# Dog is driving me up the wall.



## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

Well, it's been a year since we started Raw feeding... I'm thinking it might not go much further than that, most days he's eating next to nothing, he's working his ass off and he's getting visibly slimmer. Chicken, beef, venison, duck, quail, pork, and.. even some Emu, and he's not wanting to have anything to do with it. UNLESS of course you cut it up into little pieces and hand it to him... well then he'll eat it, because hey.. i don't have to chew it up, i can just lazily swallow it.

I work so hard getting good deals on meats, getting permits to walk off with ridiculous things from processing plants, i spend hours upon hours filling my freezer with meats for him, elbows deep in buckets of bloody nasty bits, and for what? for him to just walk off after feeding him and be like... meh... just gimme kibbles and bits, cuz... i'll eat that S#@$. To put it into perspective on how much i'm looking for meats etc because they are hard to come by around here... i spend usually 3-4 hours a day working out where we can get more. whether it be free things to pick up, craigslist stuff, the processing plant (mind you we have to butcher what we want to take home as well, usually an 8 hour day of doing that).

I suppose i'm just a bit pissed off, we spent over 100$ on bully sticks and i can barely get him to chew on those anymore, usually he'd go crazy for them, i'm going to give it 2 days of starving him if he doesn't eat what i give him then... back to processed crap, and honestly.. it's not my skin and soft bits that get all itchy when i eat that crap, if he wants it he's got it... i could care less anymore about wtf he eats and how his skin and coat feels...

He's going in for a checkup i'll need to get blood work done on him soon as well, idk if that will uncover some reason he doesn't care to eat anything we give him.. unless like i said, small bits, or food from peoples plates, which he hasn't gotten for some time... I test him all the time and see if he wants stuff like that... and he'd be more than happy.

I also know that he'll be more than happy to eat a crap food because my mother inlaw had kibbles and bits out for her dog, we didn't know it was in the kitchen and Tobi ate the entire bowl, she said she'd just filled it with 1 cup of food, and before i could make it in there he had downed it all.

/rant finished


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## Makovach (Jan 24, 2012)

Sound like he is being quite the butt head!

I don't have any good advise besides maybe get him checked out to make sure nothing is wrong. Or let him go a few days not eating and see if he gets hungry? 

Hopefully someone will have better advice


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Knock it off........RIGHT NOW! You know as well as I do what will happen to his skin if you put him on crappy kibble and it won't be pretty nor will it be cheap...Stop the pity party and buck up and starve the dog for a few days or do what worked great for my female....I got another dog..


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

Definitely have the vet check him out!

He may have something going on in his mouth? Painful tooth? 

IMO it sounds like he is training you... hwell:


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## wolfsnaps88 (Jan 2, 2012)

I can vouch that competition for food really WORKS. Sometimes, I feed my little guy inside while the big dogs eat outside. When Sargeant starts getting all fussy, I let the big dogs in. Sarge immediately runs to his food, guarding it with his life. He usually eats it then. Multiple dogs can come in handy. 


Sorry to hear this. I understand your frustration. Its weird he would do this after a year. Forgive me if you stated this elsewhere but, does he get kibble right now too? Hopefully everything is ok at the vets but maybe there is an underlining issue that is making him this way. If he is working his butt off and expending energy, you would think that would make him a hungry boy. Good luck. Keep us updated.


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

Today is the third day he's not eaten... anything. I know how bad his skin will get... it's like, he's an ungrateful little brat kid, and i'm feeling lately because of this like "it's not my skin, he'll be the itchy ass."

I've been through the whole, he's training me thing, but not eating anything for three days and having walked/ran a total of 18 miles in the last 3 days is getting out there.

We can't get another dog unfortunately, we've got other priorities at the moment, i'm sure it might be a little competition though for food :lol:


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## kady05 (Jul 29, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> Definitely have the vet check him out!
> 
> He may have something going on in his mouth? Painful tooth?
> 
> IMO it sounds like he is training you... hwell:


Yup, I agree. Time for tough love. He doesn't want to eat what's put in front of him, oh well, tough cookies, he can be hungry then.

I suppose he could have a tooth that's hurting, or something.. but most dogs with eating issues are having them because their owners created them 

One of Sako's sisters owners has similar issues with her dog. She dotes and dotes on her, adds special things to her kibble to get her to eat it, dog still turns her nose up. She's created a MONSTER in the food category! She's finally realizing (they're almost 17 months old now) that she needs to get tough and stop playing her game.

Edit: You posted while I was replying.. so 3 days with NO food whatsoever? And working that much? Hmm..


