# What opened your eyes?



## Sapphire-Light (Aug 8, 2010)

What was the factor (s) that opened your eyes from the lies of the bad kibble brands? that factor that made you discover the true behind all the agressive propaganda?

For me there was many factors:

When I was a little, we had a GSD/ husky mix called Oso (bear in spanish) , his first couple of years he was fed home cooked but then the pedigree brand was becoming popular in my country.

So we went wit the trend and it was also recommended by a vet and we stared to feed it :sad: when there was no pedigree at the store we also fed him dog chow or alpo .

This was Oso when he was like 3 years old, he was fed homecooked and table scraps at the time.










This was Oso at 9 years old, he was fed pedigrre/ dog chow /alpo and table scraps.

Notice the dull dry coat, and he shed a lot and had zits and bald parts on tummy, also he went compleatly blind a year after this picture and lost many teeth, he died at the age of 13.










Sadly we believed the vets told us, and they were telling us that it was "the age" and "the breed" 

Some years after his death we find out about the 2007 insidents, and how nasty some kibbles can be, now all Osos isuess makes senses.

I feel so bad we fed him this trash if we only knew what we know now. hwell:


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

In 2006 I worked at Petsmart and that's when I started researching ingredients and foods. I was feeding Nutro at the time. 

Then A few year later I worked for a woman who owned a small dog store that sold Orijen, Evo, and some other top brands that I can't recall. She also had a huge assortment of quality treats, antlers, bully sticks. She did advocate grain free and because of her I switched to TOTW. I was Required to study quality dog food ingredients and be able to reccomend the right thing for customers. It was shocking reading ablution the horrible actions of other companies and what went into those foods.

6 months ago I got my 3rd dog. He had horrible horrible farts and poops. Mikey couldn't lose the last of the weight I wished he would. 

After read and researching I took the plunge into PMR and haven't regretted it once  Gunners farts are few and far between. They also do not smell the way they did. Mikey lost the weight in a month and his teeth are amazing.


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

I looked into recommended cat food brands when I was looking at adopting my first cat when I moved out of home. The normal brands were rated bad, and Orijen etc were good. I read into why... and was pretty horrified. Needless to say, Kitty #1 went on a good brand and so did Kitty #2 when we got him two months later.

Same thing when I got the dogs.. researching good brands and stumbled upon this forum about raw feeding.. never looked back!

Sadly Tess still farts a ton.. and I'm talking room clearing every 20 minutes.. I don't even wanna think about what it would be like on Kibbles n bits!


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Caty M said:


> I looked into recommended cat food brands when I was looking at adopting my first cat when I moved out of home. The normal brands were rated bad, and Orijen etc were good. I read into why... and was pretty horrified. Needless to say, Kitty #1 went on a good brand and so did Kitty #2 when we got him two months later.
> 
> Same thing when I got the dogs.. researching good brands and stumbled upon this forum about raw feeding.. never looked back!
> 
> Sadly Tess still farts a ton.. and I'm talking room clearing every 20 minutes.. I don't even wanna think about what it would be like on Kibbles n bits!


Really, still really gassy with the switch to PMR? Have you tried feeding a little tripe with each meal?


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

Well, I don't have anything to compare to since she's been on raw since day one with me. She's always been gassy. Takes after daddy.. the human one :heh:

I've given her tripe a couple times as a whole meal, but not added to each one. What in it would help? Fibre? She does get some seed mixture which I assume has some fibre in it.. no change with the farting, though. You know she farted because as soon as she does it when she's cuddling you she runs away. :third:


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## kathylcsw (Jul 31, 2011)

I had 2 dogs die within 19 days of each other in June. Even though it was nothing that I did it made me hypersensitive to anything that might harm dogs. I got a puppy a month later and wanted to be sure that I did everything possible for her to live a long, healthy life. I initially stumbled on the Dog Food Advisor site and was horrified at what I learned. I had been feeding my dogs Pedigree thinking I was feeding quality food. I have made sure that Lola has only been fed the highest quality foods. She is currently eating Nature's Variety Instinct in the morning Mon-Fri. and raw at night. On the weekends and any day I am off she eats raw all day with plans to switch her totally to raw once I can find an inexpensive freezer. Since then I have tried to educate all my dog friends and family about feeding quality food. I have also switched my cats to TOTW cat food and they look great too.


