# Puppy!!!



## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Hello all, as you may or may not know I am an avid and obsessed Doberman Pinscher lover. So I finally found a breeder that seems not only good, but affordable (only $600 for a puppy) in my old hometown no less! Please feel free to check out her ads and tell me what you honestly think of it: ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming

ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming

The best part is, she isn't due til the end of December so I won't be getting the puppy until the end of February/beginning of March (happy birthday to me!). The bad part is that she knows nothing about nutrition, but I'll be able to get my pup away early enough so that not too much permanent damage is done. 

Anyway, now I'm gonna be a crazy 20 something like CorgiPaws with three dogs and my dream pup from a breeder and engaged nonetheless ! :wink:

I feel conflicted about this for two reasons: 
1. My fiance really wants a german shepherd but I'm not the hugest fan of them (not compared to a doberman anyway) and the one he wants will be ready at Christmas (way too soon!) and looks like it will be one of the long-haired shepherds (_really_ not my style). So I feel bad because all the dogs are mine and none are really going to be his or the type he wants anyway. 
2. I hate buying and breeders and hate the fact that I'm not rescuing a dobie. But in my defense, every single doberman that needs rescuing will not work with my lifestyle. Either they hate dogs, hate male dogs, hate cats, have severe separation anxiety, or are $12,000 (sadly, that's not an exaggeration, I e-mailed a breeder about a trained dobie last night and that was the price of him!). 

And finally (sorry for the long post), does anyone have any doberman experience on here? I'm definitely wanting a black and rust and I'm leaning more towards a male.


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Hello all, as you may or may not know I am an avid and obsessed Doberman Pinscher lover. So I finally found a breeder that seems not only good, but affordable (only $600 for a puppy) in my old hometown no less! Please feel free to check out her ads and tell me what you honestly think of it: ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming
> 
> ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming
> 
> ...


Wow! That sure is a beautiful dobe mom. She looks healthy too. I don't know much about dobermans. Are they a hardy breed? They are very sweet dogs. I met one where I used to work at a daycare/boarding place. When I got Aspen from the breeder, I asked about OFA certifications and things like that. She also had him on Pro Plan, yuck!!! And I also did my research on the breed. I think you should too. I also wanted to rescue a mal, but I wanted to raise a puppy. Puppy mals are nearly impossible to find at shelters. Believe me, I looked everywhere!!


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

Honestly, I would let the SO "win," but that's just me.

Very pretty dogs!

I wouldn't be concerned about "permanent damage" from a less than ideal diet. Plus, the pup should be nursing for the first 4-6 weeks anyways.

I remember a few years back I saw a GORGEOUS GSDxDobie mix at Dobie Rescue in Fillmore, CA when I volunteered there. She was such an amazing animal. Maybe you can find one of those? :biggrin:


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Really, no one here is going to be able to help you with the fiance problem. Thats a decision you will have to make. I suppose getting 2 more dogs is pretty impractical? One thought from an old man ... you are very young, barely out of childhood. If you don't get the dog you want right now, there are many years left to find him/her(this also applies to fiance).

Good luck with whatever you decide.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

The only thing that I would ask the breeder about is OFA certifications, bloodwork, temperment testing, etc on both parents. I am personally not a fan of AKC, CKC, etc on registration, and think that the health of the parents is more important. I just skimmed the ad that you posted and the parents look very beautiful! But like I said, I think that health is the most important thing.

Also, no link to a website? Its always good to see the breeder keep an updated website with pictures and a blog about the parents and puppies...instead of just posting up an ad in the local classifieds. I am not saying that having only an ad is a bad thing necessarily, but its nice to be able to watch your puppy grow when you can't be there. Your breeder should also show you a copy of the pedigree (one of the most important breeding tools and shows she didn't just get a male and female to breed).

As far as dealing with the fiance? Maybe sit down and talk about* why* he wants a GSD and *why* you want a Dobie. Compare and contast the breeds and the whys of wanting a puppy from that breed. Maybe research a few breeds that have similar traits to what you are looking for in a dog. But like RFD said, this is a situation that you need to figure out between the two of you.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Oh and here's the stud: ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming

Yeah, I keep telling myself that, but this opportunity to get a Dobe is so perfect and I've wanted one for so long. And in all honesty, I'm probably going to be doing 90% of the work on the dog anyway! I do feel really bad about him not getting his dog, since the two we have now are mine. But still *whines* haha

I checked with the breeder and she said both dogs have no health problems, her dog actually came to her from some Dobie breeder in SLC and assures me they're both OFA certified. She definitely does her research on her studs because she got 8 responses for studs and when she checked their pedigrees, two of them were her dam's half-brothers and one ended up having a blood disease that would be passed on two 50% of the litter, so she was horrified and walked away from them. 

I think I definitely will sit him down and talk to him about it. He assures me he's fine with a Dobie and will love it even though it's not a GSD, but you never know with men! I know it's what he has his heart set on but he told me that he loves puppies so he really doesn't care  let's hope he's telling the truth!


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Oh and I asked her to send me pics of all the pups from her last litter and she said she'd be more than happy to and provide references. I'll probably demand weekly photo updates as well!


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

Gotta agree with RFD. As another person who is older then dirt and married about as long, I'd look at this new pup as the opportunity for the two of you to start a family together. Not your pup, or his pup, but 'our new pup'. 

We had AKC chows for years and got higher and higher in quality and now we finally have 'Rocky' the chow/husky pup we got from the rescue group. Guess which dog is the healthiest, smartest, and most spoiled of any we have owned! I'm not saying I will never get another purebred Chow but at this point I"m very happy with my rescue Chusky puppy who travels the country with us in the RV. You both could look for a dobie/shepherd rescue puppy together and be surprised at what you find out there.


