# homemade pre-made raws?



## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

Wondering if any of you can provide insight on the following recipes I am consider making up for my dogs as pre-made raws rather than buying them from the store...I have small dogs so a few batches would last awhile. To get the bone content (I don't have a bone grinder), and for the dental benefit, 4+ meals a week would be bone-in chicken or pork. Their other meals are either Ziwi, THK, NV pre-made raw or Stella & Chewy's Premade Raw...these would be to replace the pre-made frozens.

Beef Cubes (Pre-made, homemade raw) Recipe
2.5 cups chopped beef
2.5 cups lean ground beef
1/8 cup liver
1/8 cup beef heart
½ cup cooked/mashed sweet potato
¼ cup coconut oil
1/8 cup Nupro

Grind everything up together either in food processor or mix thoroughly with hand mixer, freeze in 1 ounce ice cube trays.


Pork Pre-Made Homemade Raw Recipe
1 cup ground pork
1 cup chopped pork
1 tablespoon liver (not sure on the ratio here?)
1 tablespoon other organ (suggestions?)
1 tablespoon sardines
1 tablespoon salmon oil
2 tablespoons Nupro

Grind everything up together either in food processor or mix thoroughly with hand mixer, freeze in 1 ounce ice cube trays.



I am unsure of ratios and probably didn't do them correctly so I need advice there. Thanks!


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

Looks good minus the Nupro and sweet potatoes. No need to use lean beef unless the dog is overweight, 80/20's good.


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

SamWu1 said:


> Looks good minus the Nupro and sweet potatoes. No need to use lean beef unless the dog is overweight, 80/20's good.


Thanks, I didn't know that about the beef. The higher fat stuff is cheaper so I'll go w/ 80/20. I use the nupro b'c it helps me feel 100% comfortable w/ raw feeding, a lot of my friends who feed raw to their small dogs recommend it too...and sweet potato just because they LOVE it, but the amount is minimal...so hopefully it's OK. Since it's mashed/pulverized they can still get some nutrition out of it from what I understand? I have a somewhat picky eater that I do what I can to keep her eating. I know it's not necessary though...so I didn't put any in the pork recipe...

I'm still getting used to the whole raw thing and am slowly going all the way ha ha... its just been a slow process/transition, but that's better than never, right?


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

I make a grind for my buddy's 70lbs. APBT because he's lazy and it consists of 10 ounces of 80/20 ground beef, 2 ounces of liver, 2 ounces of liver with 2 skinned chicken necks for bone, all coarsely grinded then stuffed in a tupperware tub with a squirt of salmon oil.

He eats 2 tubs a day and gets a few chunks of beef heart twice a week. Alternate meats depending on what's the cheapest, poultry, pork, beef and lamb. If I'm lucky, venison.


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

LOL that one tub would last my whole crew about 2 days, they are in the 3.5-7 lb range, and 1 10 lber that has the slowest metabolism known to dogs.


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

flippedstars said:


> I use the nupro b'c it helps me feel 100% comfortable w/ raw feeding, a lot of my friends who feed raw to their small dogs recommend it too


There is nothing in the Nupro that isn't already in the diet you are feeding. This product MAY help a kibble fed dog but is of no use to a raw fed dog. It also has some inappropriate ingredients along with some that are already in your dog's diet.



> ...and sweet potato just because they LOVE it, but the amount is minimal...so hopefully it's OK.


Sweet potato has sugar which isn't healthy but won't hurt your dog. I prefer not to feed my dogs carbs at all. He will get no nutrients from sweet potato that aren't already in the diet.



> I'm still getting used to the whole raw thing and am slowly going all the way ha ha... its just been a slow process/transition, but that's better than never, right?


Yes, you are getting a good start. I think in time you will naturally gravitate more and more towards the RMBs and further and further away from taking all this time mixing this stuff up.

Nutritionally you are supplying your dog with what he needs even without the Nupro.