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

Without a doubt, the petfood recall in 2007 when all those dogs and cats either died, or were terribly sick, from eating food with melamine added to artificially increase the protein levels. Thank you God that Mollie was not one of them.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Just a really sick dog, constantly at the vet. And another dog with apparently untreatable ear infections.

Melamine was the first thing that made me think about what i was feeding them - at that time I went to a dog food that sourced in the US. It didn't help my dogs, though. Then the ER vet told me corn was good for dogs as he tried to get me to buy his Science Diet. That just sounded so crazy.

i was going to homecook, and was looking for recipes when I found this website. Reading about PMR was a huge lightbulb moment for me. I was amazed I had been so dense all along that I never thought of it before.


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## Jacksons Mom (Jun 13, 2010)

I got Jackson when I turned 18. He was MY first dog that was solely mine and thankfully, before I even brought him home, I joined an online breed specific forum a week prior to me picking him up. I know the "breeder" sent me home with a baggy of Eukanuba but I think I bought a bag of the Cesar Millan food first (what can I say? I guess I was brainwashed, LOL) but thankfully, it was actually a pretty decent food, made by Castor & Pollux if I remember correctly. Then I kind of recall going from that to Innova, to Before Grain. Basically... he's always eaten what I consider high quality food. But yeah, as a kid, of course we didn't know what my parents were feeding our dogs, probably Kibbles n Bits or something.


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

no offense but yo ucan't take your 2 year old dog, and then take that same dog at 9, say he deteriorated in health and blame the kibble lol. why dd yyou guys stop with the homecooked?
nothing really opened my eyes, I just remember one day I searched ''best dog food'' expecting to see iams or pedigree or nutro(what i was feeeding). I came across canidae, innova, wellness, timberwolf. I decided on canidae after reading their site. They had a meal vs fresh meat tab and I learned a good deal of my knowledge from that.


Sapphire-Light said:


> What was the factor (s) that opened your eyes from the lies of the bad kibble brands? that factor that made you discover the true behind all the agressive propaganda?
> 
> For me there was many factors:
> 
> ...


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## Rodeo (Sep 11, 2011)

I do believe skin problems cropped up after they switched to kibble.. thats food related.. not age. Same with the dull coat.


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

Rodeo said:


> I do believe skin problems cropped up after they switched to kibble.. thats food related.. not age. Same with the dull coat.


it sounds like oso ate kibble from 4 years on....this sounds age related...especially since pedigree and dog chow do give shiny coats...they may be crap foods but dogs still look good on them. corn shines the coat.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> it sounds like oso ate kibble from 4 years on....this sounds age related...*especially since pedigree and dog chow do give shiny coats...they may be crap foods but dogs still look good on them. corn shines the coat*.


:wacko::rofl::wacko:

WTF are you talking about?!?!?


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> corn shines the coat.


On what planet?


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

You mean when you guys want shiny hair you don't rub corn kernels in it? Weird.

Dogs don't get dull coats magically at four years old. Of course it's food related. Most of the kibble dogs at the park have bad coats.


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

But what if you keep the crappy food in an airtight container? will it kill and suffocate the nutrients???


Simply couldn't resist.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> it sounds like oso ate kibble from 4 years on....this sounds age related...especially since pedigree and dog chow do give shiny coats...they may be crap foods but dogs still look good on them. corn shines the coat.


Really? Cause I meet so many dogs that eat these kinds of brands and they have dull, smelly and gross coats...if by shine you mean greasy..then yes, I guess you could be right...in some weird and obscure way.


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## Sapphire-Light (Aug 8, 2010)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> no offense but yo ucan't take your 2 year old dog, and then take that same dog at 9, say he deteriorated in health and blame the kibble lol. why dd yyou guys stop with the homecooked?