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> I checked with the breeder and she said both dogs have no health problems, her dog actually came to her from some Dobie breeder in SLC and assures me they're both OFA certified.


You can search the OFA database yourself to check. :smile:

Here is the OFA record for my pup's sire as an example.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

If she has done the health and temperment testing, she will have no problem showing you the proof then and you need to see proof of these tests. :wink:

Same with the pedigree, ask to see it. 

Before commiting to a puppy, go and visit her and meet the parents. This is much easier if the puppies are not born yet! You don't have the added pressure of seeing a bunch of cute puppies and wanting to for sure take one. Trust me...this is how we ended up with Akasha. We went out all the way to NE to visit the breeder and meet the parents. We ended up taking a puppy right then and there because we couldn't bare to leave her...I wont ever do that again LOL. 

Going and meeting the breeder/parents will give you an idea of how they treat their dogs first hand, this might change your mind completely about this breeder. Everyone has their own opinions when it comes to BYB and what makes a BYB. Mine are pretty non-conventional...


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## g00dgirl (Nov 18, 2009)

Personally, I don't know that I've seen any truly reputable breeders place classified ads to sell their puppies and stud out their dogs. That sends out a red flag to me and I would be surprised if you get any real paperwork or proof of health testing on the dogs. Not a vet check, but real hip/thyroid/heart testing like danemama is talking about.
I could be totally wrong about them though, the only way to find out is to ask.
Having said that, I'm sure both of my dogs are from backyard breeders (and that is what I consider breeders that post classified ads) but I adopted them from a shelter. I couldn't ethically BUY one from a BYB and support those types of practices especially when there are so many in shelters. Perhaps you have thought about his and have a different viewpoint.
If cost is an issue, have you considered a rescue? If you are patient you can even find puppies in rescues. I saw an adorable red boy in mine once and would have gotten him if my landlord would allow it


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Hello all, as you may or may not know I am an avid and obsessed Doberman Pinscher lover. So I finally found a breeder that seems not only good, but affordable (only $600 for a puppy) in my old hometown no less! Please feel free to check out her ads and tell me what you honestly think of it: ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming
> 
> ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming
> 
> ...


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Thanks wags!

I talked with my fiance and so long as we name the puppy "Timber" and it's "our" puppy, then he is totally fine with it :biggrin:

However, as soon as I showed him pics and he noticed the docked tails (guess he didn't remember that part of the breed), he freaked out and was so adamantly against it he wants me to call the breeder tomorrow and see if she will leave our pup's tail un-docked *sigh* it just figures i have to love one of those breeds that looks better deformed. They look like labs or hounds when they aren't done up. I'm fine with no ear cropping and i know the tail thing is evil, but still.

Anyone know any medical reason why their tails get docked or is it just to make them better guard/fighting dogs? I heard it's better to crop their ears so they're less prone to ear infections but methinks that is a bunch of bs since my floppy-eared dog has never had even dirty ears her entire life and I've never had to clean them either.


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> However, as soon as I showed him pics and he noticed the docked tails (guess he didn't remember that part of the breed), he freaked out and was so adamantly against it he wants me to call the breeder tomorrow and see if she will leave our pup's tail un-docked *sigh* it just figures i have to love one of those breeds that looks better deformed. They look like labs or hounds when they aren't done up. I'm fine with no ear cropping and i know the tail thing is evil, but still.
> 
> Anyone know any medical reason why their tails get docked or is it just to make them better guard/fighting dogs? I heard it's better to crop their ears so they're less prone to ear infections but methinks that is a bunch of bs since my floppy-eared dog has never had even dirty ears her entire life and I've never had to clean them either.


:raises hand: I do!

I am a HUGE advocate for docking tails. While there are show reasons to dock tails, there are also medical reasons.

The tail in some breeds are coated in enough hair and/or tissue to be sufficiently protective for the tail. Then, there are other breeds with more spindly tails with little hair like pointers, boxers, weimeraners, and, yes, dobermans. These types of tails lack the protection to prevent tail damage, such as breaking the tail or the end splitting from hitting hard objects when wagging or getting caught in the door.

Since the tail is long, thin, and the furthest away from the heart, it has very low blood flow to it, particularly the tip. Because of this, when any injury does happen, it will take forever to heal if it ever does. Tons of times, you will hear about dogs that have to end up getting their tail amputated later on anyways due to repetitive injuries and infections. 

When my bitch had her litter, I went and assisted at the vet's with the docking. (I am a vet student and have a good relationship with my vet, so she allowed this.) It was done at only 3 days of age. While the pups cried, it was no more than their crying when mom stood up to leave and they toppled over. One pup, actually, believe it or not, sleep through it! The nerd. 

Was it painful at the time? Maybe. Do they remember it? Nope. If you know a Jewish man well enough, ask him if he remembers his circumcision. My BF is Jewish and I asked him; no memory what's so ever.

The Council of Docked Breeds is a great resource on the pros of tail docking.

I own boxers and, despite my love for the breed, I don't know if I could bring myself to own one without a docked tail. I honestly think that is would be detrimental to their quality of life to have to have an undocked tail.

But, the decision is up to you. Here is the website for the Anti-Docking Alliance for balance.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Dogs use their tails to "talk" with. If you take away his tail, you are taking away PART of their ability to communicate. Having said that, after have worked wit a lot of dog who don't have tails, they don't seem to miss it or be handicapped in any way.


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> Dogs use their tails to "talk" with. If you take away his tail, you are taking away PART of their ability to communicate. Having said that, after have worked wit a lot of dog who don't have tails, they don't seem to miss it or be handicapped in any way.


