# Still no weight gain.



## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

Alright i was on here about a month ago with questions on dog food because my dog was having major tummy problems. I switched to evo with both my boxers and they are doing great on it. I guess i have two questions but i will start with my year and a half old boxer. He has been on evo for a month and a half and he weighs 50 pounds right now. His ideal weight is just under 60, the hills food the vet had him on for a month really took its toll on him. I was up to 6 cups a day on it and he still lost weight. Now that hes on evo he is sustaining weight but not gaining weight back. The recomended ammount for me to feed him is a little over one cup and i have now moved up to one and a half cups and still no weight gain. Whats up with this, he is having solid poops finally and has never had solid poops before so that is amazing that evo could do that but with as many calories as evo has he should be gaining a little weight. I will add he is extremely active and goes non stop but i dont want to feed him more than a cup and a half of evo because he starts to have tummy problems on it with anything more than 1.5 cups. Should i just keep waiting or should i do something else?

My next question is about my six month old boxer. He is currently on evo and it is working great for him as well. I have concerns about feeding him evo because i have read and been told that feeding protein and fat at that high of levels can cause puppys to grow excessively fast and cause major bone problems. Evo claims it is safe for puppies though, so am i doing the right thing or should i switch him over to someting else?


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

I guess i should also add that it is the evo red meat that they are both on right now.


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

before switching to raw i used to feed my dog EVO as well. she weighed about 65 pounds at that time. being that she is EXTREMELY active, i was feeding her about 4 cups per day. If that much makes your dogs stomach upset, maybe consider adding some fresh meat of your own to the kibble? Raw meat is excellent on the stomach for it digests very quickly. if your not the prey model raw type of person, maybe consider starting with a quarter pound of raw ground meat in addition to the kibble. still no weight gain... try half a pound and so on. Fresh raw meat should be easy on his system in addition to the regular amount of EVO. 1 Cup per day for a very active 50 pound dog just isn't always enough. he's burning more calories than he's consuming.


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

Im sorry i wasnt really thinking. I feed the 1.5 cups per meal not per day. So he is getting 3 cups per day.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

Do you have any photos? boxers are naturally lean and muscular, some are more so the others. The other day I was at a dog park and there was a boxer that looked a bit like a bodybuilder, you could see every muscle on his body and even some veins popping up, you could also see the last 3 ribcage bones, but he looked very athetic to me and not too thin. 

But if you feel like he needs to put one some more weight, can you increase the ammount? and you say that you give 1 cup, is that 1 cup total a day? or 1 cup -twice a day? if you give just 1 cup a day, definitely go up to 2 cups. 

and I checked the Red meat formula and its ok calcium wise since its under 2.5%


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

I see that you already replied to it, 3 cups seems like a decent ammount, but you can probably still go up if your dog eats it. You can also add some cooked ground beef since its a bit higher in fat.


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

Unosmom said:


> I see that you already replied to it, 3 cups seems like a decent ammount, but you can probably still go up if your dog eats it. You can also add some cooked ground beef since its a bit higher in fat.


yea, i'd still try to add some fresh ground meat, atthough id probably feed it raw. raw meat digests very quickly and is generally easy on the digestive system. since ur dog seems to have a sensitive tummy, raw meat may be easier on him.


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

Unosmom said:


> Do you have any photos? boxers are naturally lean and muscular, some are more so the others. The other day I was at a dog park and there was a boxer that looked a bit like a bodybuilder, you could see every muscle on his body and even some veins popping up, you could also see the last 3 ribcage bones, but he looked very athetic to me and not too thin.
> 
> But if you feel like he needs to put one some more weight, can you increase the ammount? and you say that you give 1 cup, is that 1 cup total a day? or 1 cup -twice a day? if you give just 1 cup a day, definitely go up to 2 cups.
> 
> and I checked the Red meat formula and its ok calcium wise since its under 2.5%


I would love to put up some photos i just dont know how to shrink them to size so i can put them on the site. He is definately underweight you can see all of his ribs and all of his spine and his hips and shoulders stick way out. He was very healthy at 58 pounds. His ribs were still visible but his spine was for the most part covered and his shoulders were completely covered and his hips were just barely visible. He is pretty small for a boxer but he is the most athletic boxer i have seen, he is very similar to the boxer you were describing earlier but just a lot skinier.


