# Heart worm preventative



## barneysmom2510 (Oct 12, 2011)

I apologize if this is in the wrong place I just wanted some raw feeders opinons. I have been reading alot lately about the dangers of heartworm preventative. I was wondering what others did about using it. I live in mass so it stays below 57 degrees for moths I read it had to stay above this temp to go through the lifecycle in a mosquito. Do people up this way not use it during the winter. I have always been anti overvaccination and anti flea products but when it comes to this subject it scares me to go totally natural. some sites say it is east to treat but I have read some stories from people who have experienced it and say it is a very difficult treatment. I have had Barney on heartworm since he was a puppy. I am going between giving every 60 days, not during the cold months or year round. There is so much info on both sides I figured I would get people's input.
Thanks


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

What dangers have you read about it? As far as I know, the only danger I have ever heard of is herding breeds with ivermectin. My vet told me the rule of thumb on that is "white feet don't treat". Ivermectin is said to cause seizures in mainly collies, but aussies and other herding breeds as well. I'm guessing its true, and white feet I mean pads. (according to our vet) We currently use Heartgard Plus, but I plan on changing to Interceptor when its time.

If you don't want to use preventative, maybe you could use AdvantixII since it repels mosquitoes? Could be a thaught. It may help reduce the chances of heartworm.

If you are talking about the treatment for hearworms themselves, it is a tough treatment. It can be rather dangerous not to mention expensive.


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## shellbell (Sep 24, 2011)

I give Interceptor every month. Heartworm is not something I want to mess around with....


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

Coming from Florida, I heartworm Mollie every 4-5 weeks or so, year round. Heartworm is something I'm just not willing to risk. I don't give Windy the cat heartworm preventative, the vet told me heartworm in cats is nowhere as great a risk as in dogs, that cat's aren't as susceptible. I don't use flea preventatives on either of them. I'm all for natural stuff, and I do hate dosing Mol, but in my book, the consequences of a natural preventative not working are just too great.


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## barneysmom2510 (Oct 12, 2011)

That's how I was feeling. I have been giving Barney interceptor every 5 weeks. As much as I would love to go all natural when I read about the herbal treatments being so effective and easy it seemed far fetched. I do have a holistic vet and we use meds when necessary and holistic treatments when we can. I was reading a natural dog website and it was explained the heart worm life cycle.. It said if at anytime the temp gets above 57 degrees the lifecycle of the heartworm aborts and the whole process starts again. In december though February it never gets above that so I did know if year round was needed. This was where I got the info 
Home


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

Having gone through heartworm treatment with my Doxie, I would never mess around with any sort of holistic preventatives. I can tell you flat out, they are a total farce. In the case of heartworms, prevention is SO MUCH EASIER than treatment. You do NOT want to ever go through heartworm treatment with any dog. 

To read more about the number of reported heartworm cases in your area, see: American Heartworm Society | What Is Heartworm Disease?

If I were you, I would treat with Interceptor on a 45-day schedule.


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

Oh dear, that info is making me doubt the vets advice about cats. I'm nervous now, maybe I should start giving her some type of preventative meds. We are in an area where it is 1-5 cases of heartworm reported per clinic.


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## Kat (Jul 12, 2011)

I use Revolution 6 months out of the year, stopping in the winter time. Someone on this forum said that Revolution stays in the system longer then a month so they only dose their dog with it every other month as opposed to every month. I have not tried this yet, except I didnt give Rubys last dose in November because she went through an annoying diarrhea and mucous poop phase and I didnt want to make it worse by giving Revolution.


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## PeanutsMommy (Dec 7, 2008)

i use heartgard plus. in fact, today was Peanut's dosing day. he gets it every 10th of the month. i don't use any other chemicals and we are not really in the area that heartworm is prevelent but it is one thing i do not want to take chances with him possibly getting.


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## Steph (Jun 24, 2011)

The following info I'm going to give is what I DO. I'm not telling anyone to do this. If you choose to, do it at your own risk (however, IMO there really is no risk). I give my dogs Ivomec once a month. It's actually for cattle, but the active ingredient is Ivermectin, the same active ingredient in Heartguard. It comes in a big bottle and must be drawn up with a syringe however, I give it orally (injected into a piece of food, not directly into the mouth). The dosage I use is .1cc per 10 lbs of dog. The bottle was $30 and will last me for years. I was sick and tired of overpaying for some ivermectin injected into a crappy beefy preserved treat every month and did a little research. 