Right. My boxers have been going to dog parks for years and have never gotten in a fight. I have a feeling that any sort of correlation between dog fighting and a lack of tail would be due more in part to lack of socialization. Many that like the "docked tail look" think its great for a guard dog.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

Tail docking is banned in England and in Australia. Apparently it doesn't hurt the dogs in these countries to have their tails intact. I worked for a vet who did both tail docking and ear cropping back in the 80's and yes, the puppies did cry. I've also seen many boxer and dobie puppies with their tails and ear intact. They seem perfectly happy to me and I can't remember any of them coming in with tail injuries from having a long tail. 

It will be getting harder and harder to find a vet willing to crop ears and dock tails (we already did a whole rant on the ear subject awhile back but we could start another on on tail docking just for fun! :} My son and his girlfriend just adopted a boxer mix from a rescue group and it is the sweetest, cutest dog and it actually has a tail and floppy ears.


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

Here is a picture of a Boxer in Sweden after the ban. 










I didn't say they didn't cry. But, pups cry about a lot of things. After the procedure, all the pups were happily nursing again after being put back on the bitch no worse for wear.

I was pretty at my BF's cousin's brisk. He cried, too.


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Thanks wags!
> 
> I talked with my fiance and so long as we name the puppy "Timber" and it's "our" puppy, then he is totally fine with it :biggrin:
> 
> ...


I really like the name TIMBER! I have a neighbor who has a husky and yep thats his name wonderful dog!
Well your fiance has the right to be concerned tail docking is a serious thing! When I was young we had a female dog with her tail docked. She was a mutt but this is what the farmer did at that time! She was no more differnt that any other dog she wagged what we called her stump all the time haha!
I think its a chice preference in ceratin breeds. But I have to admit I just have not seen a doberman without the tail docked and yep many with ear cropping also! I actually dont know if I have seen them without! But go with your gut insitinct here! Most of the time this is what we do and were ususaly right! Not saying likeya right I never make a mistake (God I wish that were true) but I htink your instincts are pretty right on here!
Now I bet your just getting anxious waiting for that puppy! But it is the winter like when we got Gorodn! Those februaury days in and out with puppy! I just hung my winter coat on the back of a chair and it stayed there for quite sometime as I was going in and out with him training him! But I wouldnt change a thing haha! Your going to have so much fun!:smile:
As for the cropping like I said go with your gut! The pup will be fine!:wink:


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Hello all, as you may or may not know I am an avid and obsessed Doberman Pinscher lover. So I finally found a breeder that seems not only good, but affordable (only $600 for a puppy) in my old hometown no less! Please feel free to check out her ads and tell me what you honestly think of it: ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming
> 
> ksl.com - Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming


If there's anything I learned in my long Looooooooong search for a Boxer breeder that fit my needs, it's that you absolutely can not judge a breeder by what you see online. Based on the info in the ksl ads, there are things missing, but lets not assume that this isn't a wonderful breeder just yet. Since they're close- go look at the pups, the breeding stock, the environment, etc. That's really the only way to tell. I know some great breeders with terrible websites. 




rannmiller said:


> The best part is, she isn't due til the end of December so I won't be getting the puppy until the end of February/beginning of March (happy birthday to me!). The bad part is that she knows nothing about nutrition, but I'll be able to get my pup away early enough so that not too much permanent damage is done.


Meh, a lot of breeders don't know squat about nutrition, but it's not the end of the world. Grissom came home on Pedigree and look how he turned out! Okay, okay, BAD example. haha! Better example: Annie came home on pro plan, and she's fine. They're nursing the first few weeks anyway. 



rannmiller said:


> Anyway, now I'm gonna be a crazy 20 something like CorgiPaws with three dogs and my dream pup from a breeder and engaged nonetheless ! :wink:


We should start a club! lol. 
It's wonderful, I wouldn't change it for the world, but it's demanding. Three is MUCH more demanding than two. (we're thinking four might be the trick. HAHA) But to me, my dogs ARE my "lifestyle" so I don't feel like I give anything up. 



rannmiller said:


> I feel conflicted about this for two reasons:
> 1. My fiance really wants a german shepherd but I'm not the hugest fan of them (not compared to a doberman anyway) and the one he wants will be ready at Christmas (way too soon!) and looks like it will be one of the long-haired shepherds (_really_ not my style). So I feel bad because all the dogs are mine and none are really going to be his or the type he wants anyway.


Welllll I know a BEAUTIFUL 3 year old Shepherd/ Golden mix, wonderful with all dogs, cats, people, etc up for adoption juuuuust south of you. lol. 




rannmiller said:


> 2. I hate buying and breeders and hate the fact that I'm not rescuing a dobie. But in my defense, every single doberman that needs rescuing will not work with my lifestyle. Either they hate dogs, hate male dogs, hate cats, have severe separation anxiety, or are $12,000 (sadly, that's not an exaggeration, I e-mailed a breeder about a trained dobie last night and that was the price of him!).


Don't feel bad. I know nothing about dobes, I'll be honest. I know there are SOME breeds I'd NEVER get from a breeder, and then there are those that I can not give up the health testing done by reputable breeders for any other alternative. (ie: boxers) 



rannmiller said:


> And finally (sorry for the long post), does anyone have any doberman experience on here? I'm definitely wanting a black and rust and I'm leaning more towards a male.


No experience there, but you'd be amazed at what you *think* you want, and what you end up *falling in love* with. When I was looking for Grissom, I was in search of a tricolor female, and ended up with a red and white male. And with annie I was looking for a flashy fawn female, and got a plain brindle female. lol. 


oh, and Congratulations on whatever you decide!:biggrin: Let the chaos begin!!


