# My Rant for the Day



## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

This has happened 3 times in the last 3 days. I'll be walking down the street with Mateo, and some guy from down the street or across the street, will see him and shout, (LOUDLY): "*MATEO!!!!!* ..HOW'S MY BOY?...*MATEO!!!!!!*"

Or: " HEY, *MATEOOOO!!!*"

Or: "LOOK-- it's *MAATEEOOOOO!!!!*"

Three different guys, last few days. Each time, Mateo's head whips around at the sound of his name (and sometimes the familiarity of the voice), and PULLS me towards the dude to say hello. It takes all I can muster to keep him calm and in a "wait" command. I mean, what do these guys think was going to happen? Traffic is zipping along, and they are calling for my dog from _across_ the street... sometimes just standing there, waving and shouting...

I know I am going to hear about training my dog to sit, and wait patiently until I give him a release command. Okay, yes, that is the goal, the ideal.
But, Mateo is a very people-oriented dog-- especially if they know his name (even more if they are familiar to him.) I only knew 1 of these 3 men (of course, they act surprised that i don't remember them from... somewhere.) 

Whatever. Mateo LOVES people. Much more than I do (in general, lol), and loves to connect and get close. (No jumping, though- never).

Anyway, it's not like he's a person and he'll just look over and wave his paw to say "hi." He's a dog, a young dog... and there's _traffic!_

What are people thinking?!

Ok- rant over. *sigh*


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Yes, people are stupid. But they LOVE Mateo! 

You probably need to distract him when they start doing that. He's big enough that one day he might just pull you out into the street.

Plus, I think it's highly possible they don't love Mateo that much, but are really trying to flirt with you


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## lovemydogsalways (Mar 4, 2012)

Is it possible to just ignore and not even stop, just keep walking. I realize Mateo is a big dog and can probably stop you quick if he stopped, but I think I would just keep going and don't even let him stop. If that is rude to those men so be it. They are being rude for yelling across the street.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

if these are people you know...not that i expect them to listen, try reasoning with them.
if they are not reasonable, then tell them you cannot stop if they continue to distract him, and causing a potentially dangerous set of conditions for both you and the dog.

and if that doesn't work, as soon as they say something, turn and walk in the opposite direction...which will distract mateo..

and if that doesn't work, hit each and every one of them.

i get the same with my bubba...he wants to jump up on people...and i don't want him to, miss scarlett being one of the worst offenders..


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

xellil said:


> Yes, people are stupid. But they LOVE Mateo!
> 
> You probably need to distract him when they start doing that. He's big enough that one day he might just pull you out into the street.
> 
> Plus, I think it's highly possible they don't love Mateo that much, but are really trying to flirt with you


Ha-- no, it's Mateo they want to connect with; I am just a "means to an end..". 

Distraction may work, with a REALLY high value treat. Maybe.

I shall try.


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## wolfsnaps88 (Jan 2, 2012)

People ARE dumb. A lot of them are not dog smart. 

Its good that Mateo is a people person. My Dozer is...for some people. Of course, he is not a city dog and doesn't see people all the time. (We are hermits)

If life was perfect, our dogs would listen to every command, not let instinct take over, and we wouldn't need leashes. Life, as we know it, is not perfect. 

I know I will get flamed for this, but with Dozer, I use a pinch collar for certain things. He can rip my arm out of its socket if he gets excited and forgets his manners. This keeps me safe, it keeps him safe, and it may keep others safe too. I made a video on putting his pinch collar on but I lost it. I should make another one to show that my dog does not associate it with a negative experience. It causes him no harm. He knows that when he puts it on, we do something fun. He turns into wiggle butt McGee. He doesn't hate it and we use it properly. Is this a solution for you? Maybe, maybe not. I know some people just do NOT like them and I respect that. If works for me though. He is an angel 99% of the time. Its that 1% I worry about.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

wolfsnaps88 said:


> People ARE dumb. A lot of them are not dog smart.
> 
> Its good that Mateo is a people person. My Dozer is...for some people. Of course, he is not a city dog and doesn't see people all the time. (We are hermits)
> 
> ...


i won't flame you. you have to do what is best for you and the dog. he's huge.

does he have marks in his neck? is he bleeding? no. 

don't worry about what others think. they haven't walked a mile with your dog.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

NewYorkDogue said:


> Ha-- no, it's Mateo they want to connect with; I am just a "means to an end..".
> 
> Distraction may work, with a REALLY high value treat. Maybe.
> 
> I shall try.


