# Anyone fast their dogs?



## PUNKem733 (Jun 12, 2009)

I do about once a week, I make sure he eats nothing for 1 day at least, I think limiting caloric intake can extend the life of our guys. My boy Shaggy is about 14, and a bundle of energy, that loves playing with much younger dogs for hours at a time. I have a king size bed that is easily 3 feet off the ground, and he can jump up on it no problem.:biggrin:


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## sirilucky (Mar 12, 2009)

Fasting is beneficial to anyone, dog or human, if done intelligently!! It gives your system a chance to clear itself out of toxins that are build up due to the so-called nutrients we take in daily. I fast my dogs one day a week, every week and I do the same thing with me as well.
Like I said, intelligence is the name of the game when it comes to these topics!! Hope I helped!!

ADD: Ops, how does the dog eat more than what I put in his bowl the day after a fast is beyond me and defies all logic.
As far as metabolism slowing down, well, that is the reason I inserted the word "intelligence" in there. I could go on a long and complicated discource on the functions of metabolism here, but, what is the use, who would listen and understand?


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

Never saw a logical reason to. I don't buy the toxins story. Thats what kidneys and liver are for.


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## BabyHusky (Jul 21, 2008)

honestly...i've never heard of fasting dogs haha. I know people do it because we tend to eat things that are not good for us and overall, its good to detox now and then but I don't think dogs necessarily need it. *shrug* but thats just me.


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

I certainly can see people wanting to fast their dogs if they are feeding them a species inappropriate diet like you see in so many kibbles.


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## PUNKem733 (Jun 12, 2009)

It works for my guy, so I'll keep it up. I just started him on orijen 6 fish, mixing it with his Evo red, and tripett, and evo 95%. I'm even thinking of fasting him one day a week, plus another day just giving him meaty bones only. SO 4 days normal meals, one day bones only, one day fasting.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

sirilucky said:


> Fasting is beneficial to anyone, dog or human, if done intelligently!! It gives your system a chance to clear itself out of toxins that are build up due to the so-called nutrients we take in daily. I fast my dogs one day a week, every week and I do the same thing with me as well.
> Like I said, intelligence is the name of the game when it comes to these topics!! Hope I helped!!
> 
> ADD: Ops, how does the dog eat more than what I put in his bowl the day after a fast is beyond me and defies all logic.
> As far as metabolism slowing down, well, that is the reason I inserted the word "intelligence" in there. I could go on a long and complicated discource on the functions of metabolism here, but, what is the use, who would listen and understand?


You should go into detail 

Might be surprised what people on here are able to understand. I would for sure listen and understand, but might help others out as well...



RawFedDogs said:


> Never saw a logical reason to. I don't buy the toxins story. Thats what kidneys and liver are for.


+1

Never understood why people believe the whole fasting thing about themselves and apparently their dogs. Or the "cleansing diets" I don't understand either. Never seen any research done on them...anyone have input?

Like RFD said...cleansing the body of "toxins" is the function of the liver and kidneys...so why try and cleanse the body more?


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## rannmiller (Jun 27, 2008)

I fasted my dogs yesterday when I found out that my bf had been feeding them twice as much as they normally get when I was out of town 

No wonder they seemed so bummed when I came home to spoil fun! I thought they'd just gotten a bit chubbier because he hadn't been running them every morning like I do, but then he let it slip that he'd been feeding them their normal amount twice a day because he thought that's what I did. Silly silly!

So I figured they could go a day without food yesterday and only a small meal of fish today. Then back to their normal feeding schedule after that. I only fast them or cut back their food if they get a bigger meal/overeat.


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## wags (Jan 31, 2009)

I have heard of humans fasting but never dogs or any other animals for that matter. I don't see any reason to have my dogs, guinea pigs, fish, lizard, snake, hamsters well you get the picture any animal fast! Don't see any reason to at all!:frown:


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## Guest (Sep 4, 2009)

It would of course be highly inappropriate to fast a working dog and / or a high-energy sporting dog. They need the fuel.

I fast once each year on Yom Kippur. No harm done.


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## PUNKem733 (Jun 12, 2009)

LabbieMama said:


> It would of course be highly inappropriate to fast a working dog and / or a high-energy sporting dog. They need the fuel.
> 
> I fast once each year on Yom Kippur. No harm done.