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

I definitely know what you mean about finding the right breeder and dog. Before I got my first Boxer, I talked to 1 standard poodle breeder, 2 dalmatian breeders, 1 weimeraner breeders, 3 boxer breeders, 2 boxer rescues, 1 dobie rescue (it was about the GSDxDobie cross I mentioned), and 1 dalmatian rescue. I ended up visiting 1 standard poodle breeder, 1 dalmatian breeder, 2 boxer breeders, 1 boxer rescue, 1 dobie rescue, and 1 dalmatian rescue, a few of them twice! Where I ended up getting Sparky from I visited twice and then, on the third visit, finally brought her home. :smile:

Most recently, when my boyfriend and I got Tobi, we had a better idea of what we were looking for and only talked to 3 breeders and 2 rescues and visited 1 rescue and 1 breeder. We were planning on visiting two breeders, but only visited one and purchased Tobi from her. She was everything you could want in a breeder: feeds a great food (Innova), tons of health testing, proven bloodlines, both parents were proven in the show and obedience rings, she is helpful, and shows a genuine interest in her dogs. 

Talk to and visit as many groups as you can. Visit GSD breeders and rescues as well as Dobie breeders and rescues. 

Also, I LOVE fawn boxers. Someday, I will have one. So far, my track record includes 4 brindles.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I'm really super hoping for a black and rust, but like you said, we'll see. I get 3rd pick of the litter, so I'm pretty much dying of excitement right about now. I even had a dream last night that they were born already! ...but then later in the dream I was at an animal shelter and crying while hugging all the homeless dogs. Stupid subconscious. 

As a funny twist of fate would have it, my mom and step dad have been wanting to get a puppy lately because apparently my dogs are so well-behaved it makes him believe that dogs can actually be good pets, so they were talking about getting a Great Dane puppy. Now don't get me wrong, Danes are amazing dogs, but my mom isn't the biggest fan of drooling, messes, and dogs on the planet, so I told her that Danes are a WHOLE lotta dog and to maybe reconsider and get something more her size, like a dachshund. Also, my parents didn't even know that Danes can have health problems if not bred and taken care of properly. Silly parents  so then they got it into their heads that Dobermans are smaller than Danes, so they won't have the same health problems and that they want a Doberman instead. Well I explained to my mom that Dobies do, indeed, still have health problems, but it was all over by then. They had their heart set on a Dobie and the fact that my breeder lives in their town sealed the deal. 

So long story short (too late!), I'm sending off the deposits for both of our puppies today, and I'm super excited.


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Congratulations!
I can't wait to see pictures!


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> I'm really super hoping for a black and rust, but like you said, we'll see. I get 3rd pick of the litter, so I'm pretty much dying of excitement right about now. I even had a dream last night that they were born already! ...but then later in the dream I was at an animal shelter and crying while hugging all the homeless dogs. Stupid subconscious.
> 
> As a funny twist of fate would have it, my mom and step dad have been wanting to get a puppy lately because apparently my dogs are so well-behaved it makes him believe that dogs can actually be good pets, so they were talking about getting a Great Dane puppy. Now don't get me wrong, Danes are amazing dogs, but my mom isn't the biggest fan of drooling, messes, and dogs on the planet, so I told her that Danes are a WHOLE lotta dog and to maybe reconsider and get something more her size, like a dachshund. Also, my parents didn't even know that Danes can have health problems if not bred and taken care of properly. Silly parents  so then they got it into their heads that Dobermans are smaller than Danes, so they won't have the same health problems and that they want a Doberman instead. Well I explained to my mom that Dobies do, indeed, still have health problems, but it was all over by then. They had their heart set on a Dobie and the fact that my breeder lives in their town sealed the deal.
> 
> So long story short (too late!), I'm sending off the deposits for both of our puppies today, and I'm super excited.


I got 3rd pick of the litter too! I was so excited. I had to send a $100 dollar deposit. And when I did pick him up, I needed to pay the rest of the money. I had to wait until he was 7.5 weeks old to pick him up. I was looking for ways to make the days pass by faster...! I couldn't wait any longer.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Haha wow that's exactly how it's gonna be for me! only my breeder said she'd take payments beforehand if I want to, which I know will end up the same amount of money, but it's just easier for me to pay for large sums like that sometimes. I think I'm gonna get my pup at 7 weeks old (I guess NV actually made it a law that breeders can't let their pups go before 7 weeks of age, which I think is good! 8 to 10 weeks would be better, but it's a start).


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

So it looks like male Dobermans are way too prone to having issues with other male dogs, so I guess I'm getting a female instead. I'm ok with it, I'm sure my little girl will still be amazing!


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> So it looks like male Dobermans are way too prone to having issues with other male dogs, so I guess I'm getting a female instead. I'm ok with it, I'm sure my little girl will still be amazing!


If you socialize him at an early age with other males, he shouldn't have a problem...right?

That's what they say about mals too. That they are same-sex aggressive. Aspen does fine with other males...because I socialized him as a tiny pup.


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## SuZQuzie (Nov 26, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> So it looks like male Dobermans are way too prone to having issues with other male dogs, so I guess I'm getting a female instead. I'm ok with it, I'm sure my little girl will still be amazing!


Before Boxers, we had Dobermans.

First, just a single female and she was great.

Then, after the first passed away, two females. They beat the **** out of each other and one of them was just awful to every dog she met. We could never trust her. She was tricky and would act happy to see another dog, get a bit pointy, and then turn into a beast. 

Then, two males. They perfectly happy with each other and other male and female dogs.

Just food for thought.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

We had two female Chows at the same time. It ended up that we could never really trust the two of them together. We couldn't even hand them each a treat at the same time without the two of them trying to tear each other apart. Sometimes they would be fine and then something would just set them off and they would go at it and we'd have torn ears and blood all over. 

