# Premade raw?



## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

:tape::tape::tape:


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

Remind me, how long have you been feeding raw? It sounds like you are overthinking, and trying too hard. Honestly, I have never followed any guidelines or "rules" persay other than going protein by protein and give a dose of fish oil. I have never even weighed anything. I just eyeball it all and keep an eye on the dogs weights. It's possible to make it much harder than what it really is. A lot of people feed premade, but do remember it's commercial, and you have no control of what goes into it, and the real quality they use. 

If I were you, I would go back and start again with chicken, then so on. Go through each protein again, and as far as oils, fish or coconut. (or both) Flaxseed doesn't work for dogs too well. I don't know anyone here who "balances" oils. Most just give salmon oil. I give it, and coconut oil when I have it. No balancing. They don't balance anything in the wild. In fact, in the wild they may go for days without eating at all. The only balance you need comes from protein variety over time. I think you need to drop the book and stop stressing. You are going to make yourself sick. Back to the beginning, protein by protein. Take a deep breath, and all will be fine!


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

naturalfeddogs said:


> Remind me, how long have you been feeding raw? It sounds like you are overthinking, and trying too hard. Honestly, I have never followed any guidelines or "rules" persay other than going protein by protein and give a dose of fish oil. I have never even weighed anything. I just eyeball it all and keep an eye on the dogs weights. It's possible to make it much harder than what it really is. A lot of people feed premade, but do remember it's commercial, and you have no control of what goes into it, and the real quality they use.
> 
> If I were you, I would go back and start again with chicken, then so on. Go through each protein again, and as far as oils, fish or coconut. (or both) Flaxseed doesn't work for dogs too well. I don't know anyone here who "balances" oils. Most just give salmon oil. I give it, and coconut oil when I have it. No balancing. They don't balance anything in the wild. In fact, in the wild they may go for days without eating at all. The only balance you need comes from protein variety over time. I think you need to drop the book and stop stressing. You are going to make yourself sick. Back to the beginning, protein by protein. Take a deep breath, and all will be fine!


:tape::tape::tape:


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## Kassandra (Jun 6, 2012)

naturalfeddogs said:


> No balancing. They don't balance anything in the wild.


I can't get over how much this thought has saved my butt. In the beginning I was stressing out because I thought I needed everything to be in perfect balance. Then I remembered if they were out fending for themselves they would just eat whatever they could, whenever they could. Jenny is right. Drop the book, start from the beginning. No need to stress out over everything being perfect, because nothing is perfect.

EDIT: I didn't see your other post when I was typing mine.

If you think coconut oil makes them itch worse, then that could very well be it. Drop the coconut oil for a while. Drop the flax seeds and any other additive like this. I would start over from the beginning to see what makes it worse and what it a little better. Then you can cut out the things that make it worse, and feed the things that are better. My dog doesn't do too great with coconut oil either, we use strictly salmon oil or plain old fish oil capsules. Charlie has very dry skin most of the time too, but she has environmental allergies which cause it. It could very well be possible that it is an environmental allergy causing it for your dogs, however it sounds like it didn't start until you started feeding raw, in which case I would assume you would just need to give more salmon oil. I have been known to be wrong on occasion


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

If it seems plant based, then I would stop the flax and coconut oils. Being that you have been feeding for seven months, it is very possible it could still be detox going on as well. 

You could also increase the fish oil amounts as well.


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

:tape::tape::tape:


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

You asked for help, and we are trying to help you. I used balance in the wild as an example because you ARE stressing over it. It's really nothing to stress over. You may have actually somewhat answered your own question when you said it seems to worse with anything plant based. I agreed, and suggested you drop those. 

Premade is fine, you are likely to pay way more, not know exactly what of what is in it, and lots have plant based ingredients. 

Maybe someone will tell you something that hasn't been suggested to you yet, or tell you what you WANT to hear. We are trying to help you but.......