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

i would have my dogs on a prey model diet but my gf is completly against feeding raw foods. There is no getting through to her after i started and we went to the vet and the vet chewed me out for a half hour that i was going to kill my dogs and that dogs cant handle that kind of food. I know the vet is retarded but try telling that to my gf and it turns to a big fight. It was hard enough talking her into feeding evo, she wanted to feed science diet bc thats what the vet said. So raw is out and cooking ground beef is out bc my gf feeds the dogs half the time and i know she isnt going to cook up the beef. Is there any easy supplement to sprinkle over the food or any other really easy way to put some more weight on him?


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

notilloc said:


> i would have my dogs on a prey model diet but my gf is completly against feeding raw foods. There is no getting through to her after i started and we went to the vet and the vet chewed me out for a half hour that i was going to kill my dogs and that dogs cant handle that kind of food. I know the vet is retarded but try telling that to my gf and it turns to a big fight. It was hard enough talking her into feeding evo, she wanted to feed science diet bc thats what the vet said. So raw is out and cooking ground beef is out bc my gf feeds the dogs half the time and i know she isnt going to cook up the beef. Is there any easy supplement to sprinkle over the food or any other really easy way to put some more weight on him?


i haven't ever tried any weight gain supplements on my dog, but there is such a thing. here are some links to several products;

MVP Weight Gainer,Rottweiler Supplements,Dog Vitamins - eBay (item 190321417815 end time Mar-10-10 14:08:10 PST)

High Calorie Weight Gain Supplement For Dogs - Pet Supplies - Compare Prices, Reviews and Buy at NexTag - Price - Review


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## Ania's Mommy (Feb 8, 2009)

Todd said:


> maybe consider adding some fresh meat of your own to the kibble? Raw meat is excellent on the stomach for it digests very quickly.


I just wanted to point out that this is not a good idea. Todd is correct in saying that raw meat digests very quickly. However, kibble does not. When you combine the two, the entire process is slowed down to kibble-speed. 

One of the reasons dogs can eat raw meat is BECAUSE they can digest it very quickly. When meat digestion is slowed down due to kibble, the meat will remain in the body longer then it should and actually CAUSE digestive upset.

If a person wanted to feed raw meat AND kibble, they should only do so seperately and 8 or so hours apart.

I know that the OP said that feeding human meat at all was not an option for him. But I wanted to clarify this point in case someone else were to stumble accross this thread and follow this advise. :wink:

As far as the original question, you said that feeding more than 1.5 C caused your dog tummy problems. Maybe you could up the feeding times/day to three or even four. Is that a possibility for you?

Richelle


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## Jodysmom (Jan 9, 2010)

Your situation sounds very similar to mine. I know you girlfriend doesn't want you to feed raw food and I was reluctant but I finally had too. I just don't think my dog is able to process dog kibble (my vet tried to get me to switch to Iams..said EVO was too rich). I posted a long response but was hesitant to send it because I didn't want to sound like I was pushing raw food..it was the only thing that worked for us(she gained 10 lbs.). I hope some other people can give you some good advice.


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

Ania's Mommy said:


> I just wanted to point out that this is not a good idea. Todd is correct in saying that raw meat digests very quickly. However, kibble does not. When you combine the two, the entire process is slowed down to kibble-speed.
> 
> One of the reasons dogs can eat raw meat is BECAUSE they can digest it very quickly. When meat digestion is slowed down due to kibble, the meat will remain in the body longer then it should and actually CAUSE digestive upset.
> 
> ...


Good catch. Raw meat and kibble do digest at different rates, however it should be just fins if you gave kibble in the morning and the meat at night. Just not both mixed together.


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

notilloc said:


> i would have my dogs on a prey model diet but my gf is completly against feeding raw foods. There is no getting through to her after i started and we went to the vet and the vet chewed me out for a half hour that i was going to kill my dogs and that dogs cant handle that kind of food. I know the vet is retarded but try telling that to my gf and it turns to a big fight. It was hard enough talking her into feeding evo, she wanted to feed science diet bc thats what the vet said. So raw is out and cooking ground beef is out bc my gf feeds the dogs half the time and i know she isnt going to cook up the beef. Is there any easy supplement to sprinkle over the food or any other really easy way to put some more weight on him?


Sounds like an episode of It's Me Or The Dog:biggrin:


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## Sir (Feb 4, 2010)

All truth passes through three stages.
First, it is ridiculed.
Second, it is violently opposed.
Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

Todd said:


> Sounds like an episode of It's Me Or The Dog:biggrin:


Yea its pretty close.