Well the 9 year old pic is because that is what I found, I know we took more, but I don't know were they are stored, but the point is that he aged too fast at 10 he was compleatly blind and nearly toothless, now wit the internet when I see pics of dogs of the same age Oso had in that pic but they are eating raw of a good quality kibble but they look so healthy and bouncy wit shiny coats and sparkly eyes, nothing like the bad shape Oso had in the pic. :tsk:



We stared feeding him the pedrigree like when he was 4 years old, I remember well we took him to the vet to give him the anual shots but when we were entering the clinic Oso peed on a poted plat they had at the entrance, the pee was big and the cashier called the vet, he came to see and told us that the pee was too yellow or something like it, and he asked us what he was eating, we replied the homecooking and the table scraps.

Then he told us Oso was too fat and needed to loose weight and that the cooked beef was a danger to a dogs heart , etc.. so he said Oso needed to be in a "healty" diet like pedigree. :tape:


In the first years of life he didn't shed as mush , but later his hair stared to shed a lot and had bad skin, teeth ,lost of eyesight and even lost some sense of smell, the hair lost was more evident in his tummy and the zits.




Caty M said:


> You mean when you guys want shiny hair you don't rub corn kernels in it? Weird.
> 
> Dogs don't get dull coats magically at four years old. Of course it's food related. Most of the kibble dogs at the park have bad coats.


Agree, now that we know more of nutrition I fell so bad about Oso, I wish we kept the home ccooked instead.

Now that we have Pompadour, everyone tells me how soft and shiny his coat and skin is, people are surprised when they touch him, they tell me he is the softest dog they have touched.


His handler who has showed for years many long haired small breeds told me he has a great hair texture and his ears are one of the best she have seen in toy poodles. :wink:


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

Scarlett_O' said:


> :wacko::rofl::wacko:
> 
> WTF are you talking about?!?!?


winstons coat has glistened on proplan...and it glistens on acana.
shane's coat glistened on nutro as it did on canidae gf and totw. even on science diet lbp


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## Huginn (Nov 21, 2011)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> winstons coat has glistened on proplan...and it glistens on acana.
> shane's coat glistened on nutro as it did on canidae gf and totw. even on science diet lbp


I for one highly doubt that. I work at a pet store and I see hundreds of dogs a week. I can tell corn fed dogs from those not fed it in an instant. I have NEVER met a dog fed proplan (especially not science diet) with a coat as shiny as a grain free dog. IF there is any luster to their coat at all it is with owners that supplement the fish oil caps or gel. Corn does NOTHING positive for a dog, and if you believe that you have been listening to too many science diet reps.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

Huginn said:


> I for one highly doubt that. I work at a pet store and I see hundreds of dogs a week. I can tell corn fed dogs from those not fed it in an instant. I have NEVER met a dog fed proplan (especially not science diet) with a coat as shiny as a grain free dog. IF there is any luster to their coat at all it is with owners that supplement the fish oil caps or gel. Corn does NOTHING positive for a dog, and if you believe that you have been listening to too many science diet reps.


Friend of mine feeds her dog pro plan. The dog does have a shiny coat but it's very rough to the touch.

ETA- it is one of her BIGGEST defenses when dog nutrition comes up. "look at my dog, she's shiny so she is healthy". Yet her cost is not soft when it should be and her black is not rich, it is dull brown.


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

The only time my Border Collie's coat was shiny while being fed corn inclusive dog food was:

1. Soaking wet when she just got out of the swimming pool.

2. Immediately back from the groomer, after her day of beauty.


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

Huginn said:


> I for one highly doubt that. I work at a pet store and I see hundreds of dogs a week. I can tell corn fed dogs from those not fed it in an instant. I have NEVER met a dog fed proplan (especially not science diet) with a coat as shiny as a grain free dog. IF there is any luster to their coat at all it is with owners that supplement the fish oil caps or gel. Corn does NOTHING positive for a dog, and if you believe that you have been listening to too many science diet reps.