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## Kassandra (Jun 6, 2012)

Nana52 said:


> I KNOW they don't balance in the wild, but we're NOT eating in the wild here. We're eating from Wal-Mark and Kroger and MPC as much as I can. I HAVE dropped the coconut oil and everything else EXCEPT fish oil.
> 
> Never mind. It's obvious that you all think I'm just doing it all wrong. I'll see if I can get an answer to my question elsewhere.


Not sure why you are getting so defensive. I personally don't think that there is a wrong way to do it, aside from introducing things too quickly, or only feeding one protein. I am aware we aren't feeding in the wild. I get most of my things from Walmart and small grocery stores, too. That doesn't have anything to do with anything. You didn't say you had dropped those things, and that is why we suggested it. If you don't want our help and are going to get defensive when we suggest things... don't ask...


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

:tape::tape::tape:


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## naturalfeddogs (Jan 6, 2011)

And I gave you thaughts good and bad on premade. You said that book is driving you crazy trying to "balance" oils, and I tried to help you there as well. I think you want someone to tell you premade is going to cure your problem, but no one can tell you that for sure because you don't want advice to even TRY to help you find the problem. 

All I can tell you then, is to give it a try for several months and see if it helps.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

I've never tried the two you mentioned, sorry. I feed Northwest Naturals and Murph does the absolute best on this one. It's high quality and one of the most cost friendly premades on the market. There is a member on here, Marie, who uses Darwins, I'll tell her to chime in


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

:tape::tape::tape:


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

:tape::tape::tape:


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

I have no idea what you typed because you deleted it all. Since I assume you asked about pre made raw, I will give you an opinion anyway. I tried a couple bsgs of Nature's Variety but my dogs didn't care for it. I tried Stella & Chewys and they ate it fine. One problem I have where I live and this product is the freshness, or lack of it. I have gone to a couple stores that sell it and you can hear the ice inside the bag. I was at another store the other day that sells Vital Essentials; same thing. Another thing I found out today about Stella & Chewys is that someone told me the back of the bag says if your dog is over 30 lbs, use it as a topper. She saw it on a bag, there is nothing on their site but by Googling, I found that said on a site that sells it.
I currently feed Darwin's. I cannot say enough good bout it. I get it within three weeks from when it was made. You can only get it direct from them, unless you live near Seattle. It has always arrived frozen solid. It comes in half pound packages, you peel back the top. The food is fresh. It looks nothing like any other pre made raw I've fed. It is expensive but I'm alright with that. I don't drive to a store to buy I, its not freezer burned, its fresh. You can choose the Natural Selections which is grass fed or Zoologics, what I feed, which is "grocery store meat". You can order the introductory package, $14.95. They will require you to set up auto delivery, which you can change any time you want it cancel.
I pay just over $200 for 50lbs (discount if you order 50 lbs or more). So, around $4.00 per pound, including shipping. I use it once a day for one dog and the other gets it every few days.


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## mheath0429 (Sep 8, 2012)

I've fed Oma's with success, Primal with success and BRB with success. 

I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I really don't think the coconut oil is causing the itchiness.


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

InkedMarie said:


> I currently feed Darwin's. I cannot say enough good bout it. I get it within three weeks from when it was made. You can only get it direct from them, unless you live near Seattle. It has always arrived frozen solid. It comes in half pound packages, you peel back the top. The food is fresh. It looks nothing like any other pre made raw I've fed. It is expensive but I'm alright with that. I don't drive to a store to buy I, its not freezer burned, its fresh. You can choose the Natural Selections which is grass fed or Zoologics, what I feed, which is "grocery store meat". You can order the introductory package, $14.95. They will require you to set up auto delivery, which you can change any time you want it cancel. I pay just over $200 for 50lbs (discount if you order 50 lbs or more). So, around $4.00 per pound, including shipping. I use it once a day for one dog and the other gets it every few days.