That I can agree with.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

LabbieMama said:


> It would of course be highly inappropriate to fast a working dog and / or a high-energy sporting dog. They need the fuel.
> 
> I fast once each year on Yom Kippur. No harm done.


Careful. People with working gun dogs know better, fasting depends on the diet.

Do I have to fast my dog the day before a hunt? No. I free feed and she eats when hungry, but it is not that, it is the composition of the feed. It depends on the ingredients in the feed and the amount of expansion taking place from fiber.

Do raw feeders that hunt their dogs have to fast the dog before a hunt? This would include commercially store purchased meat part and organs whole prey model. Answer is no. There is no expansion type fiber. There is fiber from bone and tissue, but that is all good. What is not good are potentially dangerous expansion type fibers.

Do kibble feeders have to fast their working gun dogs the day before a hunt or at least a preset number of hours to fast their dogs before and after the hunt? The answer is yes, and this is considered fairly common knowledge I would hope.

The reason is bloat and it can kill your dog. Without getting into the promotional data science about what causes bloat and how to avoid it, just trust at least this much; expansion of the food does take in the dogs stomach and you have to be very weary of that when it comes to exercising any medium size dog whether it be sporting breed or not. Probably the biggest offender and ingredient to be most concerned about in kibble diets is beet pulp, followed up by tomato pomace. Now if you listen to some folks, the backers of omnivore nutrition, at some of the popular websites, the very diets recommended people put a lot of trust in contain the very ingredients to be concerned about when it comes to bloat and expansion type fibers. Kibble/Water/Exercise can be a dangerous combination for certain breeds, and that goes for the sporting breeds as well.


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## PUNKem733 (Jun 12, 2009)

Well this is something new to me. I have had all kinds of hyper, play-all-day dogs that weren't fasted, and I never saw any ill effects.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

claybuster said:


> The reason is bloat and it can kill your dog.


It's nice to see that someone has found a cause for bloat. ALL the scientific data I've seen has failed to find a cause with one exception. That was a flawed study from the University of Perdue several years ago. Other than that flawed study, nothing has ever been indicated to cause bloat. In many studies, they tried to induce bloat without success.

Of course I don't buy Abady's promotional material either.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

RawFedDogs said:


> It's nice to see that someone has found a cause for bloat. ALL the scientific data I've seen has failed to find a cause with one exception. That was a flawed study from the University of Perdue several years ago. Other than that flawed study, nothing has ever been indicated to cause bloat. In many studies, they tried to induce bloat without success.
> 
> Of course I don't buy Abady's promotional material either.




Yes, of course, all the scientific data from the industry (and industry connected studies) want you to believe bloat is a *complete mystery*. However, there is no bloat in the wild animals eating natures diet but it has nothing to do with industries cheap omnivore diets.....whatever you do, DON'T BLAME THE FOOD.

Yes RFD, you were first to mention the used car salesmen line, I do remember.
If you shoe fits you must wear it as in this case again. You fall for the industry propaganda each and every time. I thought you were much smarter than that.


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## Guest (Sep 5, 2009)

claybuster said:


> Careful. People with working gun dogs know better, fasting depends on the diet..... Probably the biggest offender and ingredient to be most concerned about in kibble diets is beet pulp, followed up by tomato pomace...... Kibble/Water/Exercise can be a dangerous combination for certain breeds, and that goes for the sporting breeds as well.


I'm still trying to learn what exactly causes bloat, seeing that I have an 80 pound Lab. Some studies mention waiting 20 minutes after your dog has eaten before exercising it. Well, my dog doesn't wait 20 minutes after eating and he seems OK. I've read that citric acid (used as a preservative in some kibble brands) can cause bloat if the kibble is pre-moistened prior to eating. I don't know much about bloat, period. I just think it's not appropriate to fast a working dog (i.e., guide dog for the blind) or a dog with a very high energy level that burns off all the calories real quickly.


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## CorgiPaws (Mar 31, 2009)

claybuster said:


> You fall for the industry propaganda each and every time.