But, the two male Chows I've had seem to get along with all dogs, male or female. Rocky just loves playing with other male dogs. If i get another dog, it will be another male. I don't think I will ever get two female Chows together again. Just another thought to throw at you and confuse you more!


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## lorih1770 (Jun 17, 2008)

g00dgirl said:


> Personally, I don't know that I've seen any truly reputable breeders place classified ads to sell their puppies and stud out their dogs. That sends out a red flag to me and I would be surprised if you get any real paperwork or proof of health testing on the dogs. Not a vet check, but real hip/thyroid/heart testing like danemama is talking about.
> I could be totally wrong about them though, the only way to find out is to ask.
> Having said that, I'm sure both of my dogs are from backyard breeders (and that is what I consider breeders that post classified ads) but I adopted them from a shelter. I couldn't ethically BUY one from a BYB and support those types of practices especially when there are so many in shelters. Perhaps you have thought about his and have a different viewpoint.
> If cost is an issue, have you considered a rescue? If you are patient you can even find puppies in rescues. I saw an adorable red boy in mine once and would have gotten him if my landlord would allow it



I completely agree. In my opinion a reputable "good" breeder wouldn't post a classified ad or stud out their dogs. They are way more picky about where their dogs go and concerned about protecting their lines. 

I volunteer for 2 rescues and my sister is volunteer for IL Doberman Rescue. If you contact a doberman rescue and work with them they can find you exactly the puppy that you want. It may take a little time and you will have to work with them. In my experience most breed rescues do not post puppies online. There are doberman puppies in rescues and shelters. And if finances are a concern, the adoption fee from a rescue is actually paying for all of the shots and spaying /neutering. Through a breeder you pay for the dog and still have to pay for shots and spay/neuter. 

Make sure to research the breed and the common health issues. My sister's doberman has been an excellent dog. She's great with poeple, loves kids and other animals. She's 13 or 14 now and only recently has a thyriod issue and a disc issues, which I think are both common with Dobes. Wobblers is also common I believe. 

Good luck with whatever you decide and enjoy your pup!


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## lorih1770 (Jun 17, 2008)

Opps, I see you have committed to a puppy before my post.. Congratulations on your new addition!


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

My mom went and visited the breeder and her dog (Natalia) today! She said she is absolutely beautiful, super calm and sweet, and huge with puppies! Natalia is the breeder's only dog so we know it's not a puppy mill type of situation, especially since she only breeds her once a year. She has a place set up in the kitchen for the mama and puppies so they'll be very well socialized. And I guess that at one point, Natalia laid down on the floor on her side and the breeder's 18 month old daughter came up to her while having a temper tantrum, grabbed her snout, and made her look her in the face and Natalia just laid there and let her manhandle her. So we know she has a good temperament :smile:

I'm so freakin' excited! 

My mom and stepdad took lots of pictures while they were there so I'll upload those as soon as they give em to me!


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

rannmiller said:


> My mom went and visited the breeder and her dog (Natalia) today! She said she is absolutely beautiful, super calm and sweet, and huge with puppies! Natalia is the breeder's only dog so we know it's not a puppy mill type of situation, especially since she only breeds her once a year. She has a place set up in the kitchen for the mama and puppies so they'll be very well socialized. And I guess that at one point, Natalia laid down on the floor on her side and the breeder's 18 month old daughter came up to her while having a temper tantrum, grabbed her snout, and made her look her in the face and Natalia just laid there and let her manhandle her. So we know she has a good temperament :smile:
> 
> I'm so freakin' excited!
> 
> My mom and stepdad took lots of pictures while they were there so I'll upload those as soon as they give em to me!


WooHoo!!! I'm excited for you! Sounds like a wonderful dog and a wonderful situation to get a puppy from :biggrin:

I found myself looking a Dane puppies again today...I so want another one...but I think 5 large dogs might be a bit much for my 770 square foot house


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

danemama08 said:


> I found myself looking a Dane puppies again today...I so want another one...but I think 5 large dogs might be a bit much for my 770 square foot house


I did that today.:redface:
And I already have FOUR.
and on a Boxer wait list for next year's litter.
But I can't help it. I really really really want a Dane.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Holy cow! You two are even more crazy than I am! I'm sitting here questioning my sanity for even getting a third dog, a puppy, AND a Doberman all rolled into one in my 1600 sq ft rental! Haha! :biggrin:

Just remember what RFD and Chowder told me, we are still very young and will have plenty of time to get all the dogs we want later on in life, so there's no need to have them all right now :wink:


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Yes, but I WANT them all NOW. lol. Max is actually staying here with my brother. He's 14 Now, and we don't feel like he could handle moving again. He's happy and comfortable, we don't want to disturb that. It's tough, and the selfish part of me wants to take him, but his needs come first. As far as Champ goes, My fiance's dad reallllllllly wants him, and I know I took him on a foster basis, but that was two years ago, i can't imagine not having him now! He wants us to do a one week trial when we move. I'm on the fence about it. I can't imagine only having two. It would be so quiet... Boring.... Wrong. Lol


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Hahah well if you only have two then I could totally see why you would want to get more! That is perfectly understandable. I also understand the wanting them all now thing, for a while there I was thinking we could get a GSD and Doberpup within a couple months of each other cuz they're both so darn cute and are such great breeds. But that wouldn't be fair to either puppy since we both work full time, it's gonna be hard enough raising one pup, let alone two! I almost wish I didn't work at a feline-only vet clinic so I could take my puppy with me to work, then I wouldn't have to worry about hiring someone to come by during the day to let her out for potty breaks. But alas, no one is hiring right now, I just got a raise, and I LOVE my job, so that's not gonna happen.


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

Are you gonna start your puppy dobe on raw when you get her?