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

wolfsnaps88 said:


> I can vouch that competition for food really WORKS. Sometimes, I feed my little guy inside while the big dogs eat outside. When Sargeant starts getting all fussy, I let the big dogs in. Sarge immediately runs to his food, guarding it with his life. He usually eats it then. Multiple dogs can come in handy.
> 
> 
> Sorry to hear this. I understand your frustration. Its weird he would do this after a year. Forgive me if you stated this elsewhere but, does he get kibble right now too? Hopefully everything is ok at the vets but maybe there is an underlining issue that is making him this way. If he is working his butt off and expending energy, you would think that would make him a hungry boy. Good luck. Keep us updated.


He's not had kibble in over a year now actually, he's gotten progressively more picky about food since he's started raw. the only time in recent history when he's eaten A LOT was when he was on a mild steroid and he was eating upwards of 2-3lbs per day at 60lbs.

I'm hoping there isn't an underlying issue, i check his teeth frequently and everything looks totally normal :frown:


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Has the weather been funky there lately? Hot one day then cold the next? Sometimes this will play havoc with their system and they will go off their food. I hope he is fine...If he is drinking normally and acting like himself then I would wait it out..


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

OK, that does it. I'm going to hire a bus. Then I'm going to drive around the USA, picking up all of our fussy dogs. Then we are all going down to Mexico, where our spoilt brats are going to get a good telling off and then they are going to be dropped off with their Mexican street dog mates and will have to learn to fend for themselves. 
I will go back in one months time to pick them up. Then, I bet you a million dollars that for the rest of their sorry lives, they will eat every morsel you put out for them.
So, tell Tobi he had better buy himself some Rosetta Stone, because Mollie, Windy and all the other spoilt dogs from DFC will be up there shortly to haul his sorry ar$e off. 
God these dogs (and cats) pi$$ me off, they don't have a clue how good they have it.


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

whiteleo said:


> Has the weather been funky there lately? Hot one day then cold the next? Sometimes this will play havoc with their system and they will go off their food. I hope he is fine...If he is drinking normally and acting like himself then I would wait it out..





MollyWoppy said:


> OK, that does it. I'm going to hire a bus. Then I'm going to drive around the USA, picking up all of our fussy dogs. Then we are all going down to Mexico, where our spoilt brats are going to get a good telling off and then they are going to be dropped off with their Mexican street dog mates and will have to learn to fend for themselves.
> I will go back in one months time to pick them up. Then, I bet you a million dollars that for the rest of their sorry lives, they will eat every morsel you put out for them.
> So, tell Tobi he had better buy himself some Rosetta Stone, because Mollie, Windy and all the other spoilt dogs from DFC will be up there shortly to haul his sorry ar$e off.
> God these dogs (and cats) pi$$ me off, they don't have a clue how good they have it.


Robin, it's gotten really warm all of a sudden here, i'd honestly not given any thought to it, today it was 84 at the mountains, a week ago it was in the 50's...I HAAAAAAAAATE giving him chicken... but i suppose i might try and see if he'll eat that at least. likely he will, he's never really turned his nose up at it.

Molly lol, i love that! i'll invest in teaching him some spanish! :lol:


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

yes, Tobi definitely has it better than most dogs here. I don't know of many people that go to that much work for dog food.

I am with everyone else here - do the tough love thing. You just cannot go back to kibble!!!!


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

> UNLESS of course you cut it up into little pieces and hand it to him... well then he'll eat it, because hey.. i don't have to chew it up, i can just lazily swallow it.


get blood work.....make sure he's fine....

and then take a good look in the mirror and realise that you've spoiled him.


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## KittyKat (Feb 11, 2011)

Yeah - have his teeth checked and if all looks good, let the bugger starve. He will eventually eat. Tough love!


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

magicre said:


> get blood work.....make sure he's fine....
> 
> and then take a good look in the mirror and realise that you've spoiled him.


re, I need that PUG picture in your signature! Diet starts next week...love it!

David, my guess is it is the weather...


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## liquid (Dec 28, 2011)

I'd get his teeth checked to make sure nothing in there is bothering him. Especially if he's willing to swallow tiny bits of food but wont chew on big pieces.