I dont care if you doubt it, they are my dogs and I know it is true.
obviously I know a lot about canine nutrition if the diets i advocate ar high meat kibbles and pmr.
I dont advocate the foods I mentioned I'm just saying that my dogs did not appear any less soft/shiny on those foods, and were very energetic.
Shane was always on high quality kibble bt the quality increased with age. We adopted him at 11 months and he was on science diet lbp, which we switched him off of immediately and put him on nutro natural choice..so admittedly he wasn't on terrible food for long(good...but i didnt notice a diff between his coast from sd to canidae gf..i just fed it because it's what he should be eating..a nice meaty diet.

as with winston, he was fed proplan, and we adopted him at 2.5. I have no idea what else he ate before that. proplan is a pretty crummy food...and we switched him immediately to totw wetlands....his coat is maybe a little more shiny and soft now that he is on acana..but that is to be expected because it is fish...if we put him on wild praire who knows if it would be any better than on proplan.
winston;s coat is extremely soft and shiny.

i've noticed that regardless of food, skin problems were rampant in my dogs. shane had dandruff all of his life. winston has some red paws that he stopped licking and seem less red, but he still has shaky head syndrome lol:tongue1:

maybe corn doesnt glisten coats..admittedly i only heard one person say that..but i beleived them because they werent pro corn..they were a person lie us on this forum, and they were arguing with a pro corn feeder. they said that a shiny coat doesnt mean a healthy fog, and that corn glistens coats but is not great for them
but yeah my dogs have always had a nice shine and soft coat.


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

proplan is very expensive. 35 pounds is like 45 bucks


Sprocket said:


> Friend of mine feeds her dog pro plan. The dog does have a shiny coat but it's very rough to the touch.


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## mischiefgrrl (Oct 28, 2010)

I've never heard of corn making coats shine by ingesting it. However, cornstarch and fine cornmeal do make great "dry shampoos" when rubbed in and brushed out. 

My eyes were opened to kibble for dogs early on. When I adopted my first Aussie Buster, he had horrible diarrhea no matter what kind of kibble we tried. I looked up different diets and saw the BARF diet but it looked too complicated for me so I did home cooked. About 6 months after I started cooking his food, the recalls happened and I was SO happy I wasn't feeding kibble. At the time I switched wasn't concerned about kibble making dogs sick, it just made sense to me that homemade was better.

With Tanis PMR clicked when he had skin conditions despite homecooked foods and remedies that just wouldn't go away. Then I tried PMR out of desperation and it worked.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> proplan is very expensive. 35 pounds is like 45 bucks


What does the price that suckers will pay have to do with its credibility?


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## Huginn (Nov 21, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> What does the price that suckers will pay have to do with its credibility?


I was going to ask the same thing. . .

AND RC, while I am sure to you there appeared to be no change in coat soft/shininess, I can't help but doubt you. I work in a pet store for going on three years, I have worked in a vet clinic and . . . well owners who say that their dog's coat is amazing on junk food have no idea what they are saying. 

I am not trying to be rude or bash you, but well. . . I am a cynic. That is who I am. I am happy that your dogs are on better food, but the way your wording was it really sounded like you were saying that there is nothing wrong with those diets. Maybe, considering being a little clearer in your posts and we will avoid this type of confrontation in the future


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## nupe (Apr 26, 2011)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> proplan is very expensive. 35 pounds is like 45 bucks



LOL....RC you are the best!!!
,,,,,I was just going straight down reading the posts and was like,.,,,where that came from?. and WTH that had to do with the thread!!!.....and yall call me a trouble maker!!!....RC YOU ROCK!!


