# Dry food



## jicolleen (Dec 13, 2010)

Hi all, I am new and will probably ask a question that's already been thoroughly covered.  I have a 2-year old chocolate lab and have fed her Royal Canin since bringing her home 2 years ago. I've heard negative things lately about this brand. Our Mocha has always thrived, has a beautiful coat and doesn't have allergies to my knowledge. Any input?

Thanks! Jill


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## Gia (May 29, 2009)

If it isn't broken, don't fix it!
There is nothing wrong with feeding Royal Canin, especially if your dog is thriving on it. :smile:


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

It has low quality ingredients, so where there might not be any issues now that doesn't mean there won't be long term internal issues from it later. I would definitely change to something of better quality. Wellness, Taste of the Wild, Orijen, Solid Gold, etc. Basically feeding what you're feeding daily is kind of like you eating McDonald's on a daily basis. You may be fine for awhile but long term it isn't the best of food choices.


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## ann g (May 6, 2010)

I would definately switch off the RC. My gsd was on that for about 6 months and was doing absolutely wonderful on it. When I finally got the internet (I know, were slow with the technology) I began researching dog foods and was shocked to learn about the ingredients in Royal Canin. For what it costs there are so many better foods out there with far more superior ingredients. BoxerMommie mentioned some great choices.


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## Gia (May 29, 2009)

I have a friend that has somewhere around 30 German Shepherds, not including the occasional litter. She travels to Europe frequently, shows her dogs and is very active in the Schutzhund world. She buys a pallet of Royal Canin German Shepherd 24 once a month and supplements with some meat, as well. Her dogs are healthy, gorgeous and are very successful in the ring.

If the food was complete junk there is no way she would be feeding to her extremely expensive dogs with years of training put into them.


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## Guest (Dec 14, 2010)

Gia said:


> .... If the food was complete junk there is no way she would be feeding to her extremely expensive dogs with years of training put into them.


Did this person do any research on canine nutrition?

I've always wondered why breeders of $2,000 pups (where the breeding stock has all health clearances) feed crappy foods such as Blue Seal and Purina. I don't know anything about Royal Canin so I can't comment on that. but I'd be curious to know whether this friend of yours did any research.


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

Gia said:


> I have a friend that has somewhere around 30 German Shepherds, not including the occasional litter. She travels to Europe frequently, shows her dogs and is very active in the Schutzhund world. She buys a pallet of Royal Canin German Shepherd 24 once a month and supplements with *some meat*, as well. Her dogs are healthy, gorgeous and are very successful in the ring.
> 
> If the food was complete junk there is no way she would be feeding to her extremely expensive dogs with years of training put into them.


I heard it all before. There was a Crufts winner that was on IAMS but it doesn't make it a good food. Royal Canin 24 isn't terrible nor is it spectacular. Genetics has alot to do with a dog's health and conditioning not to mention the meat she's supplementing with certainly helps.

I used to be perplexed at how a friend of a friend had a pointer that looked and performed fabulous but was fed Pedigree. Later to discover that he gives the dog all the scrap and leftover meat.


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

Gia said:


> I have a friend that has somewhere around 30 German Shepherds, not including the occasional litter. She travels to Europe frequently, shows her dogs and is very active in the Schutzhund world. She buys a pallet of Royal Canin German Shepherd 24 once a month and supplements with some meat, as well. Her dogs are healthy, gorgeous and are very successful in the ring.
> 
> If the food was complete junk there is no way she would be feeding to her extremely expensive dogs with years of training put into them.


Well if she doesn't know anything about dog food she would (and does). Most pet owners do not know much about food, hence the reason Dog Chow, Eukanuba, Iams, Science Diet and so many others are so successful. Even the breeder I got my Boxer from, shows her dogs loves them dearly has wonderful lines feeds Purina which is crap, but she knows nothing of dog food so she feeds it. 

It's all about knowledge.


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## Gia (May 29, 2009)

I get your points....however, I KNOW she has researched nutrition, because she and I have had conversations about RAW and supplements. She used to feed raw and had a gulper, from what I understand, and he was blocked according to the vet X-rays. That scared her it seems and she stopped feeding whole chicken parts with the bones. She then had a pup that got Salmonella from raw turkey, so she started lightly cooking the meat before feeding it. She also uses Salmon oil. 

Yes, there are better foods than Royal Canin, but there are plenty of dogs that are thriving on it, so that was my point.