Do any cute young women holler at Mateo? I'm sure they like Mateo alot, but I wonder how friendly they would be if you were old and fat. Or a guy.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

wolfsnaps88 said:


> People ARE dumb. A lot of them are not dog smart.
> 
> Its good that Mateo is a people person. My Dozer is...for some people. Of course, he is not a city dog and doesn't see people all the time. (We are hermits)
> 
> ...


I'm not flaming you - I used a prong for a long time. I rarely use it now, but even when I pick it up to move it around Rebel goes nuts, thinking he's going somewhere. 

Of course he does the same thing when I pick up a leash, or Snorkels' harness, but the prong was an absolute savior for us - without it, we'd still be wallering around in the driveway.


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## wolfsnaps88 (Jan 2, 2012)

MagicRe, thanks 

I would like to see someone walk a mile with Dozer. LOL He doesn't pull. He is a good boy. But deer and quads are his downfall. I have tried to break him of chasing quads with my husband riding around the yard. It just will not happen. If you think otherwise, I will happily give you my address and his leash and you are more than welcome to try 

There is a law that if you see a dog chasing a deer, you can shoot it. Yeah, I will use a pinch collar...


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

if bubba wouldn't look so stupid, i'd put a prong on him LOL

because everything is his downfall.

he tries so hard to be good, but he's mentally deranged from past abuse and has no impulse control....he does the best he can...

so we tolerate him....

i bet your dog is better behaved than mr. willful.


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

magicre said:


> if these are people you know...not that i expect them to listen, try reasoning with them.
> if they are not reasonable, then tell them you cannot stop if they continue to distract him, and causing a potentially dangerous set of conditions for both you and the dog.
> 
> and if that doesn't work, as soon as they say something, turn and walk in the opposite direction...which will distract mateo..
> ...


Well, I did tell the men (ok, who am I kidding-- i was cursing as I tried to contain Mateo's excitement and his lurching towards them) that it was NOT a good idea to call to him from across the street. And the one guy that I did know should know better-- he has dogs!-- but he and Mateo have a love relationship that is beyond explanation...

I kind of like your third suggestion...:tsk:


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

magicre said:


> if bubba wouldn't look so stupid, i'd put a prong on him LOL
> 
> because everything is his downfall.
> 
> ...


OK I'm going to tell something I've never told, and that i horribly regret.

The prong collar was so great for Rebel and Snorkels was so all over the place, I got one for her. I realized pretty quickly it was silly, but I am still embarrassed at how I looked walking that little tiny dog down the street on a prong collar.


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## Celt (Dec 27, 2010)

<I wish scenario> Carry a paintball gun, shoot man being dumb. Problem would quickly go away. 
Reality, you're in for a lot of training. Maybe set up a similar situation and practice with him. But I have to admit I would probably go with a "behavior modifying" collar as a back up.


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

xellil said:


> Do any cute young women holler at Mateo? I'm sure they like Mateo alot, but I wonder how friendly they would be if you were old and fat. Or a guy.


The answer to that is "yes-- if they have had a few drinks." There is an Irish pub just a few doors down, with outside tables. Women will shriek, coo, and call his name from down the street... but only when drunk. 

I believe that, in general, women have better judgment when it comes to safety...(but they have to be sober).


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

wolfsnaps88 said:


> People ARE dumb. A lot of them are not dog smart.
> 
> Its good that Mateo is a people person. My Dozer is...for some people. Of course, he is not a city dog and doesn't see people all the time. (We are hermits)
> 
> ...


Yes-- I like your "If life was perfect..." statement. That's reality...

Also, I did have a breeder of DDBs tell me that he has a male that is not only certified in obedience training, but also CGC--- and even a regular prong collar is not enough to control him. He actually had the prongs *sharpened*! 

He said that I should definitely look into getting a well-made prong collar for when Mateo grows even bigger...

Hey, I am not ruling it out; Mateo already outweighs me by a few pounds. And I know his triggers...

Until I reach that decision, though, training is ongoing and consistent...

And I am building up my arm muscles


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

Ahhh, the downfalls of having a dog that is very popular....



I understand, Murph has his own fan club


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## NewYorkDogue (Sep 27, 2011)

meggels said:


> Ahhh, the downfalls of having a dog that is very popular....
> 
> 
> 
> I understand, Murph has his own fan club


Yes-- it's literally like walking around with somebody famous or something. If people don't know him personally, they have "heard about" Mateo, and want to meet him... even have pictures taken with him. 

I even had a car drive by and somebody yelling out the window, "We love you, Mateo!", as they drove off...