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## Donna Little (May 31, 2011)

Caty M said:


> Well, I don't have anything to compare to since she's been on raw since day one with me. She's always been gassy. Takes after daddy.. the human one :heh:
> 
> I've given her tripe a couple times as a whole meal, but not added to each one. What in it would help? Fibre? She does get some seed mixture which I assume has some fibre in it.. no change with the farting, though. You know she farted because as soon as she does it when she's cuddling you she runs away. :third:


My senior Chihuahua Lily does the same thing. It's like she's jet-propelled! :biggrin: 
I was feeding my guys Blue Buffalo before but after watching Toby get sicker and sicker with his heart condition I felt like I needed to take a more holistic approach to his healthcare so that led me to feed raw. I had read about it and done a little research in the past but just thought I wouldn't be able to do it with 10 dogs so never took the plunge. When Toby almost died I thought I'd try raw with just him as a last ditch effort to help him. After seeing the improvement with Toby though how could I keep my other dogs on kibble and give him something better? So now I'm feeding raw to 10 very happy little bone-crunchers!


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

Probably due to the big recall, it happened about a month after I adopted Uno. When I first got him, I went to wal-mart and got a big bag of pedigree because I remember seeing all those dog shows when I was younger and thought it was a great brand, plus so cheap!. Then when I got home and opened a bag, it smelled like something died and was left to rot in there, so I just tossed the bag and went to petsmart the next day and got a bag of Nutro natural due to persuasive powers of sales reps. He was on that for maybe 3 weeks and then after the recall I started feverishly researching pet foods and have been feeding him premium and now raw since then which was 5 years ago.


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

i was saying that her friend is a fool for paying so much for proplan
when she can get cheaper foods which are better quality.


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

I will admit to having seen some dogs on crappy food with seemingly good coats. But, 9/10 are awful. Genetics plays a role here, too. I think my biggest gripe is the greasy nasty film that's on kibble fed dogs that is worse on junk food. I was feeding evo before going raw, and I didn't even realize that my dogs felt gross until the raw fixed it. In fact: aside from Grissom who was obviously having problems, I thought my dogs were the picture of health! I was wrong. But you can't even know that until you do something different and see it for yourself.


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## Sapphire-Light (Aug 8, 2010)

Not defending proplan but at least it has a bit of meat unlike pedigree that only some atomic sizes particles of chicken beaks.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

CorgiPaws said:


> I will admit to having seen some dogs on crappy food with seemingly good coats. But, 9/10 are awful. Genetics plays a role here, too. I think my biggest gripe is the greasy nasty film that's on kibble fed dogs that is worse on junk food. I was feeding evo before going raw, and I didn't even realize that my dogs felt gross until the raw fixed it. In fact: aside from Grissom who was obviously having problems, I thought my dogs were the picture of health! I was wrong. But you can't even know that until you do something different and see it for yourself.



Did you change your name?


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## swolek (Mar 31, 2011)

There wasn't a specific event that opened my eyes or anything. I had a Dachshund puppy, being fed IAMS, and started joining online forums. After seeing what other people fed, I questioned my food choice (although I was a kid so my parents were buying it) and realized I had been going by outdated IAMS information. I didn't switch immediately, though, since the "good" foods were expensive and Rocky was healthy and seemed to like the food.

It wasn't until I got Sophie a year later that I switched. She didn't tolerate the IAMS at all and constantly vomited. Unfortunately, she didn't tolerate a lot of the "good" foods, either! After a year or two of switching around (she had done OK on Chicken Soup but it was hard to find and she did fine on Wellness Super 5 but didn't like the taste), we settled on Innova. All of the dogs did well on it and it was readily available at local health food stores.

...Or at least I thought they all did well on it. Sophie was still vomiting sometimes, had anal gland problems, and her stool was almost always loose or at least soft. Diarrhea was a regular thing with her. But because she was doing so much better than when on the previous foods, I thought she was doing great. I did try EVO with her and she did OK but her stools were still messy. That's when I decided to look into raw again. I had previously looked up information but was scared away by the amount of work and supplements on BARF websites. I felt it was probably the best diet but it wasn't feasible. So I bought Stella and Chewy's, figuring it was at least better than the kibble she was on. Sophie loved it, her stools were small and solid, and she stopped vomiting. I didn't notice at first but she also stopped scooting. Of course it was really, really expensive so I looked for alternatives. I came across Hare-Today which then lead me to prey model raw websites...and this forum . The rest is history.