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

I do understand your point, however there's plenty of dogs that thrive on Dog Chow and Iams and Eukanuba too but there's no way I'd consider them good foods or encourage someone to stick with them either. 

I would still recommend switching from Royal Canin, it's poor quality and for the price tag attached to it you can get a MUCH higher quality food for the same price (or less).


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

Gia said:


> I get your points....however, I KNOW she has researched nutrition, because she and I have had conversations about RAW and supplements. She used to feed raw and had a gulper, from what I understand, and he was blocked according to the vet X-rays. That scared her it seems and she stopped feeding whole chicken parts with the bones. She then had a pup that got Salmonella from raw turkey, so she started lightly cooking the meat before feeding it. She also uses Salmon oil.
> 
> Yes, there are better foods than Royal Canin, but there are plenty of dogs that are thriving on it, so that was my point.


I'm not doubting your words by any means so please don't be offended if I seem to be arguing your point.

If your friend did research on canine nutritional needs, why in the world would she choose Royal Canin 24? Unless her research was conducted on Royal Canin's website, I don't see how she would conclude that Royal Canin is a quality product.

24 does not contain a single whole meat, wheat gluten, powdered cellullose, dried beet pulp, among other very inexpensive ingredients. It's extremely expensive for what's in it so it makes a poor value.

From personal experience working at a pet nutrition store, I have never once had a customer that praised Royal Canin with their dog thriving on it. I have however been told how much better their dogs were doing after switching from RC to a better quality kibble.


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## PUNKem733 (Jun 12, 2009)

How does a dog get salmonella? Aren't they made to handle that with their stomach acids being so powerful?


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

PUNKem733 said:


> How does a dog get salmonella? Aren't they made to handle that with their stomach acids being so powerful?


Yes, they are designed to handle that. What happens is that a dog with tummy problems is automatically assigned salmonella because its easy for the vet to say so. They can run tests and find salmonella bacteria in the dog's GI tract and automatically assume that salmonella is the cause of whatever problem exists.


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## Gia (May 29, 2009)

SamWu1 said:


> I'm not doubting your words by any means so please don't be offended if I seem to be arguing your point.
> 
> If your friend did research on canine nutritional needs, why in the world would she choose Royal Canin 24? Unless her research was conducted on Royal Canin's website, I don't see how she would conclude that Royal Canin is a quality product.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your lead into this your last post...and no, I'm not offended by your views. I know what the ingredient list read like, believe me, but you and I have different experiences with the people that use RC. I have seen and had worked with dozens of dogs that have been on RC and are healthy. I have been a professional pet groomer for 20 years straight and have a huge clientele. I also work with my local police departments K-9 program and my German Shepherd is working dog, not a couch potato or one that flies around a show ring looking pretty at the trot! :wink:

I have seen dogs in all different stages of health problems and dogs that eat all kinds of diets. The dogs in the WORST condition are those that are fed an UNBALANCED raw diet. It's true! The dogs that eat Purina One, look and feel better than the dogs that belong to my clients who are so proud to be feeding their dogs a "natural" diet and I can't seem to get them to see how awful their dogs condition is. 

Anyway, my friend is kind of eccentric, I mean, she has 30 dogs! But, RC is big in Germany and that could be why she feeds it. I don't think she has done nearly the research that I have regarding nutrition. But, switching that many dogs could be a daunting task!

Disclaimer: I do not feed my dog RC, she eats a balanced raw diet and Annamaet Grain Free.


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## Gia (May 29, 2009)

RawFedDogs said:


> Yes, they are designed to handle that. What happens is that a dog with tummy problems is automatically assigned salmonella because its easy for the vet to say so. They can run tests and find salmonella bacteria in the dog's GI tract and automatically assume that salmonella is the cause of whatever problem exists.



Yes, it is possible that the puppy had coccidia or giardia. But, she runs to the vet faster than anyone I've ever known and that is what they said was wrong with the puppy and they suggested she cook the turkey before feeding it.


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## Caty M (Aug 13, 2010)

What would be considered an 'unbalanced' raw diet? I feed only meat, bone and organ and my dog looks great. I took him to the vet and they said he was in great shape but when I said I feed raw they gave me a huge list of dangers and then told me to go to science diet puppy or RC collie.

