# Trying to feed right?



## OrangeLexus (Jan 28, 2012)

Right now I feed Pedigree and Friskies/Wiskas and I have heard a lot about the grain free diets and I want to switch, I thought I was feeding them good food but I guess not? Right now I pay $20 for a 20 lbs bag and would be able to double that but I really don't want to go over $40 on a 20 lbs bag and being able to purchase at Petsmart/Petco would be a big plus but I will consider ordering it as I know the stores don't carry many of the grain free diets. I have heard mixed things on Blue Buffalo, I really don't want to switch to a raw diet at the moment, maybe down the line so right now I am looking for a dry kibble and a wet or dehydrated food to go with for both dog and cat. Any info/prices would be great 

Thoughts on Merricks "Before Grain" ? 

What do you suggest I feed to: 
5 year old queensland/border collie mix 40-50 lbs
5 year old dane/pit mix 70-80 lbs 1-2 bladder infections per year 
2 year old shorthair cat 12 lbs

Thank you


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## lauren43 (Feb 6, 2011)

For cats wet food is best, from what I've read the wellness core wet food is great!

Here are the dog/cat foods I recommend:
-Acana
-Orijen
-Wellness Core
-Fromm
-Nature's Variety Instinct
-Taste of the Wild


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## brandypup (Jan 23, 2012)

OrangeLexus said:


> Right now I feed Pedigree and Friskies/Wiskas and I have heard a lot about the grain free diets and I want to switch, I thought I was feeding them good food but I guess not? Right now I pay $20 for a 20 lbs bag and would be able to double that but I really don't want to go over $40 on a 20 lbs bag and being able to purchase at Petsmart/Petco would be a big plus but I will consider ordering it as I know the stores don't carry many of the grain free diets. I have heard mixed things on Blue Buffalo, I really don't want to switch to a raw diet at the moment, maybe down the line so right now I am looking for a dry kibble and a wet or dehydrated food to go with for both dog and cat. Any info/prices would be great
> 
> Thoughts on Merricks "Before Grain" ?
> 
> ...


For the cat I also reccoemend sticking with the canned. 

If you can not do a higher quality canned then a cheap canned is better then a high quality kibble for cats. That is becuase water is the one of the most imporatnat factor in cat health. Canned also has more meat product. Kibble, even high quality, can dehydrate a cat without anyone knowing it. When that happeneds the liver and kidneys among other things can go wrong. But you have some great suggestions for good canned foods. 

I fed my cats orijen. My vet had me switch to canned. I used friskis canned since it was more cost effective for the number i had. Their health greatly imporved. When Bones was diagnosed with VAS I went back to feeding raw. 

Just my 2 cents on the kitty.  
Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition :: healthy cat diet, making cat food, litter box, cat food, cat nutrition, cat urinary tract health


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## Jack Monzon (Jul 25, 2010)

OrangeLexus said:


> I really don't want to go over $40 on a 20 lbs bag and being able to purchase at Petsmart/Petco would be a big plus but I will consider ordering it as I know the stores don't carry many of the grain free diets. I have heard mixed things on Blue Buffalo


A friend of mine feeds her golden retriever Blue Buffalo and is happy with the results, same with a guy in my apartment building. I've never fed it. 

I've fed both Prairie and Instinct by Nature's Variety and had poor results on both. Not sure what else is available at Petsmart/Petco as neither one is close to where I live.

Wellness Core might be out of your price range.

Not sure about Merrick -- hopefully people who have direct experience with it will weigh in.


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## brandypup (Jan 23, 2012)

I have always liked merrick. I keep some canned on hand when on sale.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

lauren43 said:


> For cats wet food is best, from what I've read the wellness core wet food is great!
> 
> Here are the dog/cat foods I recommend:
> -Acana*(if grain free line, 1)*
> ...


 I TOTALLY agree with this list from Lauren!:thumb:
(I put in bold how I number them!!:wink
As for the kitty I HIGHLY suggest feeding him/her canned(I suggest if for dogs as well...but it is even more important for the cat) cats dont naturally want/feel the need to drink water, so you need to provide the needed fluids via the food!:thumb: 
You are wanting a high quality grain free, wet food for the cat.

Then for the dogs...I also for them would suggest canned. Especially for the one prone to UTIs...or at least soak his/her kibble.
Again, you are wanting a high quality grain free food.