Many vets will advise you not to do this because of overdosing risk. But the fact is, when a dog has mange, the ivermectin dose is like 5 times that of the heartguard dose and the dogs don't die. AND hearguard has a failure rate as well.


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

Steph said:


> The following info I'm going to give is what I DO. I'm not telling anyone to do this. If you choose to, do it at your own risk (however, IMO there really is no risk). I give my dogs Ivomec once a month. It's actually for cattle, but the active ingredient is Ivermectin, the same active ingredient in Heartguard. It comes in a big bottle and must be drawn up with a syringe however, I give it orally (injected into a piece of food, not directly into the mouth). The dosage I use is .1cc per 10 lbs of dog. The bottle was $30 and will last me for years. I was sick and tired of overpaying for some ivermectin injected into a crappy beefy preserved treat every month and did a little research.
> 
> Many vets will advise you not to do this because of overdosing risk. But the fact is, when a dog has mange, the ivermectin dose is like 5 times that of the heartguard dose and the dogs don't die. AND hearguard has a failure rate as well.


One thing to remember...HeartGard also has a guarantee. If you start HeartGard religiously following manufacturer's instructions, with proof of initial negative heartworm testing, and your dog ends up contracting heartworms, Merial will pay for treatment.


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## twotonelover (Jan 10, 2011)

I'm also in Massachusetts, I do interceptor once every 6 weeks from June through November. Sometimes I start in May if mosquito weather comes early, and sometimes I don't start until July if it stays cooler out, but for the most part its June-Nov.


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## Steph (Jun 24, 2011)

tem_sat said:


> One thing to remember...HeartGard also has a guarantee. If you start HeartGard religiously following manufacturer's instructions, with proof of initial negative heartworm testing, and your dog ends up contracting heartworms, Merial will pay for treatment.


I wouldn't give a crap if merial paid for it! Treatment is a dose of arsenic to the dogs spine. Some dogs die during treatment. If my dog contracted heartworm after paying out of the butt for Heartguard and Merial told me they'd pay, I'd still be livid. Which is why i believe 100% in my method.

Not trying to be argumentative. I'm sure heartguard's failure rate is low, but I was just trying to explain my reasoning of why I chose the method I did.


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## PeanutsMommy (Dec 7, 2008)

the reason vets will tell you not to use ivermectin in that manner is because it is off label use. doing so can be dangerous as you have mentioned.
i would personally rather have the dosage done for me so that it is at safe levels then if something goes wrong someone else is at fault and will help me out rather then be responsible for what happened to my dog and have to do things myself.

hope i made sense


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

Steph said:


> I wouldn't give a crap if merial paid for it! Treatment is a dose of arsenic to the dogs spine. Some dogs die during treatment. If my dog contracted heartworm after paying out of the butt for Heartguard and Merial told me they'd pay, I'd still be livid. Which is why i believe 100% in my method.
> 
> Not trying to be argumentative. I'm sure heartguard's failure rate is low, but I was just trying to explain my reasoning of why I chose the method I did.


I would have been appreciative if Merial had covered my heartworm treatment bill (which was in the 4 figures realm), however, my Doxie was being given off label Ivermectin as well before I adopted him. Yes, he had a heartworm test which showed up negative prior to being given Ivermectin, but less than 6 months later he tested HW positive. Luckily he didn't experience any shock from the Ivermectin. As long as your pets are being treated with preventative, that is fine.


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## Steph (Jun 24, 2011)

Thats why I make sure to weigh my dogs before each dose and dose properly. It's the same active ingredient so it doesn't worry me. And if you have a vet that's ok with raw, you can be sure you'll have a vet that will give you the proper dosage for ivomec.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

barneysmom2510 said:


> I apologize if this is in the wrong place I just wanted some raw feeders opinons. I have been reading alot lately about the dangers of heartworm preventative. I was wondering what others did about using it. I live in mass so it stays below 57 degrees for moths I read it had to stay above this temp to go through the lifecycle in a mosquito. Do people up this way not use it during the winter. I have always been anti overvaccination and anti flea products but when it comes to this subject it scares me to go totally natural. some sites say it is east to treat but I have read some stories from people who have experienced it and say it is a very difficult treatment. I have had Barney on heartworm since he was a puppy. I am going between giving every 60 days, not during the cold months or year round. There is so much info on both sides I figured I would get people's input.
> Thanks


I go to a holistic vet who actually recommends only 3 doses a year for our area, spaced 3 months apart (July 15th, September 1st, and October 15th). I'm sure you know that heartworm meds work retroactively, since you are giving them only every 60 days....We have hot summers down here in Maryland, but even our temperatures don't stay above 60 for 2 weeks until late May or June. If my dog were to contract heartworm right in the beginning of the season, the first dose would take care of it. 