If his mouth is just dandy, then well, you gotta teach him a lesson in tough love!!
He just needs to know how good he has it with you. Hell, give him to me for a few days and he'll be CRAWLING back to you! I can be an ice cold [email protected]#$ when I need to be! :lol:


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

whiteleo said:


> re, I need that PUG picture in your signature! Diet starts next week...love it!
> 
> David, my guess is it is the weather...



robin,
feel free to take it. i have others...

david, i really think he's being over worked....

he might be too tired to eat....

give him a few days off and do the tough love thing.

get him to a vet and get some blood work...make sure his teeth are okay so we're not missing anything...

put the food day for 20 minutes and then pick it up and offer it again later on.

as long as he's drinking, he's fine.

but if it's hot one day and cool the next and you're running him, well, i know when i used to work out heavy.....sometimes i'd work out so much that i had gone beond an appetite.


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

That's really valid as well Re... I didn't think about that like that... i'm still irritated with him though :lol:

he drinks plenty part of our hikes are through a river, and it's about a mile hike upstream through a creek bed (keeps his yeasty funky paws clean and pink) great exercise, and keeps us both pretty cool, he Drinks a ton as we trek through the water... so i know he's hydrated, but like you said... just too damn tired to even eat..

Thanks everybody for talking me down a little, i've put so much into making, and keeping this runt healthy and happy and this is how he repays me?! :rofl:

This is why i never needed/wanted real kids lol


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

see, he's drinking a TON...the weather and the hiking.....

he's a young dog.....

stay irritated...hell, if they didn't irritate us, life would not be worth living...

but give him a break....and set the food down...pick it up in 20 minutes...

and actually, i'd set his favourite food down. not chicken....


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## malluver1005 (Nov 15, 2009)

Tobi said:


> Robin, it's gotten really warm all of a sudden here, i'd honestly not given any thought to it, today it was 84 at the mountains, a week ago it was in the 50's...I HAAAAAAAAATE giving him chicken... but i suppose i might try and see if he'll eat that at least. likely he will, he's never really turned his nose up at it.


Hmmmm...I'd be a little uncomfortable hiking with any dog in 84 degree weather. That said, you should probably give him a break...don't give into the kibble.


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## liquid (Dec 28, 2011)

Tobi said:


> This is why i never needed/wanted real kids lol


You know, I never wanted kids either. Give me a puppy any day and I'll raise it instead! :tongue:


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## frogdog (Aug 10, 2011)

I totally agree with Re...get him to the vet - I've had dogs refuse to eat like Tobi before and was something medical going on... also, give him a rest and feed him his favorite...doesn't eat within 20 take it up.

Sorry, do not mean to come off rude but if my dog had not eaten for three days...would be at the vet no question or hesitation. My first thought would be "is something wrong" and be concerned not angry/frustrated. Go to the vet and if all checks out fine then by all means rant.

Yes, maybe he is only being a brat but you do not know for sure. My dogs diagnosis that refused to eat...pinched nerve in neck, irritated disc in back, allergies, anal gland impaction, cancer, etc...always one of the first signs something wasn't right. 

Hope Tobi eats soon...very soon...best to you both.


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## eternalstudent (Jul 22, 2010)

I know how you feel about the picky bit creeping in. 

Becka is 2 she has been raw fed since a little pup and never picky. The other week I gave her lamb heart something she used to go wild for. She ignored it. 4 days she starved herself. 4 days. I walk the same distance as you (6 miles a day) eventually she caved. So will Tobi. They are stubborn but not stupid 

Just remember what ever they think we ARE the master race 







Maybe


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## kady05 (Jul 29, 2011)

malluver1005 said:


> Hmmmm...I'd be a little uncomfortable hiking with any dog in 84 degree weather.


Ha, if I did go out with my dogs when it was 84 out, we'd never get out of the house in the summer! It was 84 here yesterday!


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

Dude went 6 days without eating when we gave him beef for the first time. He was JUST NOT GOING TO DO IT. He would eat ANYTHING else we offered him. After three days I offered him something else because I thought, "well maybe something's wrong and he won't eat at all". I offered him a bite of chicken and he gobbled it up. Offered him a bite of beef... nothing. He has nothing physically wrong with him and, in Dude's case, it was just a severe case of stubbornness. He now eats beef, no questions asked. Ever. Hahaha

When we lived in Southern California, our dogs would often go a day or two in a row without eating and their food was out 24/7. They got a measured amount given to them in the morning and sometimes, it was three or four days by the time we would come home from school and see empty bowls. They weren't free fed but when we finally saw those empty bowls then the next morning before school we would pour their designated amount of kibble into their bowls again. Granted, it WAS kibble, but when it's hot, sometimes dogs just don't want to eat. 

I am with the others though. I would definitely go get him checked out. Check him for everything and then, if all checks out, let him starve. I am with Re on the hiking break too.


