# Is Natural Balance ethoxxquin-free?



## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

According to dog food analysis they don't guarantee it. Sweet potato and salmon formula.


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

There isn't a sweet potato and salmon formula...there's a sweet potato and fish formula if that's what you're talking about. If it is, when I e-mailed them they did assure me that they guarantee it is Ethoxyquin free. If that's not the formula you're talking about then I cannot tell you 100% for sure.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Well the "fish" in said "Sweet Potato and Fish" formula is salmon, so hanksta wasn't really incorrect there.


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

rannmiller said:


> Well the "fish" in said "Sweet Potato and Fish" formula is salmon, so hanksta wasn't really incorrect there.


Yes, I know that it is salmon (it's one of the formulas I feed) however the title is Sweet Potato and Fish. Since I don't deal with the non limit ingredient diets that they have, they may have one that is called salmon I don't know hence the reason I was clarifying.


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## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

Thanks for the info. Yeah, I meant the "fish" (salmon). I think this might be a good food to mix the wellness core with. Both are grain free.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

If you want to go with a fishy one, why not do the Wellness Core fish one or the Orijen 6 fish? I love the ingredients on the Orijen 6 fish, it's so good!

Even though the Natural Balance Potato and Fish formula is "grain-free" they use more potatoes than meat, which I think defeats the purpose of feeding a grain-free diet, since you're probably trying to feed a food that has more meat in it if grain-free is your goal. I know these "grain free" formulas by Natural balance work well for some dogs, especially health-problem prone/allergy dogs, but for a perfectly healthy dog, there are much better options that will enhance rather than detract from your dog's diet IMO


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## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

Yeah, To many carbs in Natural Balance. Thats why I was thinking of mixing it with the Core. I can't get Orijen puppy here in Carson City, but I could get it ordered. Thanks for the info rannmiller.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

You're in Carson City, as in Nevada?


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## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

Yes, Carson City NV.


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Nice! I live in Reno. If you're willing to make the drive once a month, Scraps Dog Company on S. Virginia Street (the closest Scraps to Carson so you don't have to drive into the "heart" of Reno) sells Orijen if you really want to start using it. That's where my roommate gets hers too!

Depending on where you live in Carson, it'd be around a 30 minute drive one way, not too shabby for the best kibble on the market. 

I used to live in Spring Creek and I had to drive 30 minutes to get to Elko if I ever wanted anything that the basic grocery store in SC didn't carry, not to mention going to work there 5 days a week. When I think about it like that, 30 minutes one way once a month doesn't seem too terrible. 

Just throwin it out there, I know driving through Washoe Valley isn't the most fun thing you can do, after all.


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## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

Yeah I lived in Reno for 8 years. Washoe's not too bad, wish they would hurry with the freeway being built. I can get the Orijen here in town. Sierra la bone carries it. They just don't carry the puppy formula but they will order it for me. I am just a little worried about the EXTREME level of protein in that food. I know all the new research says it's ok and actually good for healthy dogs, but I am one who believes "to much of anything is bad." I guess when you think about it, wouldn't the protein level be that high on a raw or "natural" diet? I'm on the fence with the Orijen. Do you feed it, or know anyone who has been for long term? Let me know.


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

Yes the levels would be that or higher in a raw diet, however I am one that belives there is a HUGE difference between a fresh diet and a kibble diet and that they really cannot be compared. Personally I have known dogs that were on the grain free high protein kibble diets who ended up with kidney problems. So yes I've seen the "research" and read the "studies" however I personally will not feed a kibble with protein that high just given what I have personally seen and quite a few cases that I personally know, I just won't chance it. But that's just my personal opinion. I think you will find just as many for it as against it so it will be something you will have to form your own opinion on.


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## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

Is there any good convenient raw diets I could maybe switch to? I really don't know much about raw diets. Something that comes packaged with everything I(she) needs? and is easily available? Like everyone else here, I want whats best for my dog, so many choices and you hear good and bad about everything. I have had 3 previous boxers and 2 out of the 3 ended up getting cancer. Unfortunatly I thought Eukinuba and Natures Recipe were good foods back then. My Vet even recomended them. Now I realize I was dead wrong.