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

Well the Boxer next year is pretty much a done deal, and we're feeling good about it no matter what happens with Champ. I don't think we'll have five, though. If we do rehome champ, i will probably talk Jon into a dane, and that would put us back at four. Reasonable, right?


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

CorgiPaws said:


> Well the Boxer next year is pretty much a done deal, and we're feeling good about it no matter what happens with Champ. I don't think we'll have five, though. If we do rehome champ, i will probably talk Jon into a dane, and that would put us back at four. Reasonable, right?


Make a trip to Denver and we will all convince him to want a Dane LOL, but I have to warn you that if you get one Dane, you will guaranteed want another, and another....and another LOL


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

malluver1005 said:


> Are you gonna start your puppy dobe on raw when you get her?


Haha of course I am! That's one of the reasons I'm so very excited for her to come home to me and away from whatever grocery store garbage she's going to be weaned onto at the breeder :smile:


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

rannmiller said:


> Haha of course I am! That's one of the reasons I'm so very excited for her to come home to me and away from whatever grocery store garbage she's going to be weaned onto at the breeder :smile:


When I worked at a daycare/boarding place, we had this male dobe come in. He was just boarding and he couldn't play with other dogs because he was still intact (one of the hotel rules). His ears were cropped. I'm not a fan of cropped ears, but man did he look good!! Niko is his name. He was on raw too. He was so beautiful and healthy looking. Such a playful sweetheart. When he was boarding though, he was on SD kibble. They don't allow raw at the hotel (another rule). I think he is show dog. I've never seen a doberman as gorgeous as him!!! And such a wonderful temperament!!! And he was started on raw at 8 weeks too!!!!


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Well, the puppies were born today, but she only had 4 of them, 3 males and one female :frown:

The guy who has first POL was leaning towards a female but he only wants to sell the dog for twice as much as the woman is selling them for and males are in higher demand most of the time anyway, so I think I'm going to call him tomorrow and ask him very nicely if he will please just let me have my dream dog and not break my heart. I need to get a female since I already have a male dog in the house and Dobes are notorious for male on male aggression *sigh*

They are so beautiful (especially the female), I really want this to work out!

Ignore the ugly kid holding her:


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Absolutely gorgeous!!! I absolutely love the wrinkly faces of newborn pups :biggrin:

And Rann...I laughed out loud about your comment of 



> Ignore the ugly kid holding her


That really made my night a bit better!!! Best of luck with trying to get your dream dog...I am sure everything will work itself out in the end.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I get my puppy after all! My breeder is amazing and talked to the POL guy and told him she'd be willing to just pay him the stud fee so he wouldn't take a puppy. So he admitted he'd probably want to take a male anyway but he'd see what his buyer wants to do and blah blah blah, I GET MY PUPPY! :biggrin:


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

rannmiller said:


> I get my puppy after all! My breeder is amazing and talked to the POL guy and told him she'd be willing to just pay him the stud fee so he wouldn't take a puppy. So he admitted he'd probably want to take a male anyway but he'd see what his buyer wants to do and blah blah blah, I GET MY PUPPY! :biggrin:



Woot!!! Congrats!!! We *EXPECT* pictures....


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

Soooooo...when's the big day?


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

that pup is so cute! :smile:Glad things have worked out for you! So exciting!:smile:


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I'm not sure when I'm going to pick her up. It was going to be on the 19th, but now I'm thinking I may want to get her the week before that. Her mom is completely done with them and it'd be nice to have a whole unemployed week to spend with her getting her settled in haha :biggrin: She's getting so big already!


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

A Valentine's Day present!!!!!!!!!!!! wooooo that is so nice for you! Puppy Goodness!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:biggrin:


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

If I were you, I'd put it off until the 22nd. She will be 8 weeks old then and weeks 7 and 8 with mama are very important to a puppy. Mama teaches the pups things that a human can never teach. It would be even better if all her siblings are around that long too. She learns a lot a bout socializing with other dogs, about dog ediquite, and about what is expected of her as a dog.

Back in my training days, I could often pick out older pups that were taken from Mama at 6 weeks (the normal time for most people). These were the pups that families had behavior problems with. They didn't go through week 7 and 8 with Mama to learn how to be a dog.

I had 2 Goldens that were littermates. One we got when she was 6 weeks old and the other stayed with Mama until he was a year and a half. I could tell a huge different in their behaviors and I always attributed it to the time spend with Mama.

I know you are excited about getting the puppy. I am always impatient about many different things also, so I really understand what you are going through. However in 6 months it won't make any difference that you waited a little while longer and I think you will have a much better, easier to live with, easier to train dog.

I know this is going in one ear and out the other but I wanted to say it anyway. :smile: Good luck and enjoy your puppy. :biggrin:


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Yeah I already promised my mom I'd wait until the 19th to get her since she's getting my puppy's brother as well. I told her I'd spend the weekend with her helping her get set up and get her puppy, Adonis, adjusted to her house. So at least my little Peyton will have her brother to torture for the weekend before I take her home. I hear she is a little spitfire and going to be a handful so I'm mentally preparing myself! 

Do you think I should take my other two dogs with me as well when I got to pick her up? My dogs are both fantastic travel dogs, so it could work well having them to keep her company on the 4 hour drive home. On the other hand, having them around might be a bit overwhelming (even though, like I said, they're fantastic travel dogs). 

I may also just want to look into bringing someone else along for the ride to help keep her still though I'll be jealous of them getting to hold her the whole way.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

I would leave the other dogs at home. You want your first hours with her to be a pleasant as possible. She is going to be pretty scared anyway. She will be away from her Mama for the first time in her life. 