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

magicre said:


> see, he's drinking a TON...the weather and the hiking.....
> 
> he's a young dog.....
> 
> ...


His favorite is Chicken :lol: which is why he drives me nuts, i suppose i could find a poultry that is 100% organic etc etc... the search begins... again XD





malluver1005 said:


> Hmmmm...I'd be a little uncomfortable hiking with any dog in 84 degree weather. That said, you should probably give him a break...don't give into the kibble.


I kinda see it, if i can handle it he should be able to :lol: and it's also why i'm by water when we do strenuous hikes like that, knee deep in a 40-50 degree creek with me is shoulder deep to him, so he's staying nice and cool through about 1/2 of our hikes, i frequently hike off trail just to get to a creek to let him cool down as well as toting over 3 gallons of water for us. besides, if we didn't hike in hot weather we could never go. :lol:


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

Dude and Bucks Mamma said:


> Dude went 6 days without eating when we gave him beef for the first time. He was JUST NOT GOING TO DO IT. He would eat ANYTHING else we offered him. After three days I offered him something else because I thought, "well maybe something's wrong and he won't eat at all". I offered him a bite of chicken and he gobbled it up. Offered him a bite of beef... nothing. He has nothing physically wrong with him and, in Dude's case, it was just a severe case of stubbornness. He now eats beef, no questions asked. Ever. Hahaha
> 
> When we lived in Southern California, our dogs would often go a day or two in a row without eating and their food was out 24/7. They got a measured amount given to them in the morning and sometimes, it was three or four days by the time we would come home from school and see empty bowls. They weren't free fed but when we finally saw those empty bowls then the next morning before school we would pour their designated amount of kibble into their bowls again. Granted, it WAS kibble, but when it's hot, sometimes dogs just don't want to eat.
> 
> I am with the others though. I would definitely go get him checked out. Check him for everything and then, if all checks out, let him starve. I am with Re on the hiking break too.


Were taking a break from hiking till he gets to the vet on Monday. I'm heading to the market to see if i can find some "healthy" chicken $$$ for him... since that is his fav. What Dude was doing is exactly like Tobi, you can offer him something out of your hand... crackers, soup, veggies, anything... but if it is...A. on the floor, B. on his plate, or C. so big he has to chew it up himself... he refuses to eat it. it's ridiculous.


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## twotonelover (Jan 10, 2011)

Have you tried feeding things while still frozen? For some reason Rosey will only eat venison ribs if they are frozen  Everything else she will eat thawed or frozen so...I don't know haha I would get his teeth checked out and run some blood work. If everything comes back clean, time for some tough love.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

frogdog said:


> I totally agree with Re...get him to the vet - I've had dogs refuse to eat like Tobi before and was something medical going on... also, give him a rest and feed him his favorite...doesn't eat within 20 take it up.
> 
> Sorry, do not mean to come off rude but if my dog had not eaten for three days...would be at the vet no question or hesitation. My first thought would be "is something wrong" and be concerned not angry/frustrated. Go to the vet and if all checks out fine then by all means rant.
> 
> ...


i don't think you're being rude and david can take it....

i do think he knows his dog.....and my only reason for taking him to the vet is to rule out things...and then he can be dealt with dietarily....

i just think he's getting overheated....and is tired.


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Tobi said:


> His favorite is Chicken :lol: which is why he drives me nuts, i suppose i could find a poultry that is 100% organic etc etc... the search begins... again XD
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You have to remember your dealing with a Bull Terrier here David, they are of the thinest of skinned dogs around thus all the skin problems and allergy issues, and unlike any dog around personality wise. They are NOT NORMAL dogs!


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

David, I could also send you the rescue I'm getting on Saturday (see thread under rescue) that would give Tobi a little competition for food...LOL


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

Likely Bloodwork, and Xrays to rule out anything else. 

And Robin if we could have another Bully to keep i'd take that girl in a heartbeat  speaking of which... we might be getting waggles back in the future... unfortunately my wife's friend is not as great a dog owner as she let on, i think he's a wee bit neglected, and seems like he's almost a burden to her vs being a companion/friend/pleasure. He's gotten big too, he's as tall as Tobi :lol:


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## whiteleo (Sep 7, 2008)

Tobi said:


> Likely Bloodwork, and Xrays to rule out anything else.
> 
> And Robin if we could have another Bully to keep i'd take that girl in a heartbeat  speaking of which... we might be getting waggles back in the future... unfortunately my wife's friend is not as great a dog owner as she let on, i think he's a wee bit neglected, and seems like he's almost a burden to her vs being a companion/friend/pleasure. He's gotten big too, he's as tall as Tobi :lol:


One sure way to know if something is wrong on the inside is palpitation of the stomach, B.T.'s are stoic but if they are uncomfortable a good pressing on the stomach /abdomen will show some signs of discomfort. Is Tobi a dog who eats things that he shouldn't? They are notorious for socks, bags,underwear, etc. although I have never caught my dogs doing anything like that..I'm sure he'll be fine but bloodwork is always a good idea, I get it done once or twice a year..