Actually...my vet even goes so far as to say you don't have to medicate for heartworm for my area *if* your dog is primarily an indoor dog or if you live near the water (the bay areas here are quite nasty...). Basically the odds of the right mosquito biting the right infected animal, and then biting your dog, all under the right conditions are quite low. I can't say I'm 100% comfortable with not giving any HW meds, even though he doesn't medicate his dog, but I have considered it. I only dosed my dog twice this summer, but I also got his blood tested at the end of the season, which came back negative. So for next year, I'm thinking I might try the 2 doses followed by a post-season blood test or some other sort of combination. 

While I can't tell you not to medicate, I know many who do not. But at the bare minimum, don't give HW meds during the winter months. I see you live up in MA, you shouldn't need more than 2-3 doses like me per year. (ETA: Of course, still do yearly or semi-yearly HW blood tests too!)


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## PeanutsMommy (Dec 7, 2008)

Steph said:


> Thats why I make sure to weigh my dogs before each dose and dose properly. It's the same active ingredient so it doesn't worry me. And if you have a vet that's ok with raw, you can be sure you'll have a vet that will give you the proper dosage for ivomec.


its one thing if you have experience with it but it is another thing to recommend off label usage for the novice 
not saying anything against you by any means.


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## Steph (Jun 24, 2011)

Right, which is why I prefaced my original post with "do at your own risk".


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## westminsterthree (Jan 10, 2012)

Steph said:


> Right, which is why I prefaced my original post with "do at your own risk".


I use the horse paste $3.99 provides 50 doses but it has to be used within 2 years.


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## Steph (Jun 24, 2011)

That to. I used that when my pet rats had lice. I literally just dipped the tip of a toothpick in the paste and that was the dosage.


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## westminsterthree (Jan 10, 2012)

If your dogs are 50lbs or more the paste is the way to go, i use Durvet Apple. Liquid Ivomec is fine if you dilute with PG and share it with others or else it expires before you use 75% of it.

However, any breed like a collie where there is a genetic issue with some individuals, should stay on Heartguard or a similar product.


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## Steph (Jun 24, 2011)

Ill keep that in mind. Even if it does expire within the year, it was still cheaper than Heartguard.

EDIT: I just checked my bottle and its good until 2015. So yea it is for sure a money saver.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

is there really a need for heart worm testing? Abbie and Murph are on interceptor may-october...


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## JayJayisme (Aug 2, 2009)

I live in a subtropical climate. My dogs get an annual HW test, and Revolution monthly during the spring/summer and into fall, and every 6 weeks in the winter. No problems thus far.


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## tem_sat (Jun 20, 2010)

westminsterthree said:


> If your dogs are 50lbs or more the paste is the way to go, i use Durvet Apple. Liquid Ivomec is fine if you dilute with PG and share it with others or else it expires before you use 75% of it.
> 
> However, any breed like a collie where there is a genetic issue with some individuals, should stay on Heartguard or a similar product.


Ivermectin, which is the active ingredient in Heartgard, is not recommended for Collies / herding dogs. Interceptor would be appropriate for those breeds.


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## AveryandAudrey (Sep 20, 2010)

Both of my girls get heartguard monthly.


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## barneysmom2510 (Oct 12, 2011)

twotonelover said:


> I'm also in Massachusetts, I do interceptor once every 6 weeks from June through November. Sometimes I start in May if mosquito weather comes early, and sometimes I don't start until July if it stays cooler out, but for the most part its June-Nov.


That has always been my thinking and I only dose my other dogs when may comes around. Once I got my new but I started up researching again and there is so much info on both sides it gets overwhelming. When I read about the tems having to stay above 57 for a period of weeks that only happens in the warm months around here. My town is pretty much surrounded by the ocean so it stays cooler.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

tem_sat said:


> Ivermectin, which is the active ingredient in Heartgard, is not recommended for Collies / herding dogs. Interceptor would be appropriate for those breeds.