I would take someone else with you and consider letting them drive home while you hold the puppy. :smile:


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## spookychick13 (Jan 26, 2010)

RawFedDogs said:


> I would leave the other dogs at home. You want your first hours with her to be a pleasant as possible. She is going to be pretty scared anyway. She will be away from her Mama for the first time in her life.
> 
> I would take someone else with you and consider letting them drive home while you hold the puppy. :smile:


What he said! This is exactly what we did when we picked up Flip from his foster home. We had the dogs meet when we were looking at Flip to consider adopting him, and again about an hour after we got home. We let Flip wander around our back yard for a while before we brought Jack out.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

When we brought our puppies home, this is what we did. In the few days before we got them, we had the new puppies stuffed toy in our bed with us, and we each wore an old t-shirt to bed. Then when we picked up the puppy, we put the stuffed toy and the t-shirts in the puppies little crate and put it right behind out two front seats (We have an suv so the back seats fold down right up against the front seats). The puppy road home in his crate filled with our t-shirts that we had been sleeping in and his new stuffed toy that we had been sleeping with so the whole thing smelled like his new family. With two of our chows it was a 5 hour drive home so it was a long trip. The Lhasa it was an hour trip. 

This way the pup was safe in his crate in case of an accident (we didn't want puppy to go flying thru the windshield) plus he could sleep nestled in our t-shirts and with his toy. He also could see us and we could talk to him the whole time. Our breeder insisted on the pups being in a crate for safety and we also made potty stops along the way and water breaks so we could hold them and play with them. 

Once we got home the puppies continued to sleep with our t-shirts and the stuffed toy and we didn't have any trouble with crying at night. 

We never took our big dogs with us. It was all puppy quality time. Good luck to you. This is just the way we did it. Can't wait for pictures!


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Thanks so much guys, you're all so helpful! This is all so new to me, the last time I had a puppy was when i got Penny when I was 14 years old, and the people just dropped her off at my house. At least she will have her brother with her during the first few days away from her mama so he should help her feel a little more comfortable.


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## Jem (Dec 17, 2009)

I AM SO JEALOUS!!! Dobies have been one of my favorite breeds for FOREVER!! (I even remember playing dogs-haha-with my sisters when we were little and I was ALWAYS a doberman pinscher, while they were poodles or something like that :biggrin

I have been thinking lately about what my next dog will be...although I love Ridgebacks, I feel like I want to experience other breeds and not just stick with one breed my whole life (there are many GREAT breeds out there). I am really leaning towards a dobie...black and tan like you. Although I am no where near getting another dog anytime soon! my other choice would be a great dane...? but probably a dobie... just LOVE them!


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## Jem (Dec 17, 2009)

oh and are you going to leave the ears natural?


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Yeah dobes have been my favorite breed for forever too, I was the same way playing dogs when I was a kid as well. I think I'm gonna leave her ears natural, cropping just sounds like a really expensive and painful pain in the butt and not really necessary. I do want to train her for protection work, but plenty of natural eared dobes do protection work so she should be fine.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

rannmiller said:


> . I do want to train her for protection work, but plenty of natural eared dobes do protection work so she should be fine.


It's not the shape of the dogs ears, its the peoples perception of the dog and the dogs training that makes for the kind of work they can do. The silliest thing I've seen is a grown, 250 pound air conditioner man turn and run fleeing up my stairs because my chow puppy came around the corner of the kitchen! The pup was 5 months old! I had to take it out of the room before the man would come back down the stairs. It's not the only time I've had grown men hide from my dogs and I'm sure it's the same with dobes. 

Your pup will be great at whatever you want to teach it because it will have you as it's teacher. :smile:


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> She is going to be pretty scared anyway. She will be away from her Mama for the first time in her life.


Aspen would howl a lot for the first few nights at 8 weeks old. He was away from mama and his littermates for the first time. Rann, you should probably expect this...




RawFedDogs said:


> I would take someone else with you and consider letting them drive home while you hold the puppy. :smile:


This is exactly what I did when I got Aspen. I held him for the 2 hour drive and he fell asleep in my lap!


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## Jem (Dec 17, 2009)

yeah I vote natural ears too


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

chowder said:


> Your pup will be great at whatever you want to teach it because it will have you as it's teacher. :smile:


Awww thank you! I will sure try my best :smile:



malluver1005 said:


> Aspen would howl a lot for the first few nights at 8 weeks old. He was away from mama and his littermates for the first time. Rann, you should probably expect this...


Yeah my mom's husky mix screamed the first night we had her. I'm expecting whining and howling for sure. I expect very little sleep the first week.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

Yeah my mom's husky mix screamed the first night we had her. I'm expecting whining and howling for sure. I expect very little sleep the first week.[/QUOTE]

We never really had any of our puppies cry. We put them in their crates with their stuffed toys and t-shirts that smelled like us and we always ran a little air cleaner or fan in the room with them to make a whirring, white noise sound for them. Between those things, they got so used to being tucked in bed at night that after the first night they went right to sleep without a problem. It helped that the dogs don't sleep in the room with us. They all grew up sleeping in the kitchen where eventually they graduated to the cage left open and just baby gates blocking them in the room to keep the big dogs away from them and keep them out of trouble. 

Rocky was an early morning riser and cried at 5 am to go out the first few mornings but we soon got him onto our schedule by keeping him up later and taking him for his last walk a little later. And he absolutely LOVES his crate now. He will go and put himself to bed in it every night at 10 pm and at naptime. We just leave the doors open all the time for him so he can snooze in it whenever he wants too. He still keeps his favorite stuffed bunny in there, too!


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

I suggest letting him sleep in a crate beside your bed for the first couple of weeks at least. This will minimize the trauma of leaving Mama and siblings. He will be able to smell you and hear you breathe and know he is not alone. In the wild puppies are not left alone every for the first several months.