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

RawFedDogs said:


> There is nothing in the Nupro that isn't already in the diet you are feeding. This product MAY help a kibble fed dog but is of no use to a raw fed dog. It also has some inappropriate ingredients along with some that are already in your dog's diet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I started out just doing THK instead of a kibble meal then started adding in RMB (chicken wings/tips) for teeth then started feeding half their meals kibble half that way, then eliminated the kibble and did half THK/half premade & rmb. I agree that eventually I will probably "go all the way" its just easier for me to learn in baby steps, I know lots switch cold turkey I guess its just easier for me this way...They get RMB 2-3 times a week currently but I'd like to kind of eliminate most THK and storebought pre-mades. B'c we work and AM is already hectic, I've been thinking of making my own...it takes my smaller 2 AGES to eat raw meating bones or even a chunk of meat a bit less than an ounce so...yeah. I think this process has worked pretty well for us b'c I have small dogs and I feel I can wait to go one step further til I have researched and am ready. 

Maybe I will cut back the nupro a bit. The only reason I will keep the sweet potato in a bit is b'c of the one dog that just isn't sure what she thinks of red meats without it...I do know she isn't going to "get" much from it but if it gets her to eat red meats its worth it for me.

Do the ratios sound somewhat on target tho as far as meat/organs?

My dogs are 3.5, 3.75, 6.75 and 11 lbs...so i want every bite to count nutritionally and I just don't feel kibble achieves that ata ll lol.


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## BrownieM (Aug 30, 2010)

Flipped - I agree that sometimes you must take baby steps :smile: That is exactly what I have been doing. What you are doing now is so much better than kibble. Just know that!


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## RawFedDogs (Jun 16, 2008)

flippedstars said:


> Do the ratios sound somewhat on target tho as far as meat/organs?
> 
> My dogs are 3.5, 3.75, 6.75 and 11 lbs...so i want every bite to count nutritionally and I just don't feel kibble achieves that ata ll lol.


Most people thing organs should be about 10% to 15% of the diet. I think that is somewhere close. 

In the beef cube mix, you are feeding about 5 1/8 cups of meat. With the previous ratio, organs should be between half and 3/4 cup. FYI, heart, nutritionally, is not organ. It's muscle meat.

In the pork mix, you are feeding about 2 1/16 cups of meat. According to our ratio, you should be feeding about .2 to .3 cups of organs (3 to 5 tablespoons). There are 16 tablespoons/cup.

I hope my math is correct. :smile:

With all that said, I am not a big proponent of ratios in diets. I don't believe in feeding numbers. Anything even remotely close to the above numbers will work very well. You won't be able to tell the difference in your dogs. Notice when I figured these numbers, I only used meat/fat and organs. The other stuff has no bearing on the diet.


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

Every dog is different and my ratios aren't all that accurate nor do they need to be but I'm doing about 60% muscle meat and fat, 20% organ (mostly liver and kidney with a bit of whatever else I have) and about 20% bone.

Very rough figures but it's worked well for my guy so I'll keep at it until his poop or condition tells me otherwise.


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

Thanks guys...I will up the organs in both. That is why I asked. I'm still learning correct ratios and how to figure them out, as I said I really, really suck at math 

I am also thinking to the first one, I will add a can of oysters ... high in zinc. I have read multiple places now that zinc is sometimes lacking with a raw and/or pre-made diet? Anyway, I guess it shouldn't HURT to add the oysters, and in the 2nd pork one, the sardines should add the zinc.

I really need the convenience of pre-mades right now but want to do it myself as that way I know the quality of ingredients and actual amounts put in. As I said they do get several RMB meals a week too. 

I also decided to cut the nupro out of the mix, and instead mix in appropriate amounts as I feel necessary to the thawed product.

I don't think I need to add bone as they get that 4 times a week or so? and the chicken wing tips are pretty bone heavy from what I've read??


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

flippedstars said:


> Thanks guys...I will up the organs in both. That is why I asked. I'm still learning correct ratios and how to figure them out, as I said I really, really suck at math
> 
> I am also thinking to the first one, I will add a can of oysters ... high in zinc. I have read multiple places now that zinc is sometimes lacking with a raw and/or pre-made diet? Anyway, I guess it shouldn't HURT to add the oysters, and in the 2nd pork one, the sardines should add the zinc.
> 
> ...