I asked my vet about that, and she said the rule of thumb is "white feet don't treat". By white, meaning light colored pads not the hair. Aussie and Copper have dark, so they are on Heartgard, but Shadow has pink looking pads. So, I'm putting them all on Interceptor just to be on the safe side. I don't like taking those chances.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

naturalfeddogs said:


> I asked my vet about that, and she said the rule of thumb is "white feet don't treat". By white, meaning light colored pads not the hair. Aussie and Copper have dark, so they are on Heartgard, but Shadow has pink looking pads. So, I'm putting them all on Interceptor just to be on the safe side. I don't like taking those chances.


You can also have a blood test done for it, which is what I plan on doing with Keeva and Rhett. Being that they will be around horses their whole life I want to know if I have anything to worry about about either one of them, and also if we were to move somewhere that they needed HW meds!:wink:


EDIT: Sorry it looks like it is actually a cheek swab.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

Once it gets below 50, I stop hw meds, usually between oct-april, but we also do yearly hw testing to be on the safe side.


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## erinwagner (Aug 30, 2010)

In MN we test every spring and give preventative beginning in May and ending in November.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Scarlett_O' said:


> You can also have a blood test done for it, which is what I plan on doing with Keeva and Rhett. Being that they will be around horses their whole life I want to know if I have anything to worry about about either one of them, and also if we were to move somewhere that they needed HW meds!:wink:


What is the test testing for? And out of curiosity, what harm are the horses?


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## monkeys23 (Dec 8, 2010)

Horses are wormed with ivermectin and dogs love to eat poo. 

I use Interceptor for hw preventative. Only in summer months. Usually I dose with Frontline Plus twice in the summer months too, but I am thinking of getting some food grade DE instead.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

naturalfeddogs said:


> What is the test testing for? And out of curiosity, what harm are the horses?


Sorry it looks like it is actually a cheek swab....but here ya go for some more info!:smile:
Cause of ivermectin sensitivity in Collies determined at the College of Veterinary Medicine, Washington State University


And exactly what Monkey said....we use ivermectin for our horses, and I dont ever want to have to worry about them eating manure, or eating/licking it off of me or the horse's area!!:wink: (It is also my preferred way of dealing with a few other things, including but not limited to ear mites...so I want to know if they are affected by it!!:thumb


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Yea, we worm our horses with ivermectin in their deworming rotation. Our dogs occasionaly eat horse poop and I never thaught about that as being a problem. I feel like the chances of ivermectin being a problem are much greater when it is given directly to the dog as a dewormer vs. second hand from the horse. After having been raised with horses and herding dogs as well, and all those years nothing, I just don't know how much of a worry that is. However, I will stay away from ivermectin for the dogs for sure.

Abi, thanks for posting that site! Thats really interesting. I never knew there was a way to test for that.


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## barneysmom2510 (Oct 12, 2011)

I know one of my vets will not sell me heartworm meds unless I test my dogs yearly.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

​Ours won't either. And one thing I have never heard mention of from the vets is about the herding dog/ivermectin thing.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

naturalfeddogs said:


> Yea, we worm our horses with ivermectin in their deworming rotation. Our dogs occasionaly eat horse poop and I never thaught about that as being a problem. I feel like the chances of ivermectin being a problem are much greater when it is given directly to the dog as a dewormer vs. second hand from the horse. After having been raised with horses and herding dogs as well, and all those years nothing, I just don't know how much of a worry that is. However, I will stay away from ivermectin for the dogs for sure.
> 
> Abi, thanks for posting that site! Thats really interesting. I never knew there was a way to test for that.


You are more then welcome!!:biggrin1:

I think I more worry about them smelling it on me(we normally get the banana or apple flavored ones) and then eating it(as Im the one who helps with the hard to worms and the babies)...thus testing. Thankfully my gelding LOVES the flavored stuff...so I dont have to worry getting it from him!LOL



barneysmom2510 said:


> I know one of my vets will not sell me heartworm meds unless I test my dogs yearly.


Ya, that is how they have always done it for us(all over the country).....up here that isnt the case, sadly.....but then I just dont go to those vets anymore!!LOL


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

I don't worry about the poop from an ivermectin wormed horse, but I have never thaught about the dogs getting into the wormer tubes, or maybe licking up what a horse spits out. I will be vey careful about that from here on out!


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