Joining this forum also prompted me to switch my rabbits to a pellet-free diet, something I had previously done for a while but switched back (because one of the rabbits was throwing tantrums and I was worried about "balancing" the diet) .


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## Tzubabies (Sep 27, 2011)

My eyes had been open for years about the higher quality foods. But it was years more research that gave me a better knowledge of individual ingredients and supplements. The Melamine issue opened my eyes more about the trustworthiness of different companies.


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

Sprocket said:


> Did you change your name?


She changed back to her original screen name now that there is a Corgi in the house again :wink:


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Sprocket said:


> Did you change your name?



This was my username for a couple years, and it just made me sad after we didn't have Grissom anymore. 
I never really LIKED PuppyPaws. Actually Bill picked it. 
But now that there's a Corgi in the house again, it fits. I think to a lot of the long time members, I was always CorgiPaws... considering a lot of my PM's refer to me as that. lol.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

speaking of Corgi's can we please see lots of pics of Griffin and hear all about his journey to your house and how he is doing?


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

meggels said:


> speaking of Corgi's can we please see lots of pics of Griffin and hear all about his journey to your house and how he is doing?



Why yes. I will do a picture thread when I get home from work, assuming the dogs will allow me the free time. LOL


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

CorgiPaws said:


> Why yes. I will do a picture thread when I get home from work, assuming the dogs will allow me the free time. LOL


I TOTALLY wouldnt kill you if 1. I got a couple Mr. G pictures on my phone, and 2. if Annie picture were included in that thread and/or the texts!!!:wink: 

(Oh, and BTW, little Mr. G. isnt listed in your siggie!:twitch::biggrin1::biggrin1


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

CorgiPaws said:


> This was my username for a couple years, and it just made me sad after we didn't have Grissom anymore.
> I never really LIKED PuppyPaws. Actually Bill picked it.
> But now that there's a Corgi in the house again, it fits. I think to a lot of the long time members, I was always CorgiPaws... considering a lot of my PM's refer to me as that. lol.


I never really accepted the puppypaws and just automatically changed it in my head back to Corgipaws. I didn't even realize it was officially change until someone just mentioned it!


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## Rodeo (Sep 11, 2011)

I REALLY wish I had taken before and afters of Roxxie. Her coat was so dull and rough on both blue buff. wilderness and TOTW. She looked GREAT on raw, and had much more muscle definition. Granted she was still a stubby AmBully who couldn't run a mile.


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## RCTRIPLEFRESH5 (Feb 11, 2010)

Huginn said:


> I was going to ask the same thing. . .
> 
> AND RC, while I am sure to you there appeared to be no change in coat soft/shininess, I can't help but doubt you. I work in a pet store for going on three years, I have worked in a vet clinic and . . . well owners who say that their dog's coat is amazing on junk food have no idea what they are saying.
> 
> I am not trying to be rude or bash you, but well. . . I am a cynic. That is who I am. I am happy that your dogs are on better food, but the way your wording was it really sounded like you were saying that there is nothing wrong with those diets. Maybe, considering being a little clearer in your posts and we will avoid this type of confrontation in the future


I was pretty clear in my post that i advocate meat diets...i jusst said that dogs have shiny coats on crud diets and that corn glistens coats...not sure if corn really does, but ive heard it.


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> I was pretty clear in my post that i advocate meat diets...i jusst said that dogs have shiny coats on crud diets and that corn glistens coats...not sure if corn really does, but ive heard it.


The answer is NO, it doesn't.


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

RCTRIPLEFRESH5 said:


> I dont care if you doubt it, they are my dogs and I know it is true.
> obviously I know a lot about canine nutrition if the diets i advocate ar high meat kibbles and pmr.[...]but yeah my dogs have always had a nice shine and soft coat.