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## BoxerMommie (Jun 26, 2008)

I will tell you, don't beat yourself up. Even with a fabulous diet, Boxers are walking cancer sticks. I've owned 3, and foster them for a rescue and I've NEVER heard of a Boxer dying of old age, it's typically either cancer or have to be put down due to DM, and that includes ones that were fed kibble, raw, whatever. Obviously some are lost sooner than others, but unfortunately that's one of the downsides to the breed. I'm not saying don't feed your Boxer a great food or try to find the best, etc I'm just saying you have to realize the limitations too and nothing is fool proof and there are many times that it will happen regardless of waht you do.

I don't have a desire to feed raw so I've never looked into it, but I'm sure someone here can.

Best of luck!


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

My roommate feeds Orijen puppy and its the only kibble so far that's actually agreed with his tummy. I think that feeding animal based proteins at that level are fine and I know Orijen is pretty much the best kibble on the market, I've never heard of it causing kidney damage, but that's just me. 

Raw diets are easy. Carson City has a super Walmart right? If so, they should have chicken leg quarters for about $.63/lb and beef liver for about$1.50/package. You'd probably need to feed about one or two chicken leg quarters per day and the beef liver once a week with the chicken. Add some fish in there every now and then and vary the protein sources when you can and there you have it: a convenient, balanced, raw food diet.


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## hanksta13 (Dec 28, 2008)

Thats all, no vegitables, or suppliments or anything like that? Just meat?


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

Yep. The only supplements I add is some fish oil pills if I don't give them fish that week. Older dogs who need it can get glucosamine and chondroitin. Dogs with health issues who need supplements (I know some raw feeders need glandular supplements and whatnot) need it. But if you feed a healthy dog like it'd eat in nature or as close to it as possible, you shouldn't need to supplement it. 

Don't worry, I didn't believe this when I first started either so I added blended or cooked veggies (because dogs can't digest them in their natural state, that should've been my first clue I guess) and all it did was make their stools soft and more frequent. I cut out the veggies and their stools became rock hard, and tiny and less frequent.


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## clockcycle (Dec 22, 2008)

http://dogfoodchat.com/forum/dry-ca...d-name-dog-foods-where-they-manufactured.html

Dog Food Reviews - Chicken Soup For The Dog Lover's Soul Large Breed - Powered by ReviewPost

Those should help ya confirm the answer. According to these posts, Natural Balance is manufactured by Diamond. On the Chicken Soup For The Dog Lover's Soul review (also manufactured by Diamond), the reviewer/editor states that Diamond now guarantees they obtain and use ethoxyquin-free meat & fish sources.

Not sure if these statements still hold true, since these reviews, posts are a bit dated.


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## LoveNewfies (Jun 18, 2008)

There are many foods manufactured by Diamond. Chicken Soup is actually part of Diamond, Natural Balance, unless something has changed, is not. Honestly, you'd have to ask the dog food company for a copy of the certificate from the manufacturer of the fish meal that states whether or not the fish meal is ethoxyquin free.

As for the protein levels, I personally feel that people are a little too nervous over this issue. Unless there is an underlying medical issue, high amounts of meat protein are not an issue. First off, consider this: For a 70 lb dog, depending on metabolism and activity level, approximately 2 cups of Orijen (42% protein) would be fed. The same dog being fed Chicken Soup for the Dog Lover's Soul (24% protein) would eat approximately 3 1/2 cups a day. If you break it all down, you aren't going to find huge differences in the amount of protein per feeding between the two. What you will find is that by feeding Orijen instead of Chicken Soup, you will be providing more meat protein. Not only that, you will be cutting out a huge portion of unnecessary carbohydrates. Not as great as a raw diet, no doubt, but certainly far better for a dog than a grain laden food that is low in meat protein. Don't even get me going on the carbohydrate issue.

Kidney issues can develop on any food. No matter what kibble you offer, it is still kibble, still an unnatural food for a dog. If you feed a high protein kibble and your dog is even slightly dehydrated (not uncommon with kibble fed dogs) the test results for kidney values can be off. They can also be off if the dog has not been properly fasted prior to blood work.


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