It's sweet.. but weird.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

I find it funny actually. A little obnoxious but might be a good way to make friends  

There is a woman at alston that knows Sprocket since he was a pup. She doesn't know my name but its always "SPROCKET!!"


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Ooh.. maybe you could get him really famous.

My cousin has a bulldog - they just moved from New York to LA but her dog is on calendars and all kinds of stuff, because she worked for a magazine in NYC and just living there gave her dog lots of opportunities.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Sprocket said:


> I find it funny actually. A little obnoxious but might be a good way to make friends
> 
> There is a woman at alston that knows Sprocket since he was a pup. She doesn't know my name but its always "SPROCKET!!"


If I passed you on the street, i would not know you. But I might recognize Sprocket! Especially if you had all three together.


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## meggels (May 30, 2010)

NewYorkDogue said:


> Yes-- it's literally like walking around with somebody famous or something. If people don't know him personally, they have "heard about" Mateo, and want to meet him... even have pictures taken with him.
> 
> I even had a car drive by and somebody yelling out the window, "We love you, Mateo!", as they drove off...
> 
> It's sweet.. but weird.


Omg rofl! 


Honestly, Murph's popularity is at the point where it's beginning to get a little annoying LOL. 


He works every Sat/Sun with me for Natural Balance so he's in stores and that is where his fan base is. I have people that come on the days they know he will be there...the owners have told me how people have come in asking where Murph is and they said "oh no, he'll be here tomorrow..." and they come back the next day.

One guy a few weeks ago was standing in line and he saw Murph and goes "Is that Murphy?" and I was like "...yes" and he was like "My son is always talking about him. He actually cut out a picture of a french bulldog, wrote Murphy on it and put it in a frame" (what the hell LOL). People are always coming up to him and already know his name and I dunno who the heck they are. We were in puppy class a few weeks ago and this guy comes up to me and is like "Is that Wombat? (His nickname at one of the stores)" And I was like "yes...yes...this is Wombat. But his real name is Murphy." It really is outrageous lol.


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## Sprocket (Oct 4, 2011)

xellil said:


> If I passed you on the street, i would not know you. But I might recognize Sprocket! Especially if you had all three together.


Yeah I tend to be a quite person but Sprocket an outgoing little squirt. He would jump right in your arms


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

xellil said:


> OK I'm going to tell something I've never told, and that i horribly regret.
> 
> The prong collar was so great for Rebel and Snorkels was so all over the place, I got one for her. I realized pretty quickly it was silly, but I am still embarrassed at how I looked walking that little tiny dog down the street on a prong collar.


so i'm not alone....LOL

did you take pics?

more importantly, did it work?


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

magicre said:


> so i'm not alone....LOL
> 
> did you take pics?
> 
> more importantly, did it work?


No pics! I actually did it because everything I put on her was choking her - at the time I didn't realize she has a windpipe that partially collapses and causes the cough - and she pulled like crazy. So it did stop the choking. 

But she's so defiant she refused to give in to it - I never corrected her (afraid that even a small correction would yank her neck) but she would slowly walk into the pressure and then keep pushing on it until I gave in and dropped the leash. OR, when I thought we were walking along fine she would suddenly turn and run back the other way. I only used it for about three days. 

The only good thing about it was that it stopped the choking and before we got it we couldn't walk 10 feet without her starting to cough. But I finally found a harness that fixed the choking problem.

I've never even put a regular collar on her since because I felt so bad, and know now that type of collar is not a blanket fix for every dog.

So now she has the D-ring in the middle of her back and pulls like crazy and goes wherever she wants. Which is why when we walk she normally has no leash at all. It's just easier than trying to herd her. As usual, I gave up and let her have her way.

there was actually a lady in our novice class with a chihuahua and she used a little tiny prong collar.


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## wolfsnaps88 (Jan 2, 2012)

Xellil. Thank you for sharing that. I think, in the right situation, it can work. But like you said, not for everything. And not if used incorrectly. 

Dozer with his thick muscley, fat neck, it works for. I would hesitate with a little dog (unless it was a monster). Of course, there are other antipulling devices out there. I have tried many with him. He is a Mac truck though. I never have to pull or correct him when he is on it either. He just "knows". I have tried to go without it and the little stinker reverts to his old ways. 

New York Dogue, sorry to have derailed your initial rant. We just can't fix stupid. And so many people are. So we have to figure out how to fix the dog (even when there is nothing to fix).


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## Dude and Bucks Mamma (May 14, 2011)

That's too funny. I can't picture Snorkels with a prong collar. Hahaha

We used to use one here too. Buck is JUST SO STUBBORN that I finally said, "You know what? I quit. I'm getting him a prong collar". I onlly needed it for about a month and, while he still pulls sometimes, it isn't too bad and it's controllable with just a slip lead. I don't think they are a bad thing at all.