And as far as price...you are going to be AMAZED how little you feed with a high quality grain free rather then what you are currently feeding!
The buy price *might* be higher...but the length of time that it takes to feed thru the bag, and the decrease in stool/waste is going to be AMAZING!:biggrin:

Oh and you can normally find at least a few of the above mentioned brands(TotW, Wellness Core, etc) at feed stores as well!!:thumb:


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

Taste of the wild should be within your budget as well as earthborn holistic and nutrisouce grain free. 

For your kitty, canned is best. You probably have trader joes in your area, their brand of cat food is the cheapest premium food i've seen, about $.50-60 a can. Another affordable brand is chicken soup for cat lovers soup, its not grain free, but it doesent have much grain.


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## OrangeLexus (Jan 28, 2012)

Thank you all so much, I really appriciate it. 

I am going to make a list of the Acana (grain free), Orijen, Merricks, and Taste of the wild and see what the Petsmart carries out of any of those and then weigh out prices/lbs I am willing to go higher on the price if it will last longer...

Thanks again and I will post later with what I get because I am not sure how much of the new diet to feed?


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

Glad you made it over here! I am emali06, aka the one that referred you to this awesome place! :biggrin:


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## Huginn (Nov 21, 2011)

OrangeLexus said:


> Thank you all so much, I really appriciate it.
> 
> I am going to make a list of the Acana (grain free), Orijen, Merricks, and Taste of the wild and see what the Petsmart carries out of any of those and then weigh out prices/lbs I am willing to go higher on the price if it will last longer...
> 
> Thanks again and I will post later with what I get because I am not sure how much of the new diet to feed?


As someone else mentioned PetSmart doesnt carry these brands. However, in Feb we will be carrying Wellness Core and an Innova grain free line called Prime, that I havent had any experience with. I believe PetCo may carry TOTW, but I cannot remember as I haven't stepped foot in that store since I quit there. 

For volume of food I would start with the 3/4 of the amount you are currently feeding, watch their weight and adjust as needed. At least this is what I have done.


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## Huginn (Nov 21, 2011)

DogEyes said:


> Petsmart carries* Pro Plan Select*. That is a giant step up from what your feeding and your dog will live a long healthy life on that. I know a bunch of double coated show dogs on that food and they absolutely glow.


No no no . . . don't go with this food . . . There are many others that PetSmart carries that are much better and non-grain inclusive.. .. and in a decent price range.


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## DeekenDog (Aug 29, 2011)

Personally, I like the Acana (grain free) kibbles best. They may be a bit more per bag than you're used to but your dogs will likely need a lot less than they do of the pedigree. As for your cat, I agree with everyone else, CANNED!


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## PDXdogmom (Jun 30, 2010)

I was going to mention the same thing as DogEyes - that the big box stores won't carry the brands the OP mentioned.

I'd suggest looking at NutriSource: the Adult Chicken or Performance formulas (both with grains) or one of their two grain-free formulas. Pricing is good and the ingredient list doesn't have what I call a lot of window-dressing. Shouldn't be a problem to find in California: Where To Buy Nutrisource Super Premium Pet Foods Dog Foods and Cat Foods


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## OrangeLexus (Jan 28, 2012)

*I ended up skipping Petsmart and heading over to a pet health food store...*

Got back from the pet pantry and the lady there was very helpful and set me up for all three animals, It's a little different than what was listed on this thread but she said to start the dogs out for the first week on Evanger's wet food half a can with Canidae dry or Evanger's dry (she gave me a weeks worth of samples) along with a probiotics capsule am/pm and a digest supplement from The Honest Kitchen she said I could incorporate raw egg, cottage cheese, and plain greek yogurt after about a week and start getting raw meats in there aswell I am going back in a week and I think she is going to have me get some dehydrated wet food from THK and some raw meats that they sell.So they are at two small meals a day with no more grazing. 

For the cat she said to pick out a weeks worth of wet food (variety-all different brands/flavors) and forget about the dry she also gave me some samples of ground raw meat and some dehydrated meat toppers, he gets a half a can am and a half pm with some warmed up raw either am or pm she said for both dog and cat I could mix a little warm water with the food to give it bulk and warm it up. Like the dogs he is at two meals a day with no dry and no grazing.


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## OrangeLexus (Jan 28, 2012)

Sprocket said:


> Glad you made it over here! I am emali06, aka the one that referred you to this awesome place! :biggrin:


Thanks! It's been a lot of help!

