# Labrador Retreivers



## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Ok so today someone tried to tell their Lab was a "barrel chested" lab. Um aren't all labs barrel chested? So that go me thinking, the reason she said it was because her lab is HUGE!!! The dog weighs in at around 100lbs (he used to weigh 130, so she's gotten him down quite a bit). But is there an actual line of lab that is bred bigger or are these dogs technically mutants??? I know the AKC doesn't like a lab over 80lbs..

I also know there are working line labs and I've also heard of English lines (not sure if that's real either)...

So you lab ppl or anyone else please enlighten me!


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

English lines are real and do exist. Just like UK and Euro Boxers. I believe all Labs are supposed to be barrel chested, not completely sure though, but that seems right. But barrel chested labs, yeah I'm pretty sure that doesn't exist.

Plus, it all goes with what's going on and winning in the show ring. Just like Boxerd and getting taller and more refined, labs are getting chunkier and chunkier. That's just the tip of the iceberg about breeding for what's winning though....google it if wanted, you could read for days.


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

My guy is 90 pounds, though you'd never guess. Muscle weighs more than fat :smile:

There are two types of Labs (sadly)
"English" Type (also called bench or ring type) - These are the the dogs bred for the conformation ring. Most are blockier than field types, as well as kept at a heavier show weight. Most look like this:
here
or
here

The other type is "Field" type. Bred for working, these guys can be quite a handful! They are kept leaner and have narrower heads. Most look like this:
here
or
here


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

I have labs, I was told that the term barrel chested means smaller across the front of their chest and then where the rib cage is its like a barrel, I was also told that a dog with this shape is more prone to bloat than a dog that has a broader chest. Something like that.







This is a field bread lab and yes she is a hand full, if you like to sleep or rest you should just forget it with her!!!


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## Little Brown Jug (Dec 7, 2010)

Barrel chested is not something I've ever heard by someone as a line of Lab. Now English/Bench and Field yes, I've heard of those. I've seen people use bench/english as an excuse for why their dog is overweight or rather not overweight. But a lot of the show vs working vary in type, and its sad. 

Ranger is a big sturdy guy, yes at one point he was very overweight but I think he's at a good weight now, he's never going to look like sleek field lab he just isn't built that way but he at least now has a waist line and you can see and easily feel his last two ribs. He's still at least 100lbs but he's just big, he's a back yard bred boy so he's neither bench or working. Our friend as a female field type Lab and boy she can go, I find her personality is completely different as well. She's serious and work work work. Ranger can't keep up with her, they duck hunt together and while Ranger does his job I seriously doubt its anything compared to our friend's. He just can't he's just like a bull moose crashing around in the woods and agile is not something you'd ever compare him to. They both have joint issues (the female was hit by a car and had a lot of hip hardware put in) but you'd never tell she has them where as Ranger can barely walk sometimes after a day of going.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Chocx2 whats the dog in your siggy? That's one good looking dog.

So I guess my next question is, are these english show labs technically overweight? Or is that how they are bred to look? Because both of those dogs (posted by redneckcowgirl) to me personally look overweight.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Here's the cow--I mean lab in question.


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> So I guess my next question is, are these english show labs technically overweight? Or is that how they are bred to look? Because both of those dogs (posted by redneckcowgirl) to me personally look overweight.


That is what is referred to as "show weight". You'll find it in most breeds, they are kept chubby as an attempt to disguise any faults (at least this is what is done in horses, not entirely sure about dogs.) So yes, technically they are overweight, but they are also built stockier than a field type. Sometimes you can get lucky and find a dog that can succeed in both ring and field, but sadly in Labs the types are so distinct that its hard to do. I love bench bred labs, when they are kept in shape and also have the drive and athleticism that the breed should have. Moose is half field *dam* type half bench *sire* (but man does that boy have drive!) and he got the best of both worlds (thankfully). I've yet to meet a dog that can out work Moose. He is like an energizer bunny! lol


ETA:
Just clarifying something too.

Just because bench breds are sometimes referred to as "English" type, doesn't necessarily mean that they have any English bloodlines. You can have a field lab with English lines, a bench bred with American, etc.


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

RedneckCowgirl said:


> That is what is referred to as "show weight". You'll find it in most breeds, they are kept chubby as an attempt to disguise any faults (at least this is what is done in horses, not entirely sure about dogs.) So yes, technically they are overweight, but they are also built stockier than a field type. Sometimes you can get lucky and find a dog that can succeed in both ring and field, but sadly in Labs the types are so distinct that its hard to do. I love bench bred labs, when they are kept in shape and also have the drive and athleticism that the breed should have. Moose is half field *dam* type half bench *sire* (but man does that boy have drive!) and he got the best of both worlds (thankfully). I've yet to meet a dog that can out work Moose. He is like an energizer bunny! lol



Well that makes more sense. So in theory, if you are not in the showing world there is no real reason to keep them at a heavier weight. Though I'm sure ppl do. I would assume that extra weight would really stress their joints, esp in a breed so prone to hip displasia...