Buck is very well known at the dog park. He gets so excited that, when I have him laying down in the double gated area in between the big dog area and the small dog area, he howls while he's laying down like he just has so much excitement bubbling over that he just can't contain himself. Of course, we wait until he HAS contained himself before we let him in but when he is howling we have heard people yell, "Buck's here!" from the big dog area before we even let him in.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

I love howly dogs! AWOOOOO! i can just imagine that. Hilarious.

We did try all the no-pull stuff on Rebel also. And just plain behavioral training with lots of treats, for about six months. But at some point we had to be able to get out of the driveway and go for a walk. I've not regretted the prong on him one bit.


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## Donna Little (May 31, 2011)

xellil said:


> *OK I'm going to tell something I've never told, and that i horribly regret.*
> 
> The prong collar was so great for Rebel and Snorkels was so all over the place, I got one for her. I realized pretty quickly it was silly, but I am still embarrassed at how I looked walking that little tiny dog down the street on a prong collar.


You do remember how terribly wrong things went last time you confessed something on this forum don't you? :wink: Do you need to refer back to a certain thread that shall remain unnamed...


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## xchairity_casex (Oct 8, 2011)

are those guys being dumb?absolutly but dont look at it like that when im faced with idiotic people and/or there dogs i LOVE it! its a challange for me to see how well i work with cesar i purposly g into high distraction areas to work with him becuase for me its like a thrill LOL and when he does good its so exhillirating i just feel like skipping all the way home.

when i first brought Cesar home and on walks he would try lunging at other dogs (not aggressivly but jsut like OMG I WANNA PLAY!!) so everyday (even now0 i take the route with the most dogs i even go 2 blocks out of my way becuase they have a few dogs who run out barking at Cesar one of which is agerman shepard tag team they see us coming and crouch under the big pines in there yard and wait once we get close jump out and run at the fence barking used to drive cesar nuts but i walk him past them all the time and he doesnt even bat an eye there way anymore.

my sister used to drive me bonkers when she would walk with me and the dogs becuase if another dog was near se would freak out and say "ets go in the other direction" and i would say "no way! lets go!"


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Donna Little said:


> You do remember how terribly wrong things went last time you confessed something on this forum don't you? :wink: Do you need to refer back to a certain thread that shall remain unnamed...


Oh Lord. I wonder if charity has made a sex toy out of a prong collar.


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## xchairity_casex (Oct 8, 2011)

xellil said:


> Oh Lord. I wonder if charity has made a sex toy out of a prong collar.


nope not i im afraid im not into the whole BDSM thing


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Im not even gonna ask what BDSM means.


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## xchairity_casex (Oct 8, 2011)

welll it means......LOl j/k not gonna take this thread over too!


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## sozzle (May 18, 2011)

xellil said:


> OK I'm going to tell something I've never told, and that i horribly regret.
> 
> The prong collar was so great for Rebel and Snorkels was so all over the place, I got one for her. I realized pretty quickly it was silly, but I am still embarrassed at how I looked walking that little tiny dog down the street on a prong collar.


Excuse my ignorance but I have no idea what a prong collar is...although I do have a vision of a Dominatrix with something spiky around someone's neck??


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## wolfsnaps88 (Jan 2, 2012)

A pinch/prong collar has spikes inverted, which press up against a dog's neck. I know, sounds horrible right? Like out of a torture room or something. 

What it does is put pressure on the neck, like when a dog uses its teeth to correct another dog. 

I put one on (in my size as Dozer's is too big) to see what its like. If used correctly, the pressure is on all prongs so its not that bad. They even make rubber tips to make it less intense. I do understand how some people would not like it. It is pretty hardcore looking. 

I find it much more humane than, say, a choke collar which pushes on the trachea, literally choking the dog. Or a shock collar.


I should add that I put said prong collar on myself at work, while customers and employees watched. Do I get bonus points for looking like a fetishist?


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## chowder (Sep 7, 2008)

I don't know if it would work on a huge dog, but we got the No-pull harness for Shade that was recommended here instead of a prong collar. He is about 90 pounds and would almost pull me off my feet on walks. I refused to walk him because he was so uncontrollable, especially if he saw another dog.

The first time he took off with it on, he got to the end of it and fell over on his side. He NEVER once pulled on it again and it has worked perfectly for taking walks. Now if he see's another dog he'll look at them, then turn and look at me (we combined it with the "look at that' training). 