It's common knowledge that RFD is a prey model raw feeder, and that "industry" doesn't exist, therefore nor does the propaganda. The only one pushing promotional material here is you. 

I see absolutely no reason to fast my boys. Champ is two and a half and VERY high energy. Going to daycare all day most days (I work there) he plays incredibly hard and burns calories like mad.
As for Max, he's an old man. His meal is one of his few simple joys left. lol
And Grissom, not even being a year old, I wouldn't fast. He's still growing. No reason to fast a puppy.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

claybuster said:


> However, there is no bloat in the wild animals eating natures diet but it has nothing to do with industries cheap omnivore diets.....whatever you do, DON'T BLAME THE FOOD.


I know dogs on a prey model raw diet who bloated. Being an owner of Great Danes who are 45 times more likely to bloat than the second leading breed (Akitas), I am very familiar with it.

It seems that stress is the most likely component in bloating and I believe that whole heartedly. Diet plays very little part.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

CorgiPaws said:


> It's common knowledge that RFD is a prey model raw feeder, and that "industry" doesn't exist, therefore nor does the propaganda. The only one pushing promotional material here is you.



That is not what I meant. Despite feeding raw, all the omnivore kibble propaganda coming from the big names in the business seem to make a whole lot of sense to RFD. Bloat is a mystery, don't blame the food. Could be genetics, citric acid, gulping air, try lowering or raising the food bowl, but it is not the kibble. HD is genetics, don't blame the food. Starting to wonder if kibble causes dogs any problems at all? Must be the luck of the draw when in comes to certain issues I suppose.

Profitable omnivore diets will be protected by the industry scientific studies.
The food causes no problems to the animals, and that is exactly what the industry wants you to believe. Don't blame the food.


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

Claybuster, are you seriously going to pollute every thread on this board with your Abady propaganda? It's getting old


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

jdatwood said:


> Claybuster, are you seriously going to pollute every thread on this board with your Abady propaganda? It's getting old


I think you're paranoid. Please indicate where I mentioned what I feed? You can't because I never mentioned Abady science and research. If it is not industry propaganda relating to the benefits of kibble, you folks are not interested. The last thing you want to hear about is science and research
that industry diets are unhealthy for your pets. All the problems that affect our dogs have nothing to do with cheap industry omnivore kibble diets. Apparently that is the way everyone feels including raw feeders. Why even bother to feed raw diets if the cheap kibble diets don't having ill affects on our pets?

I wonder if some moderators could run some IP checks on different users here on this board. I'm sure they will discover folks using mulitple user names.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

RawFedDogs said:


> It seems that stress is the most likely component in bloating and I believe that whole heartedly. Diet plays very little part.


Comical. Poor dogs with so much stress. It has nothing to do with diet....lol.


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## jdatwood (Apr 13, 2009)

claybuster said:


> If it is not industry propaganda relating to the benefits of kibble, you folks are not interested.


Obviously you don't listen. I don't care about kibble. I feed RAW meat, bones, and organs.



claybuster said:


> The last thing you want to hear about is science and research
> that industry diets are unhealthy for your pets. All the problems that affect our dogs have nothing to do with cheap industry omnivore kibble diets.


I'd LOVE to hear some science. You've yet to bring any to the table though. All you have is your conspiracy theory



claybuster said:


> Why even bother to feed raw diets if the cheap kibble diets don't having ill affects on our pets?


I feed RAW because I KNOW kibble has an adverse effect on our pets. So many health issues ARE caused by the poor diet most people are feeding their pets. (did you hear that? I just agreed with you...)

What I don't agree with is that genetically proven issues are entirely food related.



claybuster said:


> I wonder if some moderators could run some IP checks on different users here on this board. I'm sure they will discover folks using mulitple user names.


Make all the false accusations you want. I have nothing to hide. My name is Jon, I live in Denver, Colorado with my beautiful girlfriend Natalie and our 4 dogs (2 great danes, 1 wolf, and 1 mutt) and our 3lb kitten
Visit me on Facebook :wink:


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

claybuster said:


> I wonder if some moderators could run some IP checks on different users here on this board. I'm sure they will discover folks using mulitple user names.