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

i would get the blood work first and a physical work up.

if the vet feels something as robin suggested, then i'd go for x rays....


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

whiteleo said:


> One sure way to know if something is wrong on the inside is palpitation of the stomach, B.T.'s are stoic but if they are uncomfortable a good pressing on the stomach /abdomen will show some signs of discomfort. Is Tobi a dog who eats things that he shouldn't? They are notorious for socks, bags,underwear, etc. although I have never caught my dogs doing anything like that..I'm sure he'll be fine but bloodwork is always a good idea, I get it done once or twice a year..


I actually did that, last night i did some pressing, and he was just thinking i was trying to play with him and got all riled up and stuff :lol: He's definitely not the type to chew things up he's not supposed to, we got lucky in that respect, and the fact that he's so tired when we get home he goes in our bedroom and lays on the bed for hours. the only thing he puts in his mouth that isn't "his" is our shoes, and he just carries them around and hides them.


magicre said:


> i would get the blood work first and a physical work up.
> 
> if the vet feels something as robin suggested, then i'd go for x rays....


We'll do the bloodwork then, and get the physical exam, teeth etc see what our doc says :thumb:

Oh something else worth mentioning... after that last treatment for his feet and ears, his nails are slowly cleaning up... idk what is going on, but it's exciting.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

what was the treatment?

and that is good news.

david, just sayin', but if you should think kibble again with tobi, robin and i are going to come down there, kick you around a little and then take your dog. 

::::::::::::::::::said with all the love i can muster because i am making chicken soup::::::::::::::::::

and, btw, if i have to return to the south from where i was thrown out on my yankee A**, you will suffer


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## PDXdogmom (Jun 30, 2010)

I hope Tobi checks out fine and nothing serious is wrong with him. You clearly want him to accept and do well with raw, and I don't know what your history is with him. But I don't see that kibble would have to be the only other option. I'd think that home-cooking or a base food like The Honest Kitchen Preference with adding your own meat could be alternatives if it came down to it.


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

magicre said:


> what was the treatment?
> 
> and that is good news.
> 
> ...


:lol: i won't make you guys come down here then... dang! XD

The treatment for his paws was originally for his little ear infection, it was so mild that the doctor had to take a second looks when he went back and forth, and he was like " wow, it's nice somebody coming in here with a dog that can still hear with such a mild ear infection" but anyways, it was very mild, and it was a bit yeasty, so he gave me some antifungal pills, anti yeasty stuff, some ear spray, and a mild steroid, along with some wipes... 300$ later... his nails are looking better and it wasn't even originally a treatment for his feet... which amazes me... maybe the steroids kickstarted his system into fighting the yeast? BTW, something to add... when he was on the steroid, he was eating 2-3lbs a day... sometimes more as he'd start digging through the trash " which he's never done before". the steroid was out of his system about april 21-25... and then he started to become picky again.. but before that... you could feed him anything, any size, any way... and he's devour it. it was actually kind of pleasing because he was eating like a dog. :lol:


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

steroids increase appetite....that's why...

i wonder if you're overfeeding him....even though he takes those hikes and they are grueling....are you still trying to feed him 2-3 lbs per day?


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## Tobi (Mar 18, 2011)

magicre said:


> steroids increase appetite....that's why...
> 
> i wonder if you're overfeeding him....even though he takes those hikes and they are grueling....are you still trying to feed him 2-3 lbs per day?


No, he only eats about 1lb 6-8oz on a given day, working out, hiking etc. when he eats 2-4lbs in one day generally he doesn't eat the following day, but... he's never just not eaten for like 3-4 days which was irritating. lol

we stopped feeding him large amounts as the steroids ran out, and left his system, we only upped the amount to help keep him a little satiated. as he was getting brazen enough to get into the trash (never done it before the roids) and tried to take food out of the girls hands.

I thought about the overfeeding bit Re, it's a possibility that he just DOESN'T need that much even though he's putting out so much energy,I'm always just gauging him by his weight, and physical appearance.


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