# The Dilemma - FISH



## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

I am unable to find any type of fish other than can or salmon fillets. A local Asian market carries whole mackerel, sardines and anchovies...problem...they're all imported from Vietnam. In my situation...what would you do?


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

Have any water to go fishing around you? I'm not being smart, I was just thinking of feeding mullet we have them in my backyard lol I saw a site selling them. 

Anyone one fed mullet before?

I wonder, they have a bait area in WalMart, and have some large bait fish, just a thought.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Well, i buy the sardines and mackeral from the Asian market. I believe they also come from Viet Nam. OR maybe India.

i don't know - you're going to have people say they would never feed those fish. But I do because I really, really like the idea of real fish and not canned sardines and I haven't heard any awful things about sardines from Viet Nam.

Many of the canned sardines come from Viet Nam and I figure if I feed those I can feed the frozen whole ones.


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## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

Oh, there's plenty of places to go fishing but really only want to feed mackerel, sardines, anchovies and/or salmon


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

If we weren't in the Pacific Northwest and right on the Sound then my fish would be coming from our local outdoor store. They have a bait freezer with at least 2/4 of the fish that you like to feed. Check some of those and see where they get them. Unfortunately, ours gets theirs from the Sound...


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

I haven't found reasonably priced oily fish so I don't worry about it.

If I come across it, I'll feed it.


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## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

I'm about 3 hours in from the coast otherwise would not be a problem. The bait they use around here to fish lakes are shads.
Charlie and his family have a beach house and we use to go down two weekends out the month but haven't been lately at all...too much going on. Can't even recall the last time we went right now...sad. I haven't even thought about it...good idea, thanks.

Like to find something other than the can to feed in the mean time. By what Nikie stated above imported from Vietnam might be ok.


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## BearMurphy (Feb 29, 2012)

i haven't sought fish out either but if came across them I would feed whole sardines or anchovies. i like the idea of younger, smaller fish because they theoretically have less toxins

I think you have to go with your comfort level. would you eat fish from vietnam (if you like fish and it was a species that you would feed)? if not then maybe you shouldn't feed it to your dog either if you have a reason not to eat them

If you look for other sources, I would stick to human grade fish because not all bait store fish is handled well, unless you speak to the owner about the source. I've seen some pretty rotten frozen fish sold, but maybe that's just one store near me...


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

I hardly give any fish at all anymore but 90% of my meat is grass fed so there is their omega's right there.


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## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

Well, that's the thing...90% percent of the meat I feed is not grass fed...working on acquiring those sources. 

Good point...no, I would not eat fish from Vietnam and that's why I haven't purchased any for Yogi. I only buy USA...there's my dilemma.


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## kathylcsw (Jul 31, 2011)

I have been feeding mine stream caught trout. I got about 5 lbs from one of my CL scores. Since I am on the east coast trout is ok to feed and my dogs like it. Once I finish that I will have to use Asian mackeral or sardines.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

frogdog said:


> I am unable to find any type of fish other than can or salmon fillets. A local Asian market carries whole mackerel, sardines and anchovies...problem...they're all imported from Vietnam. In my situation...what would you do?


i have bought fish from vietnam....freeze for a month and feed.

the waste in their water is no worse than the waste in ours.


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## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

I was waiting and hoping for your reply:thumb:!


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## Roo (Oct 17, 2010)

Recently I was reading about raw fish and food poisoning like Scombroid and Ciguatera, I'm curious how common the risk with these might be for dogs? I read some raw feeders prefer to feed all their raw fish frozen because of Scombroid. I 've fed only raw tilapia (farmed I'm sure) and canned mackerel as those are the least expensive fish sources I can find right now, besides lake fishing. I haven't had any issues, but was still wondering what other raw feeders thoughts are on this. . .


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## Chocx2 (Nov 16, 2009)

The sardines I get are for human consumption at my local fish market. They are from Portugal don't know if they are any better than any other country?

But I forgot Trout is in season here, I think I'll go fishing. Doesn't Trout have worms? Would that just be more protein?


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

dogs can actually live without ever having fish, as long as we give them additional omega threes in one form or another.

since i live in the pacific northwest, i don't feed salmon or trout or any salmonid...

i probably would not feed fish from the phillipines due to the medical waste, but i believe vietnam is okay. it'd better be, since the fish i eat is probably the same as the fish sold...when i eat in my vietnamese restaurants...and i've lived to tell about it.

i would think portugal would be fine, since they are a fishing country.

i've been getting our sardines from monterrey, ca because of our co op...but lest anyone thinks that is awesome wonderful, keep in mind there are oil rigs on the coast of cali..

as to farmed fish, i don't feed it...the nutrients are simply not there...or let me say not there enough for me to waste what little nutrition real estate i have with my dogs who together, eat under a pound a day...if that makes sense.