Just gave the dogs their first bowl and they loved it, They were still wanting more so I waited about 20 mins and gave them each half a raw egg and 2 spoonfuls of cottage cheese and the queensland tried it but wasn't thrilled-The pit cleaned it up. After that they got quite and haven't been acting like they wanted more which I wasn't expecting as they are used to grazing and getting almost double what they got tonight for dinner. Very pleased so far =)


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

Acana, Orijen or Evo is what I would feed if Aspen was on kibble. A dog does not need grains...


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

OrangeLexus said:


> Thanks! It's been a lot of help!
> 
> Just gave the dogs their first bowl and they loved it, They were still wanting more so I waited about 20 mins and gave them each half a raw egg and 2 spoonfuls of cottage cheese and the queensland tried it but wasn't thrilled-The pit cleaned it up. After that they got quite and haven't been acting like they wanted more which I wasn't expecting as they are used to grazing and getting almost double what they got tonight for dinner. Very pleased so far =)



Just be careful about overloading them too much. You don't want to make them explode out of either end. It is like eating mcdonalds your entire life and then eating a salad for the first time. It will clean you out! 

Congratulations!!!!


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## OrangeLexus (Jan 28, 2012)

Sprocket said:


> Just be careful about overloading them too much. You don't want to make them explode out of either end. It is like eating mcdonalds your entire life and then eating a salad for the first time. It will clean you out!
> 
> Congratulations!!!!


Defiantly-they have had cottage cheese in their dinners almost every night so that isn't new but the egg is new-So far so good. That's as much new that they will get for this week, Like you said I don't want anything flying out from either end...


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

OrangeLexus said:


> Defiantly-they have had cottage cheese in their dinners almost every night so that isn't new but the egg is new-So far so good. That's as much new that they will get for this week, Like you said I don't want anything flying out from either end...


Did you let them eat the egg shell? My dogs love the shell and it is added calcium and will help hold their poop together if their body does decide to move things a little more quickly


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

malluver1005 said:


> Acana, Orijen or Evo is what I would feed if Aspen was on kibble. A dog does not need grains...




But what about grains vs potatoes? That's what I've really begun to wonder these past few months lol. 

I think that whole grains aren't really that bad in comparison to a potato, as long as it's not grain heavy or led by grains in the ingredient list.

I had Abbie on a Natural Balance *Ultra* formula that was chicken, brown rice, chicken meal for the first three ingredients. I have her on Hi-Tek chicken & rice formula, with ingredients of chicken meal, brown rice, white rice...and she is doing surprisingly REALLY well (in terms of coat condition, weight, stools, etc). Before that she was on Earthborn's grain free bison formula. 

It was very price friendly at 17.5lbs for $19.99. I guess my point is that I feel like grains aren't always the devil if the dog has no sensitivity to them, and there's still decent meat content in it (unlike in NB).




They also have a grain free line that looks pretty good, I'd like to try that out too. And a baked kibble, from which what I've heard is better than most kibbles that are fried...(those are a little less budget friendly lol).


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

meggels said:


> But what about grains vs potatoes? That's what I've really begun to wonder these past few months lol.
> 
> I think that whole grains aren't really that bad in comparison to a potato, as long as it's not grain heavy or led by grains in the ingredient list.
> 
> ...


I know nothing about potato and grains, so I can't comment.


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## Scarlett_O' (May 19, 2011)

meggels said:


> But what about grains vs potatoes? That's what I've really begun to wonder these past few months lol.
> 
> I think that whole grains aren't really that bad in comparison to a potato, as long as it's not grain heavy or led by grains in the ingredient list.
> 
> ...


Grains are FAR less natural(for lack of a better term) then tubers, even for us omnivores.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

Potatoes are a high glycemic food. 


I don't think whole grains are worse than a potato. I don't think either one is ideal lol but when looking at kibbles I don't know if a tater is particularly better...


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

I've been told by my mentor, who has worked in the industry for 20+ years...that many kibbles are in fact, fried. I will ask him when I'm there in half an hour, but I'm 99% sure he has said most kibbles are fried.


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

DogEyes said:


> But they need potatoes right?


I really don't know if dogs need potatoes or not, I hope not...what they need is real meat.


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## PDXdogmom (Jun 30, 2010)

malluver1005 said:


> Acana, Orijen or Evo is what I would feed if Aspen was on kibble. A dog does not need grains...


Some type of carb has to hold the kibble together for processing - wether it's a grain or not a grain.

There is no way that the potato in Orijen or Evo is any healthier than the brown rice in some other grain-inclusive formula. In fact, I would argue that it is less healthy. Pick the kibble by a variety of standards one may have; but not simply because it is grain-free.


