# Day wrecker...Yahoo article



## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

You guys ever read something that wrecks your day? I'm not going to put the link up because I'm just not certain some would want to see it... Yahoo had an article this morning on what is going on in Thailand and some Asian countries with the Dog meat trade. On one hand, I wish I never would have seen it but by the same tolken, I feel like thats a cowardly approach. It was a brutal article to see/read(they included pictures). There is a group trying to infuse some of our social thinking(mainly that Dogs are of a higher social status in progressive countries) in those countries...I'm going to try and donate to them.

It almost makes me believe I have no right to even enjoy my day with what these Dogs are going thru. I then think of how hypocritical we must sound preaching to them about the rights of Dogs...w/ how we treat animals in OUR own meat trade. 

A difficult subject to say the least. But one that definitely wrecked my day. This world sucks sometimes.


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

The Soi Dog Foundation is on my facebook page and I hear ya, it's pretty pathetic what goes on in Thailand.


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## minnieme (Jul 6, 2011)

Someone posted a website recently where you could look up all these animal abusers in the US. I cried and cried at some of them....just monstrous, awful things... and it made me so glad to have Minnie (she's a rescue from a bad situation too). It was that night I decided she could be allowed on our bed. :wink: Knowing that I can treat at least one dog like a total princess sort of quells that sadness, but you're right -- people really suck sometimes.


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## minnieme (Jul 6, 2011)

whiteleo said:


> The Soi Dog Foundation is on my facebook page and I hear ya, it's pretty pathetic what goes on in Thailand.


Just liked that page...thank you for spreading the word about such an interesting and awesome group.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

are we really any more enlightened?

In most of this country, we can chain a dog to a tree and leave it there his whole life. 

We raise feed animals in godawful conditions. 

We have puppy mills, which can be the cruelest of the cruel because it is an agonizing, LONG (years) period of torture to a dog. 

We have Michael Vicks, who think watching a dog struggle to get out of a swimming pool while being eloctrocuted is sport. He learned that from somewhere.

Hoarders, who like puppy mills relegate dogs to years of misery and horror - and in the name of "love."

i was the one who posted the link to the pet abuse site - there is a woman on there I have been trying to get arrested for YEARS as she continues her reign of terror over hundreds of poor tortured animals, with no luck.

In the end, is a dog on a higher plane than a chicken? Or a calf? Those of us who eat meat (including me) are hypocrites, unless we raise our own animals or get them from a place where we know they are raised and killed humanely.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

X, you're right, thats why I eluded to us(the U.S.) being hypocrits in a way....

Its a tough issue and I completely understand the contradictorary position we are in preaching to Asian countries. However, I like to think we are at least a sliver better than they are--but I'd be hardpressed to PROVE that in a court of law. Imagine the mountain of evidence I'd have to contend with in regards to slaugherhouses, etc... 

So, I don't have a logical argument on the entire subject except to say that Dogs are different to me. Its a crappy argument but the best I got.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Some countries consider horsemeat a common meat, also - but not here. So what do we do? We ship them to Mexico under horrible, horrible conditions to slaughter and sell to Europe. 

I think we are worse with companion animals, in a way, than farm animals. Like the horses - slaughterhouses for cattle have at least SOME oversight but we are "too good" to slaughter horses, so we consign them to incredible suffering so we can take the high road. 

We are all disgusting, frankly. The Asians consider dogs like we consider chickens - Hindus must think WE are barbaric for killing cattle, which they consider not only on a higher plane than other animals, but downright sacred.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

I also get the Soi Dog Foundation updates. Dogs in most progessive countries are not respected like they are here. They're used for meat a lot in other countries. Heart wrenching to say the least. 

I traveled to thailand in 2005. I actually loved it there. I spent time on an animal refuge that took in unwanted dogs and elephants. Not everyone in Thailand is barbaric....they're a Buddhist country and they are a peaceful country...but every country has their bad apples. There are countless tragedies that happen here in the US everyday to a similar magnitude (illegal sex trade? Human trafficking? Illegal drug trade?), just not pertaining to animal abuse like what is happening there. 

Truth is, there are terrible things happening everywhere. What we can do is be advocates for what is right, and making a positive change in the world.


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## minnieme (Jul 6, 2011)

DaneMama said:


> I spent time on an animal refuge that took in unwanted dogs and elephants.


Not meaning to get off topic, but ... that sounds AMAZING. How cool.. I am jealous


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## catahoulamom (Sep 23, 2010)

I was speaking to a woman from Cuba who told me her family lived in such poverty they had to resort to eating cats. She then said "You probably think I am a monster." I told her "No, I don't eat any animals, but I don't think you are horrible for eating a cat. You need to survive."