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Here's the cow--I mean lab in question.
> 
> View attachment 8130


That's a bench type. He could probably stand to lose a few pounds, but any more than that and he would look strange imo.


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Well that makes more sense. So in theory, if you are not in the showing world there is no real reason to keep them at a heavier weight. Though I'm sure ppl do. I would assume that extra weight would really stress their joints, esp in a breed so prone to hip displasia...


Correct, however Labs are not usually picky, have stomachs of iron, and are usually pretty easy keepers. So when the general dog owning populations these days thinks food=love, you get that probably 80+ percent of Labs (around here at least) are obese


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## Love my lab (Dec 9, 2010)

RedneckCowgirl explained it good  My two are field lines...taller and leaner. Reahven at her top weight was 88 and that was bulky...too bulky, and drake is just 7 months and wieghs 61. He is tall and lanky. I do not think he has portioned out yet. He just seems to be in that in between puppy looking I am still growing phase. 

It is funny though because some lab people say labs are not suppose to have a tuck...well mine sure do. When Reahven was at 88lbs my vet had a stroke about her weight and I did drop her down to 76...which is to thin for her I discovered so I try to keep her around 78-80, but in part of the "lecture" from the vet she said that so many people today are used to seeing "fat or heavier" labs and therefore it is just accepted. But in no way is it good for the dog. I actually agree. I have seen many over weight labs but I have also seen many fit labs both bench and field....so it really falls onto the owner in my opinion. If I fed my dogs as much as those sad puppy eyes asked for food I would have two rollie pollie puppies.


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## Little Brown Jug (Dec 7, 2010)

Labs = air ferns. All they have to do is breath and they gain weight. People seem to think a Lab isn't a Lab unless its overweight but then its not overweight because after all, it's a Lab. Its sad how many I see that are obese. I've only seen one here who I actually consider underweight. He lived a couple houses down, outdoor dog. Whenever he got loose he booted it over to Woof and they'd play until the Lab started to obsessively hump Woof to the point he'd snap at him. Poor skinny thing never got the hint and every time it would end in having to turn the hose on him. You could see every one of his ribs.


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## lovemydogsalways (Mar 4, 2012)

My girl is field bred and she is at 71 pounds. She is taller and leaner than a bench bred. I do not like how show labs look these days. Too big IMO.


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## PDXdogmom (Jun 30, 2010)

One of my dogs is a bench bred lab. Her sire and dam both competed in the show ring. My lab is sturdy and somewhat stocky, but only weighs 56 lb. She is our pet companion and we do not show her. But one of her litter-mates competes and you would think it's a totally different line of dog due to what is excess weight IMO.


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

I agree about the labs, my three are field bread, they are all different sizes. The black girl is about 58 59 pounds and eats like a horse. My chocolate male is the same under 60lbs now my chocolate female is sister to the male and she weighs about 65 lbs. Thats her with the duck in her mouth lol.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

bleh, WHY do judges like fat show dogs! I will never understand that. Its terrible.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> bleh, WHY do judges like fat show dogs! I will never understand that. Its terrible.


I can't say it's always the judges faults. Fat helps hide a bad topline, it creates the look of substance, (talking about Boxers) etc. Having seen bench labs I don't know if I can say they are necessarily fat. They are stockier and heavier, but they are in shape. It may not be a shape you're used to, but they have muscle, it's not all fat. Same with Rotts, Mastiffs, etc. I highly doubt you'll ever see a truly fat show dog. Stocky and heavier yes, but not fat.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

SaharaNight Boxers said:


> I can't say it's always the judges faults. Fat helps hide a bad topline, it creates the look of substance, (talking about Boxers) etc. Having seen bench labs I don't know if I can say they are necessarily fat. They are stockier and heavier, but they are in shape. It may not be a shape you're used to, but they have muscle, it's not all fat. Same with Rotts, Mastiffs, etc. I highly doubt you'll ever see a truly fat show dog. Stocky and heavier yes, but not fat.


I will have to disagree. Those links ******* posted are terrible. There is no way in hell that dog is fit. Its fat.

It is VERY easy to tell the difference between an over weight dog and a fit dog.


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## Little Brown Jug (Dec 7, 2010)

If by in shape you mean round then yes they are in shape. But there is no way anyone can convince me that the many of the show dogs are at a healthy, ideal weight. I think the hounds are maybe the only ones on a constant basis that look like they are at at the least a decent weight.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

Little Brown Jug said:


> *If by in shape you mean round then yes they are in shape.* But there is no way anyone can convince me that the many of the show dogs are at a healthy, ideal weight. I think the hounds are maybe the only ones on a constant basis that look like they are at at the least a decent weight.