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

Orange lexus,

How about trying Purina Selects dog food at Petsmart? I have two Weimaraners that are allergic and hypersensitive and they do very well on this. It also has the benefit of being grain, corn and soy free. Plus it is affordable. I refuse to feed my dogs any food on the 2008 recall list at fda.gov I saw many dogs and cats coming in my vets office sick and dying from that recall and I vowed never ever. We also learned from that recall that some expensive foods were made at the same place as the cheap Walmart brands.


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## mythbuster (Jan 23, 2012)

greyshadows said:


> I refuse to feed my dogs any food on the 2008 recall list at fda.gov I saw many dogs and cats coming in my vets office sick and dying from that recall and I vowed never ever. We also learned from that recall that some expensive foods were made at the same place as the cheap Walmart brands.


The melamine disaster was a tragedy that affected thousands of pets and pet owners. It impacted both prescription and retail diets, and if you’ll recall, human baby formula. It happened because a product supplier intentionally added melamine to their wheat gluten to falsely elevate the protein level. Until it happened, it never occurred to anyone that something like that could ever be possible. The affected diets weren't all made 'at the same place', they had a common supplier, who intentionally sabotaged an ingredient.

It affected the larger food companies because the supplier of some ingredients was the same for different companies. It happened because these companies were lied to by the supplier. The fact that some companies were not affected does not mean that they were better, it means they were lucky. The affected ingredients were not cheap. They were sabotaged. Unless you are going to personally harvest every ingredient that goes into a diet and personally deliver it to the production facility, suppliers are a necessity. Every pet food company relies on suppliers. 

Every pet food company, whether they were affected or not, should have taken it seriously enough to develop methods to ensure nothing like that will ever happen again. Avoiding all the producers on the affected list doesn't guarantee safety in the future, and there is the potential to miss out on the opportunity to feed an animal exceptional nutrition because something devastating happened in the past.


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

I agree Mythbuster that these companies should take this issue seriously but they don't. I just posted another thread about good vs bad food but basically some do come down the same line. For example, Taste of the Wild is exactly the same as Kirkland Signature brand at Costco and they are made in Missouri by Diamond Pet Foods and they make several other brands at that facility where the supplies still come in from China all the time. My friend repairs machines at supposed exceptional pet food facilities and he will tell you some stomach turning stories. Companies need to wake up and learn to source products locally and create relationships with growers and ranchers. They think it's better to find the cheapest suppliers but one big recall invites huge money in lawsuits. Not to mention it creates jobs closer to the factories


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## Jenny (Dec 7, 2010)

meggels said:


> But what about grains vs potatoes? That's what I've really begun to wonder these past few months lol.
> I think that whole grains aren't really that bad in comparison to a potato, as long as it's not grain heavy or led by grains in the ingredient list.


Grain free foods are "hot" today, and some of them are better than many average dog foods. But they are not better because they have potatoes and peas instead of grains. I think they are better because they have more meat in it. I personally think rice and oats are better than potatoes. I really would like to see more high quality foods with rice and oats, instead of potatoes and peas! But I don't like corn or wheat in dog food because they are harder to digest and they include glutein.


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## mythbuster (Jan 23, 2012)

greyshadows said:


> I agree Mythbuster that these companies should take this issue seriously but they don't. I just posted another thread about good vs bad food but basically some do come down the same line. For example, Taste of the Wild is exactly the same as Kirkland Signature brand at Costco and they are made in Missouri by Diamond Pet Foods and they make several other brands at that facility where the supplies still come in from China all the time. My friend repairs machines at supposed exceptional pet food facilities and he will tell you some stomach turning stories. Companies need to wake up and learn to source products locally and create relationships with growers and ranchers. They think it's better to find the cheapest suppliers but one big recall invites huge money in lawsuits. Not to mention it creates jobs closer to the factories


Some companies do take it very seriously...... For example, Royal Canin instituted NIRS testing on all of their raw and finished products. This test provides the fingerprint of the raw ingredients as well as the finished product, which means if it is tainted in ANY way, the 'fingerprint' will look different. This is done IN ADDITION to several other tests to ensure consistent superior quality, on every single batch of ingredients and final products. If there is a contaminant, be it biological or inert, intentional or otherwise, the NIRS test will identify that the ingredient or product is not what it’s supposed to be. 

Royal Canin had diets involved in the recall, but I feel confident supporting Royal Canin (and don't feel confident in many other companies) because they learned from the melamine disaster and improved themselves, so the next time a supplier sabotages an ingredient source (and maybe next time it will be a US supplier, or a Canadian supplier....), I can be assured those ingredients will not make it into the Royal Canin products I am recommending for my patients. Even if the company isn't looking for a specific contaminant, the test will identify it. 