I think one of the biggest problems with RC (the ingredients kind of suck in my opinion, but there are many worse brands) is the breed specific formulas. Why on earth would a collie need a different type of food than a german shepherd when both breeds were developed less than 300 years ago? It's a gimmick designed so owners feel they are feeding their dog a 'special food' just for their dog and then RC can jack up the prices even though it's near the exact same ingredients as their regular adult dog food.


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

Gia said:


> Thanks for your lead into this your last post...and no, I'm not offended by your views. I know what the ingredient list read like, believe me, but you and I have different experiences with the people that use RC. I have seen and had worked with dozens of dogs that have been on RC and are healthy. I have been a professional pet groomer for 20 years straight and have a huge clientele. I also work with my local police departments K-9 program and my German Shepherd is working dog, not a couch potato or one that flies around a show ring looking pretty at the trot! :wink:
> 
> I have seen dogs in all different stages of health problems and dogs that eat all kinds of diets. The dogs in the WORST condition are those that are fed an UNBALANCED raw diet. It's true! The dogs that eat Purina One, look and feel better than the dogs that belong to my clients who are so proud to be feeding their dogs a "natural" diet and I can't seem to get them to see how awful their dogs condition is.
> 
> ...


I most certainly agree that an unbalanced raw diet can be detrimental to a dog's health. With 30 dogs, it would be daunting to switch for her. To the original OP, switching dog foods is your decision and we're here simply to give you the best advice for you and your dog.

Here's a website that rates dog foods, Dogfoodanalysis.com and hopefully it will help with your decision.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

If you feed a dog a diet of mostly raw meat, some bone, and some organs from a variety of animals, its pretty much impossible to UNBALANCE a raw diet.


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

RawFedDogs said:


> If you feed a dog a diet of mostly raw meat, some bone, and some organs from a variety of animals, its pretty much impossible to UNBALANCE a raw diet.


This is simply an assumption but people that are not educated with raw feeding may feed their dogs like they would feed themselves, lean, boneless cuts of meat with no bone so you end up with a lethargic, dull coated animal with nutritional defiencies.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

SamWu1 said:


> This is simply an assumption but people that are not educated with raw feeding may feed their dogs like they would feed themselves, lean, boneless cuts of meat with no bone so you end up with a lethargic, dull coated animal with nutritional defiencies.


As long as the 1st part of my sentence is true, the 2nd part will be true also.


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## sassymaxmom (Dec 7, 2008)

Or they feed only bony chicken, no organs, no red meat.

If your friend is adding meat to the kibble that is the key to the good health of the dogs. I was going through some links on a website and read a page by a vet who was interested to be seeing healthy dogs who were fed KnB according to the owners. Turned out those healthy dogs were being fed KnB plus scraps of fresh meat. Dogs fed just the KnB did not appear as healthy.


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## SpooOwner (Oct 1, 2010)

Jill, was your question answered?

Most people on this forum will recommend that you upgrade to a higher quality kibble. Although your lab has done well so far, it's a bit like a teenager who only eats McDonalds - she may look cute now, but it's going to catch up with her one day. There's a lot of room for improvement, and you can jump up to the top of the heap with Orijen or Acana, or you can go mid-grade (and mid-price) like Wellness.

And the longer you stay on this forum, the more likely it is that you'll move to raw. It may sound crazy now, but most of us found benefits far and above even the best kibble.


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## cast71 (Sep 16, 2010)

bishopthesheltie said:


> What would be considered an 'unbalanced' raw diet? I feed only meat, bone and organ and my dog looks great.


You are already feeding a *naturally *balanced diet. If you fed chicken quarters only, that would be unbalanced:biggrin:


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## cast71 (Sep 16, 2010)

sassymaxmom said:


> Or they feed only bony chicken, no organs, no red meat.
> 
> If your friend is adding meat to the kibble that is the key to the good health of the dogs. I was going through some links on a website and read a page by a vet who was interested to be seeing healthy dogs who were fed KnB according to the owners. Turned out those healthy dogs were being fed KnB plus scraps of fresh meat. Dogs fed just the KnB did not appear as healthy.


She might as well save money by replacing RC with diamond natural and keep supplementing with meat. Actually I think diamond natural is a tiny step up:smile:


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## Gia (May 29, 2009)

Perhaps my posts were misunderstood? I mentioned that I have had many different clients that have fed RC , not just my one friend with the large kennel of German Shepherds, and the dogs have lived and aged well.

I have some clients that feed Diamond Naturals and their dogs look very good, too, so you may be onto something there!


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