# Agh! Fleas!



## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

I need to know what you all do for flea control? I found 4 fleas on Logan's head yesterday in a matter of seconds, so I'm pretty sure he's got tons more, and scratching a lot lately. I've tried DE - I'm pretty sure if you keep it up long enough it can work, but at this stage I need something a bit more immediate. Also not to happy about all the dust in my house and the way it makes his coat feel very coarse. I've tried feeding garlic, and brewers yeast on coat - no immediate results. I was thinking (and don't judge me.  ) to just use Frontline or Advantage once or twice to just break the cycle of the fleas' life and then start applying natural ways to prevent them from coming back. I also read books from 2 vet's that said fleas usually go for dogs with weaker immune system and that healthy (natural fed) dog's usually don't have flea problems - well my dog is raw fed and he has fleas, so this is complete nonsense...
Please tell me what you do for flea management that does not involve your house being covered in DE dust and dog looking like a ghost all the time - and I really don't want to be putting poison on him for the next 12 years of his life.:help:


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## FBarnes (Feb 17, 2013)

I use Capstar if I find fleas on them - it's supposed to be really safe but it only kills adults and lasts about a day or two and is pricey to boot. But since I have two dogs that react to the chemicals in even the old Advantage, I do that now and then, and then daily I spritz them with a mixture of lavender/peppermint essential oils. 

also, I put DE in the yard - not the house. I mix it with water to get rid of the dust problem. Last summer it did really well, we had few fleas in the yard.


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## creek817 (Feb 18, 2012)

I know how you feel - I have been dealing with fleas for awhile because I'm resisting using "traditional" cures, but my dog only ever has 2 or 3 at a time, so it doesn't worry me so much. I am the LAST person to recommend any chemicals (well, one of the last ;-) ), but to be totally honest, that sounds like your best bet. I personally wouldn't do a topical, I would do a pill (there's one here called Comfortis that works really well and isn't super awful). Just do a bit of research and figure out what you feel comfortable using, then you can do the upkeep with natural methods, like you said - Cedarcide is a natural spray that is supposed to be fantastic for fleas, but I have no personal experience with it.


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## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

FBarnes said:


> I use Capstar if I find fleas on them - it's supposed to be really safe but it only kills adults and lasts about a day or two and is pricey to boot. But since I have two dogs that react to the chemicals in even the old Advantage, I do that now and then, and then daily I spritz them with a mixture of lavender/peppermint essential oils.
> 
> also, I put DE in the yard - not the house. I mix it with water to get rid of the dust problem. Last summer it did really well, we had few fleas in the yard.


Were do you spray? All over their bodies or just certain spots where you saw the flea? Every day? So don't they smell like peppermint the whole time? And does it not make their coats oily?


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## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

creek817 said:


> I know how you feel - I have been dealing with fleas for awhile because I'm resisting using "traditional" cures, but my dog only ever has 2 or 3 at a time, so it doesn't worry me so much. I am the LAST person to recommend any chemicals (well, one of the last ;-) ), but to be totally honest, that sounds like your best bet. I personally wouldn't do a topical, I would do a pill (there's one here called Comfortis that works really well and isn't super awful). Just do a bit of research and figure out what you feel comfortable using, then you can do the upkeep with natural methods, like you said - Cedarcide is a natural spray that is supposed to be fantastic for fleas, but I have no personal experience with it.


Ok say for instance I decide to use the peppermint oil mix and the cedarcide, can I use both at the same time? And do I spray every day for how long? Rest of the dog's life or just till flea problem is under control? Is cedarcide the same thing as cedar oil I pressume?


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Garlic takes about a month to build up in the system. Raw fed dogs do generally have fewer fleas than others, but not none comepletely. We have had one or two fleas ourselves, nothing too bad at all but if a dog has a flea allergy one is all it takes. My girl Copper has been having some real itchy issues lately because of it, and I'm considering MAYBE using a spot on from Only Natural pet supplies for her. It has natural ingredients and as far as the reviews, I am reading no fleas but that it does leave a greasy spot at the application site. So, it's just a thought. I am wanting to avoid chemicals at all cost, so I know where you are coming from.


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## FBarnes (Feb 17, 2013)

I squirt it mostly on their legs, back, and stomach. I try not to get right up in their face because they are more sensitive to smell than we are. And I don't drench them with it, just spritz. And yes I do it daily - when I don't is when I have to use the Capstar. Which is why I have to use the Capstar fairly often because I keep forgetting!

I also used cedarcide in the yard last summer - personally I would go with Neem, it seemed to work better. But my yard smelled nice and cedary. I'm not sure I would use that on my dogs though. It seems awfully strong.


