was human flesh they backed off pronto. I've also only had to get slightly "physical" with one sibe and I hated it. Hated myself for yanking him by the collar off his feet, shaking him once, setting him back down and doing the whole firm low voice thing. Hated that I even did it but could not tolerate the behavior, and take a chance it would ever happen again. However following the episode I still kept trying to work out what I had done, or what the catalyst had been for him even laying his teeth on me in an aggressive manner. Following that episode I think he truly knew the limits and respected them. He became a total mush and loved to snuggle and give lots of kisses and love. He did it prior to that too but there was always something that made us wonder if he would test us and he did. Hand feeding for a little while, and NILF worked wonders with this boy afterwards. He also really responded to having a job, he hated weight pulling but he loved running in harness and he loved obedience work too, so that was Ice's job. SOunds like this boy needs an experienced sibe savvy person. someone fair, firm and loving who can stand their ground and be a true leader the dog can respect. Sigh...sorry for the rant. I know it was no help but I had hoped they would be able to work through the problems while they were still relatively "small" problems, now they have a big problem.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

This is really sad and the reason why rescues and breeders need to do their homework before letting anyone adopt any of these type of breeds. People go for the 'cute' and beautiful and have no idea what they are getting in to with these guys. 

We were really fortunate with Rocky's rescue group. His litter was half chow / half husky and they had over 60 applications for the pups because they were so adorable. Luckily the rescue would NOT adopt any of them out except to really experienced homes. Even then, they still had one pup returned to them. I've put all my puppies in agility classes, just for the constant mental stimulation and it does wonders for them. These type of dogs really do need a constant firm hand and constant work (mental or physical) to keep them from getting into trouble.


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## nortknee (May 5, 2011)

stajbs said:


> I've also only had to get slightly "physical" with one sibe and I hated it. Hated myself for yanking him by the collar off his feet, shaking him once, setting him back down and doing the whole firm low voice thing. Hated that I even did it but could not tolerate the behavior, and take a chance it would ever happen again.


While I hate the idea of getting "rough" with a dog, this is one breed in particular that it makes alot of sense...at least for me.

I think so many people underestimate the complexity of wolves and dogs that are closely related (like northern breeds) and just love the idea of saying they own one...little do they know, that cute little fluffy ball of fur is going to turn into a very large, primal, highly active and intelligent, dignified dog.

Frustrating.


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Yeah Lily and I have had some pretty intense "words" before. She would not respect someone who wasn't very firm with her. She and I are both so lucky that I snatched her up as soon as she became available to adopt.

And poor Scout, don't even get me started on her past owners...


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