Darwin's is one of the two I was asking about specifically. What transpired thereafter doesn't need to be discussed. Thank you so very much for your input. I may give the trial package a try, assuming canceling won't be hard to do if it doesn't work. Sometimes auto delivery things are a cinch to start, less cinchy to stop (not talking about dog food here).

Thanks again, really ....


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

mheath0429 said:


> I've fed Oma's with success, Primal with success and BRB with success.
> 
> I'm gonna go out on a limb here, but I really don't think the coconut oil is causing the itchiness.


Primal is the other one of the two I was considering, so I appreciate your input. I think I looked at Oma's a while back, but they didn't ship, or maybe they didn't ship to my specific area. I don't remember. I'll look again. I don't know what BRB is.

I'm not sure about the CO either, I'm just playing process of elimination. Depending on who/where you ask, it's either God's gift or it can extreme inflammatory response due to being plant-based and high in omega 6. In any case, for right now, I'm leaving it out and giving fish oil alternating with frozen anchovies and/or sardines, but I''m about out of the whole fish, so need to regroup.

Thanks for you input, really ....


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## mwplay (Oct 10, 2010)

Nana - I'm not sure where you are located, but you might want to look into Answers Pet Food. At one time, the co-op I belong to in N. CA offered Answers. I tried it for ease, it was ok, but seemed a little fatty to me, and my dogs seemed to gain weight while on it. 

What I liked about Answers is you can get a "Detailed" formula which is considered "complete", or you could get a "Straight" formula which only contained meat/bone/organ. I don't feed veges to my dogs, so it was a good option for me. Others liked it and a breeder I know loved it for her dogs (she had health issues and needed something easy for her dogs/lifestyle). She would use it (Straight) as a base and add things. 

Years ago, when I started feeding raw, I used Primal. It was ok, but I always felt it had a lot of moisture. I moved away from premade because of cost and most have veges and other things added that my dogs don't respond well to.


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## SaharaNight Boxers (Jun 28, 2011)

With what I can see, I feed BRB or Blue Ridge Beef. They're based out of Georgia I believe. I think you're around that area? The beef is hormone free and grass fed. It's the only all meat grind I could find. I am adding in some extra meat to his meals though as I found the grinds to be a bit bonier than what Duke needs and he's on a weight gain diet. 

As far as supplements and balance (I'm guessing that was mixed in) , I honestly find it to be more important. I definitely won't worry about certain oils and everything down to a science, but I am going to add in a kelp and alfalfa blend to cover all the bases, salmon oil, and breed specific-Heartwise by Nature's Farmacy that has a proprietary blend that is similar to The Honest Kitchen's sparkle. The vitamins and minerals are not the same in the soil and meat in animals as what I believe they need to be. I'd rather be giving an extra multi vitamin and mineral, than be missing something important.


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

mwplay said:


> Nana - I'm not sure where you are located, but you might want to look into Answers Pet Food. At one time, the co-op I belong to in N. CA offered Answers. I tried it for ease, it was ok, but seemed a little fatty to me, and my dogs seemed to gain weight while on it.
> 
> What I liked about Answers is you can get a "Detailed" formula which is considered "complete", or you could get a "Straight" formula which only contained meat/bone/organ. I don't feed veges to my dogs, so it was a good option for me. Others liked it and a breeder I know loved it for her dogs (she had health issues and needed something easy for her dogs/lifestyle). She would use it (Straight) as a base and add things.
> 
> Years ago, when I started feeding raw, I used Primal. It was ok, but I always felt it had a lot of moisture. I moved away from premade because of cost and most have veges and other things added that my dogs don't respond well to.


I'm located in Mississippi (the butt end of everything), but I'll look into answers. However, if it's "fatty" it won't work in any case. Due to Kody's history of pancreatitis and liver issues, I keep a pretty close eye on fatty stuff (which I've got to take a closer look at regardless of which premade I decide to try ... if any).