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

Ania's Mommy said:


> As far as the original question, you said that feeding more than 1.5 C caused your dog tummy problems. Maybe you could up the feeding times/day to three or even four. Is that a possibility for you? Richelle


That is a very good point and for some reason never even thought about it. Thank you that will probably work and hopefully he puts on some weight.


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## spookychick13 (Jan 26, 2010)

I have to throw my .02 cents in here...I think it's time to get a second opinion.
I assume the dog was checked for parasites several times? 
What about Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency?

Not to scare you but Boxers seem prone to cancer, that might be another thing your vet should be ruling out. :/


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

I wouldnt mix raw meat with kibble because they digest at different rates and can cause stomach problems. 

It sounds like your dog does need some additional feeding, I highly reccomend making satin balls, the rescue I volunteer at uses these for dogs that come in imaciated to get them back to normal shape, heres the link:
Satin Balls Recipe - Health & Nutritional Care


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

I really dont know what has been checked on him. He has been to the vets a lot in the past year and has had many tests and i would hope they would do all the tests but i will call my vet and see later today.


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

Unosmom said:


> I wouldnt mix raw meat with kibble because they digest at different rates and can cause stomach problems.
> 
> It sounds like your dog does need some additional feeding, I highly reccomend making satin balls, the rescue I volunteer at uses these for dogs that come in imaciated to get them back to normal shape, heres the link:
> Satin Balls Recipe - Health & Nutritional Care


yea, satin balls might be something to try. if you're a raw feeder you wouldn't want to use them, but in this case it may be worth a try.


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## Todd (Jan 13, 2010)

notilloc said:


> i would have my dogs on a prey model diet but my gf is completly against feeding raw foods. There is no getting through to her after i started and we went to the vet and the vet chewed me out for a half hour that i was going to kill my dogs and that dogs cant handle that kind of food. I know the vet is retarded but try telling that to my gf and it turns to a big fight. It was hard enough talking her into feeding evo, she wanted to feed science diet bc thats what the vet said. So raw is out and cooking ground beef is out bc my gf feeds the dogs half the time and i know she isnt going to cook up the beef. Is there any easy supplement to sprinkle over the food or any other really easy way to put some more weight on him?


you say your gf isn't comfortable with a raw diet, but have you ever considered a home cooked diet?


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

One thing that wasn't mentioned is the fact that you feed Evo Red Meat. You might consider switching to Evo Original Chicken and Turkey. My dog is also very lean with a sensitive stomach. The Evo Chicken and Turkey has a somewhat higher meat content then the red meat and he tolerates it much better. It may be because it has fewer ingredients then the red meat. Rocky has done really well on it since he has been 6 months old and he is now 21 months old and 75 pounds. If you could see past his fur you would see how lean and muscular he really is!


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## notilloc (Jan 14, 2010)

chowder said:


> One thing that wasn't mentioned is the fact that you feed Evo Red Meat. You might consider switching to Evo Original Chicken and Turkey. My dog is also very lean with a sensitive stomach. The Evo Chicken and Turkey has a somewhat higher meat content then the red meat and he tolerates it much better. It may be because it has fewer ingredients then the red meat. Rocky has done really well on it since he has been 6 months old and he is now 21 months old and 75 pounds. If you could see past his fur you would see how lean and muscular he really is!


Ive wanted to buy the evo original because its about ten bucks less at dee oh gee where i get my food in bozeman. Is there really a difference between the two though, he has been on chicken and turkey with all of his foods so far before the red meat and so i was worried he was allergic to the chicken and turkey but more than likely just didnt deal with the grains very well.


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

It was probably the grains in the other foods, not the chicken or turkey. Rocky really likes the original EVO and I've also noticed that it is a lot cheaper then the Red Meat version. He loves it so much that he will spit out his big chunks of Orijen and just eat the EVO now that I am finishing up his last bag of Orijen. I was rotating the two foods but he really prefers the EVO so I am sticking with that and just rotating his canned food in the morning. You could also try supplementing your dog with some canned in the morning which is what I do. Rocky gets about a quarter to a half can of grain free food in the morning, just for the variety and to expose him to new things and extra meat and calories. Most of the canned foods have no potatoes or carbs at all in them and have a lot more meat then the kibbles. Since I can't afford to give him entirely canned food, he gets just some in the am. Usually I search for cases on sale and then alternate cans for him. It seems to really help out introducing new things to him a little at a time and I stick to the high quality, grain free companies.


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