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## _unoriginal (Apr 8, 2012)

I've been looking for a thread like this.. I have 10# of Lake Michigan-caught salmon that's been frozen since mid-March. I also have about 5# of Pacific Saury that's been in my freezer since the end of February. I didn't freeze it because I was worried about illnesses, I froze because I wasn't ready to feed it. I'd read that feeding fish frozen is a good idea because some dogs just take a bit to get used to the smell/taste and it's easier to feed it frozen. Who knows. 

I've read a lot about the Saury because I worried about it after I bought it. Everything that I've read says they're low mercury and sold for use in sushi. I'm comfortable feeding it unless someone has something to add about my 2 kinds of fish...


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

here's how i figure. most important to me is the level of omega three to counterbalance sixes and nines.

Omega-3 Fatty Acids Content of Fish and Seafood | The Paleo Diet

scroll down and you'll see what has what....

you never have to feed fish or if you have the real estate, you can feed whatever you've got.

it's not that you can never feed a dog a fish that is higher in heavy metals than others...but i would make sure said dog weighs 200 lbs not 10 lbs....see, it's all relative.

for me, the safest fish i can feed that has higher values of omega threes are sardines, herring, anchovies, and mackerel.....not in a can, but fresh frozen.

i feed frozen because that's the only way they will eat it. 

if they did not want to eat fish at all, i'd take it off the menu because i feed fish oil made from the same fish that i'm feeding. 

salmon, whilst it is the kind of omega threes is just not something i'm going to risk..and most atlantic salmon is now farmed....which doesn't offer much of anything..

i can't speak for saury or lake salmon....if you feed it, it's a protein and why not? especially if you have it


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

Hare-today has whole sardines or herring. The herring is from USA, the sardines from Spain. Each are around $3/lb :-/


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

They also have a few other fishes that are coarse ground.


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

meggels said:


> Hare-today has whole sardines or herring. The herring is from USA, the sardines from Spain. Each are around $3/lb :-/


Ha! I was going to post this exact same info until I just saw your post.

Anyway, the sardines from Hare-Today are pretty awesome...not the cheapest item, but still good-- and better than canned, imo.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Makes me wonder about the sardines I get from the Asian market. They are much cheaper than that, a couple of bucks for three of them.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i think fish is one of those proteins that if fed, should be fresh frozen.....if it's not something affordable, then fish oil with E.....no soy.

but, in all truth, depending on how much food real estate you have, i would rather have tripe over fish any day of the week....

having said that, i don't worry about asian market fish. it tells me the country from where i am getting it....and as long as i'm eating in asian restaurants, i am eating that fish. and i'm still here. 

there are countries, who will not buy our chickens....what does that say about us?


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## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

Re, can you post the link or info of the oil you use...know it's probably somewhere on DFC?

I think, I may feel more comfortable feeding the oil with meals.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

sure...

Buy Carlson Super Omega-3 Gems Fish Oil 1000 mg, softgels & More | drugstore.com

i like these because they get their vitamin e, i believe, from Sunflower, not soy...and this particular one from carlson's doesn't have the natural lemon flavour.

i believe it also comes in a liquid....

we take this, too.


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## _unoriginal (Apr 8, 2012)

Is it okay to feed the fish whole? I know people say it's okay but I am told the fish bones are much sharper than regular bones and can cause damage. Are you supposed to gut the fish first?


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i buy sardines, herring and mackerel from vietnam...it had best be okay, because when i eat in my vietnamese restaurants, i am pretty sure that is the fish i eat.

it's fine. feed it.

there are no pristine waters kat.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

_unoriginal said:


> Is it okay to feed the fish whole? I know people say it's okay but I am told the fish bones are much sharper than regular bones and can cause damage. Are you supposed to gut the fish first?


we feed our fish whole. the bones of a raw fish are soft.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

_unoriginal said:


> Is it okay to feed the fish whole? I know people say it's okay but I am told the fish bones are much sharper than regular bones and can cause damage. Are you supposed to gut the fish first?


The sardines and mackerel I get are whole and i feed them whole. 

not sure about something like catfish - the bones in the sardines seem alot smaller. But I bet they would be ok.


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## _unoriginal (Apr 8, 2012)

magicre said:


> we feed our fish whole. the bones of a raw fish are soft.


My mom and brother keep telling me that fish bones are fine and sharper.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

_unoriginal said:


> My mom and brother keep telling me that fish bones are fine and sharper.


I was always told that if I swallowed a fish bone it could poke me in the throat. But like all bones, I'm sure that's in the cooked state, and not the raw state. They really are tiny compared with other bones and i would think would dissolve rapidly in the stomach of a dog.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

catfish can be fed, but usually they are farmed and the nutritional value is not as well defined as sardines, mackerel and herring.

the notion of feeding fish is to give dogs a little extra in omega threes....many of our dogs eat grain fed beef or have chicken as a staple.....so we feed fish oil and/or fish to give them more omega threes because they eating sixes and nines.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

magicre said:


> catfish can be fed, but usually they are farmed and the nutritional value is not as well defined as sardines, mackerel and herring.
> 
> the notion of feeding fish is to give dogs a little extra in omega threes....many of our dogs eat grain fed beef or have chicken as a staple.....so we feed fish oil and/or fish to give them more omega threes because they eating sixes and nines.


yep, I said catfish because that's the fish I eat that you have to be careful of the bones, for people. 