I LOVE that harness and it's super easy to put on him.


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

Here is a photo - it applies even pressure around the neck, rather than one pressure point such as a flat collar. No choking or pulling.

I had my husband walk me around the neighborhood in one (after dark of course) giving me "corrections" unexpectedly so I could see how they feel. 

The one I used had rounded tips (no biting) and you can also get rubber tips for them. Yes, you can be cruel with them, especially if you use spike tips. Which I'm sure some people do. My personal impression of them around my neck wasn't pain but just a very weird pressure from all directions.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

Donna Little said:


> You do remember how terribly wrong things went last time you confessed something on this forum don't you? :wink: Do you need to refer back to a certain thread that shall remain unnamed...


OMG. you are SUCH a troublemaker LOL


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

xellil said:


> Here is a photo - it applies even pressure around the neck, rather than one pressure point such as a flat collar. No choking or pulling.
> 
> I had my husband walk me around the neighborhood in one (after dark of course) giving me "corrections" unexpectedly so I could see how they feel.
> 
> The one I used had rounded tips (no biting) and you can also get rubber tips for them. Yes, you can be cruel with them, especially if you use spike tips. Which I'm sure some people do. My personal impression of them around my neck wasn't pain but just a very weird pressure from all directions.


your husband had to walk you around with a prong collar? i bet people thought you guys were into bdsm. LOL


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## liquid (Dec 28, 2011)

So the prong collar helps with pulling??
Eevee's normally very good on her walks, but if another dog walks by... I need to REALLY brace myself, lol!


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

liquid said:


> So the prong collar helps with pulling??
> Eevee's normally very good on her walks, but if another dog walks by... I need to REALLY brace myself, lol!


If used properly, I believe it is a miracle worker. We had private training with one, over a several hour period. The difference was night and day.

My dog was like Evee - he was so reactive to other dogs it made walking impossible. I tried everything. At one point I was walking with a Halti AND a harness. We also did alot of behavioral training but once he zeroed in on another animal there was no stopping him.

And he was hurting himself. he sliced his face up, fell, tripped, it was pretty awful. i hurt MYSELF because I would get tangled up with him and we'd both go to the ground.

the prong collar was a lifesaver for us.


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## liquid (Dec 28, 2011)

xellil said:


> If used properly, I believe it is a miracle worker. We had private training with one, over a several hour period. The difference was night and day.
> 
> My dog was like Evee - he was so reactive to other dogs it made walking impossible. I tried everything. At one point I was walking with a Halti AND a harness. We also did alot of behavioral training but once he zeroed in on another animal there was no stopping him.
> 
> ...


How do you properly use it without hurting the dog? 

That's exactly how Eevee acts! She doesnt even react aggressively, she just gets so excited to see another dog that she wants to meet them RIGHTNOWATTHISMOMENT.

I end up getting hurt myself as well. Eevee is almost 40lbs now and I'm 100lbs. When she's excited, she's *strong*. And especially now that she's becoming almost half my weight, she has the ability to knock me over and drag me around without really trying, haha. Maybe I should just put her into weight pulling competitions :heh:


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## xellil (Apr 4, 2011)

liquid said:


> How do you properly use it without hurting the dog?
> 
> That's exactly how Eevee acts! She doesnt even react aggressively, she just gets so excited to see another dog that she wants to meet them RIGHTNOWATTHISMOMENT.
> 
> I end up getting hurt myself as well. Eevee is almost 40lbs now and I'm 100lbs. When she's excited, she's *strong*. And especially now that she's becoming almost half my weight, she has the ability to knock me over and drag me around without really trying, haha. Maybe I should just put her into weight pulling competitions :heh:


IF you decide to get a prong collar, I would get a Herm Sprenger rather than what they sell at pet stores. The prongs are thicker and rounder.

here is a link to a video:
Video: How to Use a Prong Collar as a Basic Dog Training Tool | eHow.com

My goal was to not let him hit the end of the leash at high speed. We practiced only doing small "corrections" rather than hard jerks. So we started out with a very short leash, and went from there. And all the rules of loose leash walking applied, at least for me. Verbal cues, changing directions, keeping attention, lots of treats etc.


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## liquid (Dec 28, 2011)

xellil said:


> IF you decide to get a prong collar, I would get a Herm Sprenger rather than what they sell at pet stores. The prongs are thicker and rounder.
> 
> here is a link to a video:
> Video: How to Use a Prong Collar as a Basic Dog Training Tool | eHow.com
> ...


Thanks for the info, xellil :smile:


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