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## shellbell (Sep 24, 2011)

I’ve heard that you can bathe in Dawn dish soap to kill fleas on the dog. I think that with bathing, they actually tend to drown pretty easily. But you will have to do something to treat your house if they are bad….


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## BearMurphy (Feb 29, 2012)

are you using a flea comb and dipping it in soapy water everyday? I would do that if my dog had some fleas. That will also help you see how bad of a problem you have since you won't be able to see all the fleas he has


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## Kassandra (Jun 6, 2012)

shellbell said:


> I’ve heard that you can bathe in Dawn dish soap to kill fleas on the dog. I think that with bathing, they actually tend to drown pretty easily. But you will have to do something to treat your house if they are bad….


This does work, and doesn't seem to hurt the dog at all. My grandfathers dog had a bad flea infestation last year and so I learned that that is what he does when his dogs get fleas. Does it once, then again 2 days later. You gotta make sure you get right down to the skin though, it can be hard with a dog with a thick coat and an undercoat.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

I've been using Cowboy Magic Rosewater shampoo on our crew, and it kills fleas even though it's a gentle conditioning shampoo not intended as a flea shampoo. I also think fleas drown really easy as well.


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## FBarnes (Feb 17, 2013)

I do use that castille soap with essential oils - someone somewhere told me that to kill a flea with soap you have to let it sit for 10 minutes. And you soap their neck first so the fleas can't jump up all over their head. Whether that's true or not I have no idea, but I can't imagine letting my dogs sit for 10 minutes all wet and soapy. I tried it and it's alot longer than it sounds, they start to get all dried up and impatient.


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

I've never waited ten minutes for any shampoo. If its going to kill fleas, it does it immediately. 

And yes, starting at the head is a good idea because that way fleas do run the other way. Any already on the head will be dead.


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## sozzle (May 18, 2011)

What about the Shoo Tag, has anyone tried this? apparently it uses a frequency barrier to keep fleas and ticks away. Don't know how successful it would be but looks interesting. Maybe have a look at a more objective site to get reviews.


shoo!Tag Dog Flea Repellent at PETCO


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## flashyfawn (Mar 8, 2012)

I do some dog grooming and Dawn dish soap will kill the fleas. What I do is dilute the Dawn a little in a bottle and then put it on the dog. Don't wet the dog first, and use only enough water to get the soap to lather up a bit so you can get it all over the dog. I start with the head, then the butt, then everything else. You have to be sure to get everywhere on the dog--ears, around the eyes, between the toes--every inch. I've never let it sit more than like 5 minutes, and that long only on really infested dogs. My dogs have had fleas a couple of times and I never did more than bathe them and wash their bedding. 

The way it was explained to me, fleas can make sort of a greasy barrier that protects them from water and the Dawn (and probably most shampoos, really) can break through that barrier and kill the flea. But if you get the dog thoroughly wet before applying shampoo, the flea may be able to survive. The soap needs to hit them before the plain water. I have not researched that and have no idea if it's true. All I can say is that I've bathed dogs who were truly infested and the Dawn alone killed all the fleas. We actually use Dawn as the first shampoo on every single dog and have never had it cause a skin reaction and it will get even the dirtiest dog very clean. We do follow it with a regular dog shampoo and maybe conditioner depending on the coat, and I'd guess it could be drying to the skin if used really frequently.


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## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

BearMurphy said:


> are you using a flea comb and dipping it in soapy water everyday? I would do that if my dog had some fleas. That will also help you see how bad of a problem you have since you won't be able to see all the fleas he has


I've not used the flea comb yet..need to get one still (first time fighting fleas). The trouble would be to get Logan to hold still while I comb - he gets annoyed with me so quickly and then starts biting my hand. It's a challenge to even just give him a quick brush.

Anyway I went ahead and put Frontline on him to break the flea cycle, man I hate that stuff! The moment I put it on he started scratching at his neck area, so I think it must have burnt his skin a bit? Last time I used it his skin became dry and flaky at the spot were I applied it, so really don't want to use this long term. I will research all your suggestions and start applying it as a preventative. If I give garlic and brewers yeast on a daily basis, say for the rest of his life as preventative, is there a chance it can have negative side effects? Like is it possible to give too much garlic and brewers yeast? Will it not build up in his system and cause problems over time or something?
And re the oils/spray's; can I use more than one oil at the same time, say for instance peppermint and neem? Or should I pick one, try it and move on to the next if it doesn't work?

To sum things up:

Peppermint/lavender/citronella - fleas don't like smell and will stay away
Cedar/neem/ dawn dish soap - will actually kill the fleas
Borax/DE - put in yard
Garlic/brewers yeast - feed daily
Oh and vacuum, wash dog bedding, and flea comb often.