The only fish I have with bones intact are sardines and mackerel - I feed them some cod and white fish but don't count it as oily fish and they aren't whole.

I just don't think i'd hesitate to feed my dogs any fish with the bones in. The bones have to have good stuff!


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## _unoriginal (Apr 8, 2012)

xellil said:


> I was always told that if I swallowed a fish bone it could poke me in the throat. But like all bones, I'm sure that's in the cooked state, and not the raw state. They really are tiny compared with other bones and i would think would dissolve rapidly in the stomach of a dog.


Yea, that's what I was thinking too.. But people say things to you enough and you start to question what you already know..

Magicre- I get fish for free from a friend that fishes and generally throws the smaller (12"-16") fish back but said he'd keep them for me if I wanted them.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

for me, it's all about getting the biggest bang for my food real estate. i have smaller dogs who will gain weight if fed an ounce per day extra.

so i want fish which has the most to offer.

that's my reasoning.

having said that, finances play a role, free plays a role....just know that there are some fish dogs simply don't need. catfish is super rolled in egg and corn meal for us...but not so much for a dog.

free small fish are fine....but look them up to make sure you're getting some omega threes...that is pretty much the reason to feed fish.


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## _unoriginal (Apr 8, 2012)

I meant that these are by no means small fish, they're 12-16" salmons. They're small for what my friend fishes for but they'd be fine for my dog. People feed salmon oil anyway. This is just removing the oil process.. Haha


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

you won't need to gut the fish. my kids eat whole fish, not gutted, head to tail. no issues.

you may not want to feed the entire salmon because of weight, but there is nothing finer than a fish head...all those nutrients.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

magicre said:


> you won't need to gut the fish. my kids eat whole fish, not gutted, head to tail. no issues.
> 
> you may not want to feed the entire salmon because of weight, but there is nothing finer than a fish head...all those nutrients.


If I were buying salmon I would forego the rest of it and feed the heads. They actually had salmon heads at the Asian market but no one could tell me where they came from, so I had to pass them up.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

unless you live in the pacific northwest, chances are they don't come from here.

most likely they are atlantic...although i probably would not buy them either.

fish heads....good stuff for dogs. sometimes you can find halibut heads...huge....tasty and chock full of nutrients.

heads in general have brains. good organ to feed, along with eyes and teeth.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

They have halibut heads also! I didn't know if those were a good fish to feed. I'll get some next time. Hubby can be thoroughly grossed out.


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## Gally (Jan 28, 2012)

I know Salmonids from the Pacific Northwest (where I live) need to be frozen for at least a few weeks to make them safe for consumption but are these the only fish that I need to take this extra precaution with if they are caught locally? I am thinking of introducing fish after turkey since it is more available (cheaper) here than pork. Most of the fish I get will end up being frozen for at least a week anyway but I want to take the right precautions. I can get great deals on herring in particular. 

Out of curiosity does anyone feed any other seafood?


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

xellil said:


> They have halibut heads also! I didn't know if those were a good fish to feed. I'll get some next time. Hubby can be thoroughly grossed out.



WHFoods: Halibut


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

Gally said:


> I know Salmonids from the Pacific Northwest (where I live) need to be frozen for at least a few weeks to make them safe for consumption but are these the only fish that I need to take this extra precaution with if they are caught locally? I am thinking of introducing fish after turkey since it is more available (cheaper) here than pork. Most of the fish I get will end up being frozen for at least a week anyway but I want to take the right precautions. I can get great deals on herring in particular.
> 
> Out of curiosity does anyone feed any other seafood?


i don't. i'm sure others do.

i live in the pacific northwest and i don't feed salmonids....to me, it's just not worth the risk....there are other ways for me to get omega threes into my dogs.....

the controversy is that freezing doesn't always kill that particular parasite and it will kill my dog on the one in a hundred thousand chance either gets it.

so to me, it's just not worth it.

but halibut is a good one, even if it is expensive....i bet if you ask for 'crab food' from your local grocer and then wink and ask for halibut heads....great source for omegas and healthy for the dog.


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## Gally (Jan 28, 2012)

I can get halibut heads and heads from pretty much any type of fish at the asian market, no winking required. Anything I need to know about feeding herring?

I don't really plan on feeding Salmonids unless I get a great deal as they are pretty expensive anyway but I've read about Salmonid Poisoning to know the symptoms and actions to take just in case as I understand it is fairly easily treated if caught early.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

Gally said:


> I can get halibut heads and heads from pretty much any type of fish at the asian market, no winking required. Anything I need to know about feeding herring?
> 
> I don't really plan on feeding Salmonids unless I get a great deal as they are pretty expensive anyway but I've read about Salmonid Poisoning to know the symptoms and actions to take just in case as I understand it is fairly easily treated if caught early.


Salmon Poisoning Disease

i'm sure that what you say is true. i still won't feed salmon.


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