Jenny said:


> Grain free foods are "hot" today, and some of them are better than many average dog foods. But they are not better because they have potatoes and peas instead of grains. I think they are better because they have more meat in it. I personally think rice and oats are better than potatoes. I really would like to see more high quality foods with rice and oats, instead of potatoes and peas! But I don't like corn or wheat in dog food because they are harder to digest and they include glutein.


Gluten is simply protein. Corn gluten and wheat gluten are completely different. Both of these are actually very highly digestible; both the protein and carb portion of each is more than 90% digestible...... in fact they are more digestible than chicken!! When people talk about wheat gluten, they are typically actually talking about gliadin which is the protein people with celiac disease cannot tolerate. As an interesting aside, Irish Setters are the only breed that have been confirmed to have a predisposition to developing celiac disease (it doesn't mean they all get it, they are just the ones that have been shown to get it). More meat does not mean more protein, and more protein is not always superior. Dogs need a certain amount of protein (and certain amino acids), to perform daily metabolic functions, make tissues, renew skin, grow hair, etc.... after that, they use protein for energy.... after that, excess protein is either excreted or stored as fat. There is no benefit to giving a dog more protein than it needs.


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

I am so glad to finally here someone else say that a dog doesn't need tons of protein. My breeder kept telling us that a dog can never have enough protein and we should only feed something like Orijen. Upon speaking with my veternarian however, she disagreed and then told me about a local K9 dog who had become sick overconsuming protein. But still anyone I mention it too they all disagree and say that dogs need nothing but protein. Funny but my dogs if given a piece of chicken or an apple they pick the apple everytime! Maybe it's the breed.
About Royal Canin, do you think there has been an improvement since being acquired by Mars? Also, just curious do you think pet foods are produced the same way in Europe as they are in the US?(Royal Canin for example produces in both places). I don't hear much about recalls in other places.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

you should check the more recent studies on the protein myths, your vet is probably misinformed. The original ones were done on rats fed high protein plant based diets which resulted in kidney failure, not on dogs fed meat protein, huge difference.


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## mythbuster (Jan 23, 2012)

greyshadows said:


> About Royal Canin, do you think there has been an improvement since being acquired by Mars? Also, just curious do you think pet foods are produced the same way in Europe as they are in the US?(Royal Canin for example produces in both places). I don't hear much about recalls in other places.


I don't believe that being acquired by Mars changed Royal Canin, they've always been a research driven company, and continue to be.... now they've just been 'adopted' by a parent company. As far as I know they still have control over the way they do things (I know a lot about their products because I use and recommend them..... but this is an area I haven't spent a ton of time learning about.....)

As for the production, my understanding is that all of the production facilities are owned by RC, and run according to the same strict guidelines. They have a number of production facilities, as well as a number of laboratories across the globe that are dedicated to testing raw material, finished products, etc..... I believe they source locally wherever possible, to reduce costs, support local, support the environment, etc... but the nutrient profile of the same diet in different companies should be identical. Does that answer your question?


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## Jenny (Dec 7, 2010)

mythbuster said:


> Gluten is simply protein. Corn gluten and wheat gluten are completely different. Both of these are actually very highly digestible; both the protein and carb portion of each is more than 90% digestible...... in fact they are more digestible than chicken!! When people talk about wheat gluten, they are typically actually talking about gliadin which is the protein people with celiac disease cannot tolerate. More meat does not mean more protein, and more protein is not always superior. Dogs need a certain amount of protein (and certain amino acids), to perform daily metabolic functions, make tissues, renew skin, grow hair, etc.... after that, they use protein for energy.... after that, excess protein is either excreted or stored as fat. There is no benefit to giving a dog more protein than it needs.


I have many dogs without allergies, and I have used many different foods. I have noticed that if food contains corn or wheat, dogs are very stinky and they poop more. So corn and wheat is not very digestible based to my dogs. That's why I won't use foods with corn or wheat anymore.

Also, I don't like that some manufactures use corn gluten or wheat gluten to boost the protein, so that they need to use less meat. Animal protein is far better than vegetable protein for dogs. 

I think there is no benefit to giving dog so much potatoes, grains or vegetables (=carbohydrates) that _all_ the kibbles have. That's why I give my dogs raw meat and fat with kibbles everyday. (I use kibbles which have 25-33% protein and 15-20% fat).