My ratio measuring is as unscientific as it gets. I'm just basing upon a whole prey animal and making very rough estimates. I'm guesstimating about 30% edible bone, edible organs make up around 15-20% and edible muscle meat consists of the rest.

Like I've said, very unscientific and by no means accurate but works well for me and several of my friends. Whole prey would be the absolute best, whole chickens with head and innards, whole rabbits with head and innards, feeder mice, guinea pigs, etc. One, I can't find whole prey animals completely intact unless I order online. Two, I feed mainly red meat and whole prey isn't happening.

If money was no object and I had a bit more space, I would be feeding all whole prey animals, whole rabbits, poultry, suckling pigs, sectioned young calves, etc. I neither have the facility or the budget to do so but I'm doing what I can.


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## sassymaxmom (Dec 7, 2008)

Beef has plenty of zinc, chicken and pork are lower. Make up your recipes as is and change if you determine a need. You don't want to introduce too many new things at once. You won't need a whole can of oysters either, they are potent things. 1 ounce completely covers 38 pound Max's daily needs if he gets no zinc elsewhere. Very rough estimating here - Max gets 10 ounces a day so if a can is 12 ounces it might work for 7.5 pounds of low zinc meat.

I have the analysis for nupro. It has a lot of potassium and magnesium which are low in raw but I sure don't want to use it, not a fan of the foods it contains. Loads of extra calcium, sodium and phosphorus and flaxseed and yeast of any sort don't interest me.

Samwu1, Max did just fine on raw without adding in the magnesium, potassium and all that my probably inept analysis of his diet repeatedly comes up low in but with those added he seems even better.


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## schtuffy (May 17, 2010)

SamWu1 said:


> He eats 2 tubs a day and gets a few chunks of beef heart twice a week. Alternate meats depending on what's the cheapest, poultry, pork, beef and lamb. If I'm lucky, venison.


So where are you getting your cheap lamb and venison from? I swear I've scoured a lot of grocery stores and never seen venison around here!


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## isabellak (Oct 26, 2010)

SamWu1,
what kind of a grinder do you use to grind the meat and bones?


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## flippedstars (May 22, 2010)

All the meat/bone grinders I've seen are like $500-$600 for anything decent:frown:


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## isabellak (Oct 26, 2010)

I had looked at this one on Amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000CEURE/ref=ord_cart_shr?ie=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER

Reviewers who are using it to grind dog food said it did great on chicken, but probably wouldn't handle beef/pork bones.

I guess that's when you would need to invest in a commercial grinder.


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

schtuffy said:


> So where are you getting your cheap lamb and venison from? I swear I've scoured a lot of grocery stores and never seen venison around here!


I would hardly call it cheap but at $2.20 a lbs. for lamb, it isn't terrible. The venison I seldom get. My neighbor has friends that hunts so I get a tid bit here and there but never in abundance.


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

isabellak said:


> SamWu1,
> what kind of a grinder do you use to grind the meat and bones?


I used to use a heavy duty manual grinder but it got tiresome after I got the second dog so now I just buy it from a local butcher that sells meat grinds specifically for dogs. TQDF.com


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## SamWu1 (Oct 15, 2010)

isabellak said:


> I had looked at this one on Amazon:
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0000CEURE/ref=ord_cart_shr?ie=UTF8&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER
> 
> Reviewers who are using it to grind dog food said it did great on chicken, but probably wouldn't handle beef/pork bones.
> ...


Home grinders would handle poultry and rabbit bones with ease but with beef or venison it isn't happening. You would need industrial commercial grade grinders that would cost $10K+ if you want it to last more than one session.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

hi, sounds like you're already evolving and thinking through your choices of what to feed and what's best for you dog...

just my two cents......some believe that sweet potato, while offering no nutritional value, won't hurt, but sweet potatoes have sugar in them, which is the leading cause of periodontal disease in dogs.


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