Thanks for you input


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

SaharaNight Boxers said:


> With what I can see, I feed BRB or Blue Ridge Beef. They're based out of Georgia I believe. I think you're around that area? The beef is hormone free and grass fed. It's the only all meat grind I could find. I am adding in some extra meat to his meals though as I found the grinds to be a bit bonier than what Duke needs and he's on a weight gain diet.
> 
> As far as supplements and balance (I'm guessing that was mixed in) , I honestly find it to be more important. I definitely won't worry about certain oils and everything down to a science, but I am going to add in a kelp and alfalfa blend to cover all the bases, salmon oil, and breed specific-Heartwise by Nature's Farmacy that has a proprietary blend that is similar to The Honest Kitchen's sparkle. The vitamins and minerals are not the same in the soil and meat in animals as what I believe they need to be. I'd rather be giving an extra multi vitamin and mineral, than be missing something important.


Atlanta, huh? That's close enough that shipping might not be so crippling. I'll give it a look see. I agree with the vitamins/minerals in the soil/meat scenario. I don't want to do a multivitamin type thing, for fear of over supplementing, but I think some things are definitely deficient. Just working on figuring out the what.

Thanks, again. I'll see what I can find out about BRB. (Rats .... BRB doesn't do Mississippi. Oh, well, thanks all the same)


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## Boxers&Pom's Mom (Jan 17, 2011)

When I started feeding my dogs raw over two years ago, I was very concern about everything. Now, I am also go by eye and make sure they get different kind of proteins, bones and organs. Also, get them fish one or two time a month. I have some providers, but I am also buy in the supermarket and the fish in the oriental market. I am also go by weight. If the dogs start getting heavy, give them less until they are back on shape. I do have a provider that sell me rabbit ground with bone and organs and another one that I get 5 lbs rolls with ground beef, green tripe and some bone on it. I been very lucky getting free Venison in Craiglist. So, I can not complain. I am very happy with the results.


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## mwplay (Oct 10, 2010)

Nana52 said:


> I'm located in Mississippi (the butt end of everything), but I'll look into answers. However, if it's "fatty" it won't work in any case. Due to Kody's history of pancreatitis and liver issues, I keep a pretty close eye on fatty stuff (which I've got to take a closer look at regardless of which premade I decide to try ... if any).
> 
> Thanks for you input


Sorry, didn't know about that... Then, I would not recommend this for you. The main reason I stopped using Answers was because one of my dogs who normally ate everything, walked away mid meal from the pork straight formula. When I tried feeding it again, he wouldn't touch it. Bottomline, something happened at that point and now he cannot eat really fatty food without having a vomiting issue 8 hours later, of course always in the middle of the night. At first, I thought it was pork, but he was able to eat pork before that incident, and I can feed it now, but it has to be on the lean side (I do lots of heart and lean stew meat for him). Now, I make his food and keep it on the lean side. 

The other 3 ate it fine, but gained a lot of weight, even when I was feeding only 1.25% of body weight/day. They were gaining weight, but eating so little that they acted like they were starving and would start digging in the backyard, coming in with dirt in their mouths.

Again, not knocking the food in general as others really liked it, it just didn't work for all of my guys.


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## InkedMarie (Sep 9, 2011)

Nana52 said:


> Darwin's is one of the two I was asking about specifically. What transpired thereafter doesn't need to be discussed. Thank you so very much for your input. I may give the trial package a try, assuming canceling won't be hard to do if it doesn't work. Sometimes auto delivery things are a cinch to start, less cinchy to stop (not talking about dog food here).
> 
> Thanks again, really ....


Nope, canceling with them is easy. Call the toll free number. They are exceedingly helpful to deal with, some of the best customer service I've encountered.


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## Nana52 (Apr 28, 2012)

InkedMarie said:


> Nope, canceling with them is easy. Call the toll free number. They are exceedingly helpful to deal with, some of the best customer service I've encountered.


That's good to hear. Thanks again. Happy New Year arty:


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