You would be most definitely wrong here. I personally know that they are 2 completely different people. The reason: jdatwood is my bf and is sitting right next to me :biggrin:

I know for sure that they are different people because I have been on this forum longer than we have been together, and I was the one who introduced him here.

I think if anyone is paranoid its you LOL



claybuster said:


> Comical. Poor dogs with so much stress. It has nothing to do with diet....lol.


I went to a seminar for GVD and then had to write a secondary research paper on it. There is no definite cause of GVD. Stressful situations are just as likely to cause it as food. The seminar was a presentation on a 5 year study done on GVD with all types of variables (food, treats, stress, exercise, etc.) and none were conclusive. This study was based on case studies on individual dogs of all walks of life, nationwide, and of all breeds. There were even cats thrown into the mix...yes cats are at risk (fairly low). The only thing that was supported was the breed types that are more prone to it (ie deep chested dogs such as Danes). Unfortunately since this was a lecture based presentation of this study I don't have the files on my computer...I would post them up if I did, and I can't find them in the databases at school anymore :frown:


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

claybuster said:


> I wonder if some moderators could run some IP checks on different users here on this board. I'm sure they will discover folks using mulitple user names.


Yes, I think that is possible by regular users. Move your curser over the little computer monitor icon at the bottom of the left column and hold it there a few seconds. The ip address of that poster should appear. If there is no computer monitor icon there, then only moderators can do that. Let me know.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

jdatwood said:


> Obviously you don't listen. I don't care about kibble. I feed RAW meat, bones, and organs.:


I feed Raw as well Jon, I just don't purchase raw. They don't get the breast meat, only the by-products. 


















Hen Pheasant, lower left. She loves holding down birds…such a good girl. Next month starts bird season! 









Ithaca SKB 20G. SKT/SKT



> Jon: I'd LOVE to hear some science. You've yet to bring any to the table though. All you have is your conspiracy theory


Yes, the theory is kibble diets are the worst diets to feed your pets. Don’t believe in industry propaganda and skewed studies.



> Jon: I feed RAW because I KNOW kibble has an adverse effect on our pets. So many health issues ARE caused by the poor diet most people are feeding their pets. (did you hear that? I just agreed with you...)
> 
> What I don't agree with is that genetically proven issues are entirely food related.


Jon, the industry does have interests to protect, that would be a profit and a responsibility to the stock holders. If you can connect kibble diets to many of the problems affecting dogs they have a big problem. 



> Jon: Make all the false accusations you want. I have nothing to hide. My name is Jon, I live in Denver, Colorado with my beautiful girlfriend Natalie and our 4 dogs (2 great danes, 1 wolf, and 1 mutt) and our 3lb kitten


Glad to hear you have a girlfriend. I am married 17 years, and two beautiful daughters. I was starting to wonder maybe you were gay or something the way seem to like to troll me around… Not that it would be a problem...I don't need the liberal thought police out there accusing me of being insennnnnsitive.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

RawFedDogs said:


> Yes, I think that is possible by regular users. Move your curser over the little computer monitor icon at the bottom of the left column and hold it there a few seconds. The ip address of that poster should appear. If there is no computer monitor icon there, then only moderators can do that. Let me know.


Thanks RFD, I was starting to think you recruited your mom to help you crucify me for my feed of choice. PS. Pheasant by-product meal mixes nice with the Basic Granular!


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

claybuster said:


> Thanks RFD, I was starting to think you recruited your mom to help you crucify me for my feed of choice. PS. Pheasant by-product meal mixes nice with the Basic Granular!


Well you gotta get your stories straight. In the post above you stated you feed raw by-products. Now you are stating that you feed granular. Granular is not raw. It is unextruded kibble.

I don't need my mother to help crucify you. I have the power to ban you for a day or a week or a month or forever so I don't need anyone's help. :smile:

*ETA*: I wouldn't crucify you for your food choice. I WILL crucify you for your endless pasting of a kibble company's marketing material.


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## claybuster (Dec 18, 2008)

RawFedDogs said:


> Well you gotta get your stories straight. In the post above you stated you feed raw by-products. Now you are stating that you feed granular. Granular is not raw. It is unextruded kibble.


I stated the raw pheasant by-products mix well with Granular.