I would suggest you reconsider training for protection. A lot of amateur trainers have created more than they can handle while trying to train their dog in protection. Also if he is trained for protection and he bites someone or gets in a fight with another dog, he will most likely have to be put to sleep. He will naturally protect his family without training. Don't add to this natural instinct. Leave the protection training to professional dogs. Those dogs aren't pets. It doesn't mean a dog trained in protection can't be a pet but you are assuming a great liability when you have such a dog in your house. MOST protection dogs live in a kennel.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Oh I definitely planned on having her crate by (or maybe on though that may be hard with the enormous crate I got for her) my bed when she sleeps so she doesn't feel abandoned. I'm also taking Chowder's suggestion about finding a shirt I don't care about to wear to bed every night this week so I can put it in there for her to feel more secure. 

I'm still not 100% on the protection thing but I know CorgiPaws has a professionally trained protection dog and he lives in their house as a member of the family, outside of a kennel, just fine. I'm also on a Doberman forum and many of the members on there have trained protection dogs who are also wonderful family pets. I know about the liability and risks involved in protection training and I will not go through with it if I feel uncomfortable at any time and/or cannot find an adequate professional trainer. However, I will also not just assume that my dog's natural protective instincts will kick in if I'm in danger or being threatened because that's already failed me once and I'd rather not risk it again. A concealed weapons permit and gun safety lessons may be in my future, though that's not necessarily the safest thing either, I know. Just sayin'


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

rannmiller said:


> Oh I definitely planned on having her crate by (or maybe on though that may be hard with the enormous crate I got for her) my bed when she sleeps so she doesn't feel abandoned. I'm also taking Chowder's suggestion about finding a shirt I don't care about to wear to bed every night this week so I can put it in there for her to feel more secure.
> 
> I'm still not 100% on the protection thing but I know CorgiPaws has a professionally trained protection dog and he lives in their house as a member of the family, outside of a kennel, just fine. I'm also on a Doberman forum and many of the members on there have trained protection dogs who are also wonderful family pets. I know about the liability and risks involved in protection training and I will not go through with it if I feel uncomfortable at any time and/or cannot find an adequate professional trainer. However, I will also not just assume that my dog's natural protective instincts will kick in if I'm in danger or being threatened because that's already failed me once and I'd rather not risk it again. A concealed weapons permit and gun safety lessons may be in my future, though that's not necessarily the safest thing either, I know. Just sayin'


yea defiantly let the pup sleep in the crate next to the bed for a while. I made the mistake of letting Lucky sleep in my bed with me as a pup. she was fine for the first couple of weeks until she was big enough to jump off and onto the bed. let's just say i'd often wake up at about 5:00 AM to the smell of some nice fresh... well, you know:biggrin:


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I'm so excited! I picked out my "puppy" shirt last night and have been wearing it as much as possible so it's good and stinky for her :biggrin: I've even started making myself wake up earlier so I get used to more puppy-friendly hours of operation and taking my dogs on a run every single day. No room for being lazy with a Doberman puppy! I did all weekend and today getting up at 7:30 am (pretty big improvement for me lately). Tomorrow I'll aim for 7 and decrease it by a half hour every morning after that until I get her! Might set up my kennel early too so I can get used to having no space in my room anymore!

And tomorrow, I'm going to work on puppy-proofing my yard.


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

^^^I remember when I did puppy proofing. It was soooo exciting!! I just had to have everything perfect for his arrival!!


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

malluver1005 said:


> ^^^I remember when I did puppy proofing. It was soooo exciting!! I just had to have everything perfect for his arrival!!


same with me:biggrin: i remember picking every last little speck off of the floor, which is rare:biggrin:


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

My mom and I picked up our puppies last night. They are amazing. At first they had a little trouble with going potty in the house (as was to be expected) but that was mostly our faults since we weren't doing a good job of making sure we took them out every 30 minutes. As soon as we started doing that, they were both really good about it. 

Peyton cried a little when she realized the crate wasn't going to open back up last night, but I asked her to be quiet and as soon as she heard my voice she stopped whining so I praised her calmly and she settled down, snuggled up to her brother, and fell asleep. She cried in the middle of the night when she needed to go out, went potty right away when we got outside, and slept the rest of the night until I woke up at 6:45 and took them both out again. Hopefully she keeps this great behavior up when I bring her home and away from her brother though I know her first night away from him will definitely be tough :frown:

They are so cute and follow us everywhere. They're already doing really well with leash walking and Peyton figured out how to work the stairs very quickly! 

They each ate a small chicken wing nubbin last night so I gave Adonis (Peyton's brother) most of a wing and Peyton got a drumstick. They are both munching away happily. Looks like these puppies are natural carnivores from the start! :biggrin:


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

How exciting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sounds like you got a really good puppy, hope you have a safe trip home, and good luck with Peyton all by herself...


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Woohoo!!! Sounds to me like you will take to being a fabulous puppy mom and are a natural at it so far! :biggrin:

This makes me want another Dane puppy LOL


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## t0nnn (Apr 1, 2009)

pictures!!


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

Awwww the two of them just sound adorable! How fun for you! And for your Mom! Congratulations! :biggrin::smile:


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## Ania's Mommy (Feb 8, 2009)

Awww! I remember puppyhood! I wanna see pictures!

Richelle


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## sawyer (Feb 18, 2010)

I love this thread.

I'm looking right now for a second English springer spaniel puppy. I found what appears to be a GREAT breeder in Kansas City... but her dogs are $900/each. Not quite sure I can afford that. But I've been ready to bring Avon home since the day we added Lucie to the family (I already named him... even though the breeder is still only in the planning stages of a litter that won't be available for 4-5 months).


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