:rofl: :rofl:


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

What about this

Kelrobin Labradors - UCH Kelrobin Shoshone Phantom WC CGC Am/Can RN

That dog does conformation, rally, can swim and retrieve, etc. Honestly, I didn't think those dogs he posted were fat. They still had a slight tuck and the black ones tail had curled over so it looks like it has no tuck. If you put your hands on one you'll see it's more coat and substance instead of true fat. And as far as hounds being the only decent ones, go look at some Boxers, way too elegant and skinny. Most show dogs aren't fat, I promise. If sticky is in the standard, yes they are going to be stocky.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

Even fat dogs can still have a slight tuck.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> Even fat dogs can still have a slight tuck.


Have you ever put your hands on one?


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

SaharaNight Boxers said:


> Have you ever put your hands on one?


On a fat dog?


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> On a fat dog?


Honestly, you can't say they're fat until you put your hands on one. Mastiffs look fat, Rotts, Daschunds, etc. Just because a dog has substance it doesn't mean it's fat.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

SaharaNight Boxers said:


> Honestly, you can't say they're fat until you put your hands on one. Mastiffs look fat, Rotts, Daschunds, etc. Just because a dog has substance it doesn't mean it's fat.


I have worked with and around dogs my entire life. I currently work at a dog boarding facility. I know what a fat dog looks like, feels like, and moves like. I also know what each breed looks like fit and can tell when they are over weight.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> I have worked with and around dogs my entire life. I currently work at a dog boarding facility. I know what a fat dog looks like, feels like, and moves like. I also know what each breed looks like fit and can tell when they are over weight.


Having substance on a dog to standard is much different then putting weight on a random dog. If you're suggesting that a field lab is the only right weight and look for a lab I disagree. Honestly, some of them just look kind of lanky to me. And with over 180 breeds I promise they're all different, even different lines within breeds have different substances and more pronounced areas of substance. Go to a dog show and you'll see the levels of substance. I highly doubt you'd find a truly fat though.

Having substance and good bone is different than just having weight.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

SaharaNight Boxers said:


> *Having substance and good bone is different than just having weight*.


Yes it is and I have seen very few show dogs that are the exception. 

I do think that it is an epidemic of sorts and needs to be corrected.

A fat dog is a fat dog regardless of the standard.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> Yes it is and I have seen very few show dogs that are the exception.
> 
> I do think that it is an epidemic of sorts and needs to be corrected.
> 
> A fat dog is a fat dog regardless of the standard.


And some of those labs do. Almost any working dog originally had to have substance and be ever so slightly fat. The Gean dogs had to endure cold weather, possible days without food, long hard work, etc. Labs had to swim in cold water in the seas. They had to have fat to keep their joints an internal organs warm. Everything is for a reason. Every breed has their problems and their extremes. I don't really see that as a problem in labs.


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## Little Brown Jug (Dec 7, 2010)

That is not muscle. That is overweight. Pure and simple and a dishonor to the dog. They look like bulls. Its not healthy and shouldn't be allowed, I don't see how those dogs can perform they orginal purpose very well. 










This guy was both a field champion and won best in show at Crufts. This, to me is what should be winning. A dog that can do both things and do it well because he isn't hindered by his weight or some extreme disconfiguration that people think is pretty to look at but makes him useless for the breeds original use.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

I definitely agree those two are fat. Like I said there are extremes all around the country in the ring. That would be one of the extremes to me. That third dog is like what I've seen around here.


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

SaharaNight Boxers said:


> And some of those labs do. Almost any working dog originally had to have substance and be ever so slightly fat. The Gean dogs had to endure cold weather, possible days without food, long hard work, etc. Labs had to swim in cold water in the seas. They had to have fat to keep their joints an internal organs warm. Everything is for a reason. Every breed has their problems and their extremes. I don't really see that as a problem in labs.


This is something I have always believed. Having owned an English-type/bench Lab for over 12 years, he was not slim and trim by any means (nor was he fat)--- and not easy to keep him at a good weight. His head was heavier and more square, his body totally built for swimming in rough, cold waters. He may not have been the most graceful on land, but in water he was as smooth as silk, barely making a ripple as he water-retrieved for hours; his stamina was amazing!

Anyway, I actually agree with both of you; I have been to Westminster many times and have seen some real chunky labs up close and personal...
I believe good, strong swimmers need some bulk...maybe to be built more "seal-like" (like mine was, lol) with that strong, thick straight tail for a "rudder."