I will tell you one thing. There is no way to really compare coat quality without having had experience feeding PMR to your dog for a sufficient period of time. It's not just "shine"; it's coat texture, amount of shedding, coat thickness, coat length (for a sheltie for example), skin quality, etc. The amount and quality of fat and omega 3's should have the most effect on coat quality. For example, if I were to feed Science Diet, which contains corn and animal fat, I would not expect the same results as feeding sardines and raw beef heart fat.


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Nothing opened my eyes, actually. It was ME who was bored with the kibble. I grew up with dogs who were kibble fed. My grandfather has always fed Kirkland to his dobermans and when my mom married my stepdad I moved into a house with his (one became mine) two Iams dogs. Dude's breeder fed Pedigree so we switched my brittany over to it too. When I got married last December and moved out of my parents' house I was so bored with feeding Dude kibble and making him eat (yes, I can make my dogs eat and drink on command... It comes in handy when they are exhausted and aren't drinking enough water to keep themselves hydrated!). I would pour his kibble into his bowl and it would sit there ALL day long with only half of it eaten. He only got a cup and a half of food. I was bored with feeding him that so I started looking at raw and came across this site. The picture thread in the raw section made me ultimately set a date to start PMR (the day we brought Buck home in the last week of May) and that's when I started getting really into dog nutrition and learned the horrors of common kibbles.




CorgiPaws said:


> I will admit to having seen some dogs on crappy food with seemingly good coats. But, 9/10 are awful. Genetics plays a role here, too. I think my biggest gripe is the greasy nasty film that's on kibble fed dogs that is worse on junk food. I was feeding evo before going raw, and I didn't even realize that my dogs felt gross until the raw fixed it. In fact: aside from Grissom who was obviously having problems, I thought my dogs were the picture of health! I was wrong. But you can't even know that until you do something different and see it for yourself.


I JUST now realized that THAT is why I am so much more willing to pet Dude now! I couldn't put my finger on it. I enjoy petting him so much more now because, even after months of not having a bath, he isn't greasy! Dude was always really greasy and I bathed him AT LEAST every 5 weeks or so. These guys haven't had a bath in nearly 4 months (it's too cold and they are too anti-bath to sit still in the tub) and neither dog is greasy. Neither smell like dog either.

I recently learned that hounds are supposed to smell... I had someone come up to me and say, "Wow... A hound that doesn't stink!" I felt completely clueless. I said, "Of course he doesn't stink". He asked how often I bathed him. I said, "I haven't bathed him in nearly four months". Apparently hounds are supposed to have a strong, musky smell... Mine doesn't...


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## Breathing Borla (Apr 30, 2010)

this site helped me the most. I found good brands like orijen and EVO that helped Roxy greatly. She now runs like a finely oiled machine:becky:

this dog never runs out of energy, if you don't run her you can't deal with her.

I guess this is normal for weims and weim mixes.

love my dog


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## doggiedad (Jan 23, 2011)

your dog was 13 years old when he died. it doesn't
seem like the food you fed him did him any harm.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

doggiedad said:


> your dog was 13 years old when he died. it doesn't
> seem like the food you fed him did him any harm.


Well, he lost his teeth for one thing. He probably wouldn't have done that with raw food.

I have read that raw fed dogs might live more or less, but they tend not to have the chronic illnesses that dry-fed dogs have.

So far, that's showing in my own dogs. They haven't died yet, but I know neither one has anything chronic except the arthritis and heart disease they had before - and if Snorkels had been fed raw, she probably WOULD have all her teeth, and I think there's a darn good chance she wouldn't have heart disease and spinal arthritis.