> I don't need my mother to help crucify you. I have the power to ban you for a day or a week or a month or forever so I don't need anyone's help. :smile:


I've been thrown out of worse places than this.



> *ETA*: I wouldn't crucify you for your food choice. I WILL crucify you for your endless pasting of a kibble company's marketing material.


Yes, they started selling raw in '72, Granular in '88, and Kibble a few years ago. They are really just a canned food company just like ALPO.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

[I went to a seminar for GVD and then had to write a secondary research paper on it. There is no definite cause of GVD. Stressful situations are just as likely to cause it as food. The seminar was a presentation on a 5 year study done on GVD with all types of variables (food, treats, stress, exercise, etc.) and none were conclusive. This study was based on case studies on individual dogs of all walks of life, nationwide, and of all breeds. There were even cats thrown into the mix...yes cats are at risk (fairly low). The only thing that was supported was the breed types that are more prone to it (ie deep chested dogs such as Danes). Unfortunately since this was a lecture based presentation of this study I don't have the files on my computer...I would post them up if I did, and I can't find them in the databases at school anymore :frown:[/QUOTE]

I lost two chows to bloat and in the last case the best vets at the College of Vet Medicine could not determine why the dog bloated, even after a necropsy. It is something that Chows are prone to, irregardless of what you feed them. All my chows have been picky eaters whereas my Lab ate everything in sight and she never developed a bloat problem. I think a lot of it is genetics and body shape, more then food issues.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

chowder said:


> I lost two chows to bloat and in the last case the best vets at the College of Vet Medicine could not determine why the dog bloated, even after a necropsy. It is something that Chows are prone to, irregardless of what you feed them. All my chows have been picky eaters whereas my Lab ate everything in sight and she never developed a bloat problem. I think a lot of it is genetics and body shape, more then food issues.



I'm sorry to hear that. I really hope that I don't ever lose a Dane to bloat. They are one of the most prone dogs to GVD. There definitely is a genetic link, but its more on just morphology. Its not an hereditary disease that is passed on to offspring like hip dysplasia. 

There really is not a definite cause for GVD. Its been reported that dogs just given a treat, 1 treat, after exercising and they still bloated. Or reports show just plain old water was the culprit for some cases. Some people believe that it is just the food exclusively...but what about the dogs that bloat when they have only water?

Vets and people do suggest that it is best to not feed a dog before exercising but there have been countless times that dogs have gone out and exercised after eating that never bloated. 

GVD is just one of those things that has no explicit explanation for it. Some dogs get it and some don't. Not every Dane or other prone dog get it, even if they are fed an omnivore diet and exercised. Some of the Danes that I know have bloated numerous times for different reasons (luckily she was able to save him 3 times in a row...don't know why she never got a pexy done to help prevent it).

The only way to help prevent GVD is to have a gastropexy done on the dog (surgical procedure where they tack the stomach to the body wall so it cannot flip and cause it to bloat). There are numerous procedures how this is done, some are better than others, but are more expensive. Some dogs that have a gastropexy done will still have the off chance of bloating if the pexy failed (ie became detached from the body wall for some reason, injury, overextension, etc).


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

After I lost the first dog I read all I could on the subject and have even heard of dogs bloating from being given ice water on a really hot day. I do think its a morphology situation since you rarely see it in small dogs and long bodied dogs. My dogs all free feed themselves but I do make sure they don't get a lot of food followed by a lot of water, just to be on the safe side. I don't have to worry about too much exercise with a chow, the trick is to actually get them off the couch and moving! Both of mine that I lost happened during the night when they were sleeping so exercise was not a factor anyway. I've become rather paranoid about it now and never let Rocky have more then his allotted amount of food at one time. Since he is mixed with husky he doesn't have the real typical Chow short stubby body so I'm hoping he has a better chance of avoiding any bloat problems in the future. 

I have heard of suturing the stomach in place to prevent future bloats and if I had a dog that survived one, I would definetly look into having that done. It is certainly not cheap to get them thru a case of bloat and not easy on the dog, either.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Have you considered having the pexy done just to be safe?

In my opinion, prevention is much easier, cheaper and healthier than treatment. That goes for just about anything...vaccines, heartworm, bloat, etc.


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