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## mythbuster (Jan 23, 2012)

Jenny said:


> I have many dogs without allergies, and I have used many different foods. I have noticed that if food contains corn or wheat, dogs are very stinky and they poop more. So corn and wheat is not very digestible based to my dogs. That's why I won't use foods with corn or wheat anymore.
> 
> Also, I don't like that some manufactures use corn gluten or wheat gluten to boost the protein, so that they need to use less meat. Animal protein is far better than vegetable protein for dogs.
> 
> I think there is no benefit to giving dog so much potatoes, grains or vegetables (=carbohydrates) that _all_ the kibbles have. That's why I give my dogs raw meat and fat with kibbles everyday. (I use kibbles which have 25-33% protein and 15-20% fat).


it depends on WHAT diet you fed containing corn or wheat. There are garbage diets containing those things, just like there are garbage grain free diets or "natural' or "holistic" diets. Corn and wheat are highly digestible if you use quality ingredients and process them appropriately. 

Quote: "common dietary proteins, including proteins from casein, mixed whey, wheat, and legumes, are digested with an efficiency of greater than 90 percent" Dietary Reference Intakes for Energy, Carbohydrate, Fiber, Fat, Fatty Acids, Cholesterol, Protein, and Amino Acids (Macronutrients) (2005). Food and Nutrition Board.


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

Unosmom, my vet was not misinformed about protein overload. She does research at a large veterinary school in my area and they have treated dogs for excessive protein. She warned me to be careful with certain brands. Now I am not a vet but I trust her when she says to be careful on high protein diets especially if you supplement with rawhide or any other protein snacks. True maybe some breeds are more prone to problems than others, I will ask her when I visit her. Also I believe canines are omnivores not just carnivores in the wild as they will eat an entire carcass plus certain fruits, grasses, roots berries etc. My dogs prefer apples over chicken if offered both! 
Mythbuster thanks for the info on RC, sounds like they are trying at least. Good to see you do your research and not just believe what is spoon fed us. You definately seem knowledgable and very scientific, I would presume a professional.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

Heres a reply by a vet as well

Q.	Are high protein diets harmful to my dog's kidneys?

A.	A rumor has been going around that high protein diets cause kidney disease. This rumor is false. High protein pet foods are NOT harmful to a normal animal's kidneys. As an animal's body digests and metabolizes protein, nitrogen is released as a by-product. The excess nitrogen is excreted by the kidneys. A high protein diet produces more nitrogen by-products and the kidneys simply excrete the nitrogen in the urine. While you may think this would 'overwork' the kidneys and lead to possible kidney damage, this is not true. The kidney's filtering capabilities are so great that even one kidney is sufficient to sustain a normal life. There are many pets - and humans - living perfectly healthy lives with just one kidney.
The myth that high protein diets are harmful to kidneys probably started because, in the past, patients with kidney disease were commonly placed on low protein (and thus low nitrogen) diets. Now, we often put them on a diet that is not necessarily very low in protein, but contains protein that is more digestible so there are fewer nitrogen by-products. These diet changes are made merely because damaged kidneys may not be able to handle the excess nitrogen efficiently. In pets with existing kidney problems, nitrogen can become too high in the bloodstream, which can harm other tissues.

Unless your veterinarian has told you your pet has a kidney problem and it is severe enough to adjust the protein intake, you can feed your pet a high protein diet without worrying about 'damaging' or 'stressing' your pet's kidneys. Also, you are not 'saving' your pet's kidneys by feeding a low protein diet.

Are high protein diets harmful to a dog's kidneys?


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## greyshadows (Jan 30, 2012)

My vet did not warn me of kidney issues with a high protein diet, she said it was liver toxicity and she gave me a list of certain foods that if I chose to feed them, she strongly suggested blood work every six months to make sure their liver was functioning properly.


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## Unosmom (May 3, 2009)

I would have to do little more research on the effects of protein on liver function, but if you vet can share any studies, I'd be glad to check them out.


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## mythbuster (Jan 23, 2012)

Unosmom said:


> Heres a reply by a vet as well
> 
> Q.	Are high protein diets harmful to my dog's kidneys?
> 
> ...


High protein does not cause renal disease, just like carbs do not cause diabetes. (I have seen a number of animals being fed Orijen present with elevated renal and/or liver enzymes, that resolved when the diet was changed. This is my personal anecdotal observation only.) 
If there is existing renal or liver disease, you may not need to restrict protein levels severely, but you certainly want to avoid feeding high levels of protein.
There is no benefit to feeding more protein than an animal requires. It is wasteful.


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