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## Sapphire-Light (Aug 8, 2010)

Dude and Bucks Mamma said:


> Nothing opened my eyes, actually. It was ME who was bored with the kibble. I grew up with dogs who were kibble fed. My grandfather has always fed Kirkland to his dobermans and when my mom married my stepdad I moved into a house with his (one became mine) two Iams dogs. Dude's breeder fed Pedigree so we switched my brittany over to it too. When I got married last December and moved out of my parents' house I was so bored with feeding Dude kibble and making him eat (yes, I can make my dogs eat and drink on command... It comes in handy when they are exhausted and aren't drinking enough water to keep themselves hydrated!). I would pour his kibble into his bowl and it would sit there ALL day long with only half of it eaten. He only got a cup and a half of food. I was bored with feeding him that so I started looking at raw and came across this site. The picture thread in the raw section made me ultimately set a date to start PMR (the day we brought Buck home in the last week of May) and that's when I started getting really into dog nutrition and learned the horrors of common kibbles.
> 
> 
> I JUST now realized that THAT is why I am so much more willing to pet Dude now! I couldn't put my finger on it. I enjoy petting him so much more now because, even after months of not having a bath, he isn't greasy! Dude was always really greasy and I bathed him AT LEAST every 5 weeks or so. These guys haven't had a bath in nearly 4 months (it's too cold and they are too anti-bath to sit still in the tub) and neither dog is greasy. Neither smell like dog either.
> ...


LOL, Pompadour gets bored of eating just kibble too, wit raw he gets all exited , marchs and whines until he gets the meat 

I bath him every week, not because he stinks but the reason is that he is shown, so his coat has to be pristine and tangle free. :redface:




doggiedad said:


> your dog was 13 years old when he died. it doesn't
> seem like the food you fed him did him any harm.





xellil said:


> Well, he lost his teeth for one thing. He probably wouldn't have done that with raw food.
> 
> I have read that raw fed dogs might live more or less, but they tend not to have the chronic illnesses that dry-fed dogs have.
> 
> So far, that's showing in my own dogs. They haven't died yet, but I know neither one has anything chronic except the arthritis and heart disease they had before - and if Snorkels had been fed raw, she probably WOULD have all her teeth, and I think there's a darn good chance she wouldn't have heart disease and spinal arthritis.




He also went compleatly blind at 10, was loosing his smell sent and his tummy was bald wit zits hwell: and was a heavy shedder, his fur was all dry and harsh.


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## ajcstr (May 24, 2010)

Sprocket said:


> After read and researching I took the plunge into PMR and haven't regretted it once  Gunners farts are few and far between. They also do not smell the way they did. Mikey lost the weight in a month and his teeth are amazing.


Sorry... PMR ??


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## danecolor (Nov 22, 2010)

PMR = Prey Model Raw (meat, bone, and organs)


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## Mondo (Dec 20, 2011)

Periodontal disease opened my eyes. After having the diagnosis, and having Tuffy have 3 teeth removed .. that started the ball rolling. Vet says "brush teeth daily". Asked my groomer for tips on that, groomer said "good luck brushing Tuffy's teeth" -- she knows Tuffy. Then says, buy raw bones right now. Keep them in the freezer, and in a week after Tuffy's mouth is healed, start feeding. And no more kibble. 

In the meantime I did some research. Finding the incidence of periodontal disease among dogs and cats to be astronomical. 85% of dogs at 3 years of age? Then found the connection of that to kibble, and the connection between veterinary assocations and the pet food industry.

Ah, just watched my guys enjoy a little turkey neck in the yard. Gotta say with raw, nothing is ever refused by either. No sniffing and walking away. Cut up some blade roast for them earlier, made some freezer packets. Great price, $2 per pound. Had a few scraps left which was a bit of an appetizer.


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## KittyKat (Feb 11, 2011)

Well I remember we were feeding my cat meow mix (ew I know)... and the vet kept pushing science diet. We bought it after after a bag or so my mom compared the ingredients between the two. They didn't really seem any different. We wondered WHY there was CORN in the cat food. We went to the grocery store and compared bags, they all had the same stuff so we went back to meow mix since we didn't see any alternative. Eventually we after doing more research we found out about origin at a local pet food store and switched over to that. It was a a lot better then what we used to be feeding, but I was never really happy... I figured there had to be something more.... natural.

When we were going to get a dog I did more research, I found out about PMR, and came across this site and never looked back.


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