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## BearMurphy (Feb 29, 2012)

I think garlic may reduce your dogs ability to clot blood so it is important to know that if he has surgery. i don't know if it's based on the amount you feed


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

If garlic is given in huge amounts, like say 30 or more cloves at a time would be toxic and cause some anemia issues, but that is such a huge amount I just don't think anyone would ever give. You can give garlic powder in meatballs. The one I gave said on the package that1/4 of a tsp equals one clove. Mine all got three tsps a piece. I may have actually not given enough, but I sort of used the Bug Off garlic dosage for my dogs.


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## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

naturalfeddogs said:


> If garlic is given in huge amounts, like say 30 or more cloves at a time would be toxic and cause some anemia issues, but that is such a huge amount I just don't think anyone would ever give. You can give garlic powder in meatballs. The one I gave said on the package that1/4 of a tsp equals one clove. Mine all got three tsps a piece. I may have actually not given enough, but I sort of used the Bug Off garlic dosage for my dogs.


Wow that's a lot- I only give 1 clove/day. So this is then obviously not enough?


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## shellbell (Sep 24, 2011)

woganvonderweidenstrasse said:


> Wow that's a lot- I only give 1 clove/day. So this is then obviously not enough?


Here is a link with a garlic dosage chart:

Garlic for Dogs | Is Garlic Safe for Dogs?


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## monster'sdad (Jul 29, 2012)

I think everyone would like to find a natural form of flea and tick control. Unfortunately, none of them work. Studies and tests have been done on all of them and the studies and test show absolutely no effectiveness.

Some are actually more toxic than the popular topical treatments.

If garlic, B Vitamins, sonic tags and yeast worked, we all would be using them.

I know some people have stories of miracle results, but unless it can be measured it does not exist.

*"The references listed below describe important methods for eliminating or at least reducing the development of flea larvae, including the critical role of vacuuming. You should be aware that various advertised "alternative" control methods and products are of little or no value. For example, controlled scientific studies have shown that ultrasonic devices have no effect on fleas and that products such as brewer's yeast, B-complex vitamins, and garlic are not effective flea repellents."*

Purdue University


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

We have some nasty flea seasons also. I have used cedarcide (herbal mix) on the dogs as a shampoo and spray and I will also buy the yard spray as it is safe around my garden and chickens. It is a pretty nice product. We used nematodes when we lived in California and they did a great job. One application and no fleas for almost three years.


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## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

monster'sdad said:


> I think everyone would like to find a natural form of flea and tick control. Unfortunately, none of them work. Studies and tests have been done on all of them and the studies and test show absolutely no effectiveness.
> 
> Some are actually more toxic than the popular topical treatments.
> 
> ...


I think the natural alternatives work well as a preventative, but if the dog already has flea's it's better to just get rid of them as soon as possible and then take preventative steps to see if you can at least minimize the use of chemicals on your dog. I've decided to use capstar, once a week for 2 months to make sure I've killed all fleas and whatever eggs may come out during the cycle. Then I'm going to try a Khakibos spray on his coat, once a week to see if this will prevent any future fleas from coming back. Khakibos is a plant and I think native to South Africa (but not 100% sure about this). The local boere has used it for many years as a flea repellent, so I'll give it a try and see. If it does not work I'll just use Capstar again to kill the fleas and then proceed with trying the next natural product, and so on until I find something that works without having to use to much poison on my boy.


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## woganvonderweidenstrasse (Nov 22, 2012)

Liz said:


> We have some nasty flea seasons also. I have used cedarcide (herbal mix) on the dogs as a shampoo and spray and I will also buy the yard spray as it is safe around my garden and chickens. It is a pretty nice product. We used nematodes when we lived in California and they did a great job. One application and no fleas for almost three years.


Thanks Liz
I've read about the nematodes, small things that actually eat the fleas?...or something like that. As I said to monster, I think it's gonna take some trial and error before we find something natural that works for us - but we have to keep looking, I'm not comfortable feeding my dog poison for the rest of his life.


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

Neither are we. The nematodes might do well for you in your climate. I don't think they will do so well for me as we have such varying temperatures and wet weather. So I will use the cedarcide this year.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

We found a few fleas on Louis last summer. Luckily we were able to pick them out and kill them. After cleaning and vacuuming everything, our house seemed okay even though we found the occasional flea on him after walks. It was a warm winter so we had a lot more pest problems. I tried 2 things: lavendar spritz made by Earthbath and my own mixture (12-15 drops of lavendar essential oil in a small 8 oz spray bottle). I usually gave a spray or two under the chest and one at the base of his tail and it seemed to keep the fleas away for the rest of the summer.


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