Yes, we have more emotional attachment to dogs and cats. But the same stuff is going on in this country with cattle, chickens, etc (as mentioned above, I know you realize we are a bit hypocritical, Kevin). I feel bad for the different oriental countries that are looked upon as disgusting or vial because they eat what we choose to keep as companions. Yeah, I personally think it's gross, and sad, but I also think eating chicken is gross. If I saw a chicken being put up for slaughter I would want to save them just as much as I'd want to save a dog or cat. I understand not all people are as attached to farm animals as the animals we choose to keep as pets. 

That being said, yes, the conditions that these animals live in is absolutely disgusting and horrendous. It infuriates me, but knowing where the meat comes from that I feed my dogs also infuriates me.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

OK I gotta say something off topic - my parents spent two years in Malaysia and they went to someplace that had elephants, and they bought some bananas to feed them.

So my mom said she imagined holding out a banana and the elephant delicately picking it up with their trunk like you see on TV. But there wasn't a fence between them - she held out a banana and the elephants started crowding around her banging her with their trunks, and pushing against each other to get to her, and trying to grab the bananas. So she threw down her bananas and ran like crazy.

And that was the end of her elephant interaction.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Julie said:


> I was speaking to a woman from Cuba who told me her family lived in such poverty they had to resort to eating cats. She then said "You probably think I am a monster." I told her "No, I don't eat any animals, but I don't think you are horrible for eating a cat. You need to survive."(


And that's the thing - there are not many people in the US who can understand real, true poverty. You eat anything you find that's edible or you die. And often you die anyway. 

My problem is with the money-making folks, here and everywhere. Cruelty to animals for profit is a whole different level than killing a cat to feed your children.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

xellil said:


> And that's the thing - there are not many people in the US who can understand real, true poverty. You eat anything you find that's edible or you die. And often you die anyway.
> 
> My problem is with the money-making folks, here and everywhere. Cruelty to animals for profit is a whole different level than killing a cat to feed your children.


I'm sure that applies in some instances... but the article I read didn't imply people killing Dogs to feed starving families. Quite the opposite. It centered more around Dogs being viewed as a delicacy and becoming more and more valuable. In FACT, the article actually had a positive side-- Dogs are being sought after so much that they are being stolen from owners right in broad daylight. Yeah, YOUR family Dog being stolen from your home and sold to the Dog trade. Because the police won't do much, the local townspeople are revolting against the Dog thieves. In one example, they actually burned one of the thieves alive and left his body on the roadside as a warning to other Dog thieves. (I hope he enjoys his place on the road was all I could think to myself)

While I get what you are saying(man doing what he needs to do to survive), I don't believe it applies here.


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## catahoulamom (Sep 23, 2010)

I wasn't aware they were stealing dogs to be sold for meat. They were doing the same with horses in Miami... except they would just kill the horse in the owner's field (middle of the night), cut off all the meat, and leave the body to be found by the owner the next day.

F*****g SICK! Could you imagine?!

If anybody were to even *think* of stealing my animals, for meat, to be their pet, whatever... they might want to think twice. I WILL find them. And it won't be pretty when I do!!!


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

kevin bradley said:


> I'm sure that applies in some instances... but the article I read didn't imply people killing Dogs to feed starving families. Quite the opposite. It centered more around Dogs being viewed as a delicacy and becoming more and more valuable. In FACT, the article actually had a positive side-- Dogs are being sought after so much that they are being stolen from owners right in broad daylight. Yeah, YOUR family Dog being stolen from your home and sold to the Dog trade. Because the police won't do much, the local townspeople are revolting against the Dog thieves. In one example, they actually burned one of the thieves alive and left his body on the roadside as a warning to other Dog thieves. (I hope he enjoys his place on the road was all I could think to myself)
> 
> While I get what you are saying(man doing what he needs to do to survive), I don't believe it applies here.


Well, that wasn't all of what I wrote - I also wrote "My problem is with the money-making folks, here and everywhere. Cruelty to animals for profit is a whole different level than killing a cat to feed your children."

We do the same thing here - stealing dogs out of people's back yards to be bait dogs for fighting rings. Or for various and sundry other sordid reasons that usually involve cruel and inhumane treatment.

Maybe we should burn a few of them on the side of the road. in the US, we are often way too lenient on the criminals. Hang a few heads on a post, and maybe their buddies would stop doing it.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

Julie,

Thats kind of what this article centered around... how people are taking justice into their own hands. Apparently...and its hard to follow because I've never been to Thailand... but even though Dogs are eaten over there, they are also valued pets to some people. The Thieves don't care and have become quite bold in terms of what they will do to get Dogs. The owners of the pets are battling back. 

Now, I'm the wrong person to get going on religious beliefs and crazy spiritual BS, but apparently there is something special about eating Dog meat at certain times of the month. Where these whackos get off on this belief is unbeknownst to me....lovely. 