BTW-- my lab's father was a 1996 breed winner at Westminster.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

NewYorkDogue said:


> This is something I have always believed. Having owned an English-type/bench Lab for over 12 years, he was not slim and trim by any means (nor was he fat)--- and not easy to keep him at a good weight. His head was heavier and more square, his body totally built for swimming in rough, cold waters. He may not have been the most graceful on land, but in water he was as smooth as silk, barely making a ripple as he water-retrieved for hours; his stamina was amazing!
> 
> Anyway, I actually agree with both of you; I have been to Westminster many times and have seen some real chunky labs up close and personal...
> I believe good, strong swimmers need some bulk...maybe to be built more "seal-like" (like mine was, lol) with that strong, thick straight tail for a "rudder."
> ...


Exactly what you said. And btw, I'm so jealous you are so close to Westminster....so not fair.


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

I have met a lot of labs... and I mean a LOT. They are my heart breed and try and I surround myself with as many as possible. Maybe 2 or 3 of the bench type labs I've met have been at a decent weight and fit, and you could tell just by looking at them. No need to but your hands on a lab to tell how fit they are.


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

Wow those dogs are pretty to look at but they are fat. Just my opinion. I trained with a person that showed her dog, her dogs had master hunt titles, to me they looked short and fat or should I say stocky? They didn't seem to have that go my dogs had?

I also think some of that is changing because of the hips and elbows issues. The show dogs and field dogs are now being bread for looks, and all their health clearances. I will be breeding my black female, she is OFA excellent her elbows, thyroid, heart, eyes, and genetic issues have all been cleared from her. And I will not breed her to a male that has any less. Its very hard to find.

I feel like I'm bragging but I'm not just mentioning it. My dogs swim all day and do make lots of wake because they are moving very fast trying to get there retrieve. I've seen poodles swim smooth, I think its just a matter of speed in the water.


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

You are right about bench types being less in terms of working then fields. Not to say they don't have drive or aren't good on the field. Just the way they are built makes then at a slight disadvantage and field types are way more dog then bench type.

I do love to look at bench bred labs, and if I could find one with the drive and working ethic/ability as a field bred lab I would be in heaven! :smile:


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

Chocx2 said:


> I agree about the labs, my three are field bread, they are all different sizes. The black girl is about 58 59 pounds and eats like a horse. My chocolate male is the same under 60lbs now my chocolate female is sister to the male and she weighs about 65 lbs. Thats her with the duck in her mouth lol.
> 
> View attachment 8135
> View attachment 8136
> ...


Um why is this the first time im really seeing pics of your pups!?!? They are all gorgeous!! Do you have Australian Shepherds as well? I demand more pics, pretty please :biggrin:


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> Um why is this the first time im really seeing pics of your pups!?!? They are all gorgeous!! Do you have Australian Shepherds as well? I demand more pics, pretty please :biggrin:


I agree Chocx, you never post pictures of your stunning dogs! :smile:


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## 1605 (May 27, 2009)

Not wanting to hijack the thread, but I've posted similar comments about field vs conformation bred GSPs. Zio is the product of a dual champion sire (show & field) plus a field champion dam. And despite being perfectly within standard, he would be considered "too small" to be in the show ring. In fact ANY of the GSPs I've seen at conformation events are overweight and what I believe to be larger than standard.

Meanwhile, right now Zio is not in true field condition. Yes, you can see his ribs, and yes, he feels very solid with good muscle definition. But come the end of November when The Season is well under way down here, he will look & feel different. Not that he's overweight now, but at that point he'll probably down by a couple of pounds through sheer energy output.

In fact, most dogs at field events would probably be considered "too skinny" if you were to see them on the street. Especially those owned by "professionals". But they are doing what they were bred to do and are incredibly fast when they are not on point. 

FWIW,


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

I only have one Aussie, he's my fluffmuffin her loves to dock jump and keep all the other doggies in line.


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## RedneckCowgirl (Oct 28, 2011)

I love that second picture. Moose gives me that same "Please through it" look/stance :tongue:


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## porchpotty (Aug 10, 2011)

Mine weighs 85 lbs.


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## warunasanjaya1919 (Aug 18, 2012)

lauren43,I never heard a labrador weigh 100lb. It must be an anomaly. Most probably genes of dog's father's ,genes of dog's mother's or genes of both affected to the 100lb weighed Labrador. The largest value for the weight of a Labrador I found out is 88lb.


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## GoingPostal (Sep 5, 2011)

warunasanjaya1919 said:


> lauren43,I never heard a labrador weigh 100lb. It must be an anomaly. Most probably genes of dog's father's ,genes of dog's mother's or genes of both affected to the 100lb weighed Labrador. The largest value for the weight of a Labrador I found out is 88lb.


Huge labs are the norm around here but most are fat as well. My sister's was 110 when they got him and is down to about 75-80, my former landlords is sitting at 120 and was 87 when he got him. A coworker is 100 pounds as well and likely just super fat but I haven't seen him.


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