Yeah, I'd torture anyone who messed w/ my guys. Seriously.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

xellil said:


> Well, that wasn't all of what I wrote - I also wrote "My problem is with the money-making folks, here and everywhere. Cruelty to animals for profit is a whole different level than killing a cat to feed your children."
> 
> We do the same thing here - stealing dogs out of people's back yards to be bait dogs for fighting rings. Or for various and sundry other sordid reasons that usually involve cruel and inhumane treatment.
> 
> Maybe we should burn a few of them on the side of the road. in the US, we are often way too lenient on the criminals. Hang a few heads on a post, and maybe their buddies would stop doing it.


No disagreement from me there.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

Natalie is right, not everyone in those Asian countries is barbaric. But whenever you read stories like that, it's so hard not to generalize. I've heard of some awful things from my mom's Chinese coworkers that I won't repeat here. I spent a lot of childhood summers in Asia and I've seen a lot of terrible things done to animals. It's an ugly part of Asian culture I don't like to be identified with. I'm just glad it's illegal in the country where my parents came from.

I hate reading those stories...and they get me riled up and ruin my mood. My husband doesn't even read half the links I send him. His response is always something like, "It's China...you shouldn't be surprised." But I read them...and they surprise me every time. And it upsets me every time. Because if it didn't and I just brushed it off, then I would make one more person in the world who turns a blind eye to those cruel acts. So at the end of the day, I will go home and hug my little bear, and promise that I will never let something like that happen to him...and all the future dogs that fall into my life.


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## Love my lab (Dec 9, 2010)

The whole thing is very disturbing.... from the animal to drug to human trade. It is beyond my mind set to understand how any human being can be so cruel. A helpless animal, child, woman whatever the case may be to look something in the eye then cause it harm and make money off of it, is just a sad world to live in. It happens each and everyday all around us. I look at my dog and think how amazing she is and thank God she is mine and will never have to endure that kind of treatment. All I can say to those who do this kind of thing is karma is a B*@#H !


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## DazzleKitty (Aug 23, 2011)

This is a sore topic with me. I try not to generalize a whole country based on how some of them act, but it's hard not to when this is a NORMAL part of their meat market.

A country that tortures animals before they kill them because it makes the meat taste better? I have a hard time sympathizing with anyone who supports that. And I know not all Chinese people agree with that and that there are animal welfare groups over there that are tryign to abolish it. They treat their people just as cruel too.

Don't even get me started on China's fur market.....I'm sure some of you know exactly what I'm talking about. It's unreal.

As much as I hate PETA, they have shown that the US isn't perfect either with their meat market. Factory farms are uncaring to animals and give them nasty, unhealthy living environments. The staff has also been secretly filmed beating animals or torturing them in other ways.

And of course, we also have puppy mills where animals are seen as a commodity rather than a living, breathing being.

I cannot condemn China for the consumption of dog meat, if I wanna be honest. I myself would never, ever want to eat a dog because I do favor them over other animals. However, the cows, chickens, pigs, etc I consume ALSO value their life and want to live. And the meat I buy from the supermarket likely has come from an animal that has had a short, miserable life. And the milk I drink has likely came from an unhappy cow. So I'm really a hypocrite. Not all farms are bad. Most people in American wouldn't ignore someone hurting an animal to improve that taste. That's why those at the factory farms DO get in trouble when caught. 

That's must my two cents.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

i wonder if they are still torturing calves for veal here in the US? That was standard practice for many years, to make the meat good. i found someplace where it says there is pending legislation in some states to ban veal crates. This is about British veal:



> Solitary Confinement
> The veal crate is a wooden restraining device that is the veal calf's permanent home. It is so small (22" x 54") that the calves cannot turn around or even lie down and stretch and is the ultimate in high-profit, confinement animal agriculture.(1) Designed to prevent movement (exercise), the crate does its job of atrophying the calves' muscles, thus producing tender "gourmet" veal.
> 
> "Feeding" Time
> The calves are generally fed a milk substitute intentionally lacking in iron and other essential nutrients. This diet keeps the animals anemic and creates the pale pink or white color desired in the finished product. Craving iron, the calves lick urine-saturated slats and any metallic parts of their stalls. Farmers also withhold water from the animals, who, always thirsty, are driven to drink a large quantity of the high-fat liquid feed.


Veal : A Cruel Meal

It just seems we should be getting more exorcised about what's going on in our own backyard - puppy meals, veal production, farm animals for feed in general.


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## kevin bradley (Aug 9, 2009)

xellil said:


> i wonder if they are still torturing calves for veal here in the US? That was standard practice for many years, to make the meat good. i found someplace where it says there is pending legislation in some states to ban veal crates. This is about British veal:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The more I read stuff like this the closer I get to becoming a Vegetarian. 

Even if I did though, I'd never make my Dogs not eat meat. The best I can ever hope for is that animals are treated in a humane and ethical way. Sadly, I doubt that will ever happen entirely.


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