# Milk Thistle for liver enzymes?



## Mondo (Dec 20, 2011)

Hello,

Toby Shih Tzu had some blood work done, prior to lump removal. His liver enzymes have doubled in the past 3 years. I don't know the exact enzyme, but the vet said 100 was high normal, he was 200, in 2009, and this week he's at 400. We are doing a bile acids test prior to surgery. 

My holistic vet had suggesed milk thistle for Tuffy, as he has slight elevated liver enzymes.

Both boys get 200mg of Sam-e daily.

Anyone use milk thistle?


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## Liz (Sep 27, 2010)

Milk Thistle at 200 mg per ten pounds of dog or this Liver Cleanse by Health Plus which you can get through vitacost.com. I like Milk Thistle first though. Dandelion is another good detoxifier.


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

Yes, my friends 14yo pug takes milk thistle. His ALT levels Mar last year were 501, then 30 days later 184, then 30 days later 245 and this week 213. He's been on the milk thistle since the 501 blood count, it does work. We also modified his diet from Science Diet to Orijen and pre-made raw with canned and some PMR, which I believe has helped as well. 
Stinks like hell though! I'm in the middle of researching liver disease to help find out what's going on and what we can do to help get his levels lower.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

what do you feed your dogs?

what's a typical day?


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## Mondo (Dec 20, 2011)

Today 200 grams each. 80 grams of chicken neck, 120 grams of ground sheep. 

Typically they get chicken neck almost daily. Yesterday gizzards and chicken neck. Day before duck neck and beef chunks. Duck neck, chicken wings, some chopped beef and liver, a bit of canned tripe. some canned sardines in water. I try to mix things up a bit. Tuffy is a picky eater and his appetite has been up and down lately, so I don't give as much bone sometimes, since he'll refuse. Today I gave him chicken necks first, and he ate well. He's on metacam for a torn cruciate, seems to affect his appetite. Toby is a bottomless pit, will eat anything.


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

Mondo said:


> Today 200 grams each. 80 grams of chicken neck, 120 grams of ground sheep.
> 
> Typically they get chicken neck almost daily. Yesterday gizzards and chicken neck. Day before duck neck and beef chunks. Duck neck, chicken wings, some chopped beef and liver, a bit of canned tripe. some canned sardines in water. I try to mix things up a bit. Tuffy is a picky eater and his appetite has been up and down lately, so I don't give as much bone sometimes, since he'll refuse. Today I gave him chicken necks first, and he ate well. He's on metacam for a torn cruciate, seems to affect his appetite. Toby is a bottomless pit, will eat anything.


metacam.....because it's a non steroidal anti inflammatory, it can and will affect liver enzymes....i don't see anything wrong with his diet...but i agree that it would be a good idea to support his liver.....with milk thistle to start....


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## Mondo (Dec 20, 2011)

MollyWoppy said:


> Yes, my friends 14yo pug takes milk thistle. His ALT levels Mar last year were 501, then 30 days later 184, then 30 days later 245 and this week 213. He's been on the milk thistle since the 501 blood count, it does work. We also modified his diet from Science Diet to Orijen and pre-made raw with canned and some PMR, which I believe has helped as well.
> Stinks like hell though! I'm in the middle of researching liver disease to help find out what's going on and what we can do to help get his levels lower.


I was instructed by my regular vet to give Sam-e. 200mg daily. SAM-e 200 mg - iHerb.com 
Not sure it is doing any good based on the blood work .. but the holistic vet suggested to continue it for Tuffy. Toby hasn't been to the holistic vet yet.


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## DaneMama (Jun 27, 2008)

Its definitely a good idea to start the milk thistle asap. Its a good thing to give alongside an NSAID like metacam just to support the liver, even if the dog has a healthy liver.


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## Janet At Nutro (Mar 11, 2011)

I have been giving Tank Milk Thistle everyday for about five years now. I started giving it to him
when he began taking Deramxx. Every year I have Tank's bloodwork done and the vet and I have been very 
pleased with the results. I believe that the Milk Thistle has made all the difference.


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## MollyWoppy (Mar 19, 2010)

How are his teeth too? I read somewhere that if there's something wrong with their teeth, it can cause elevated liver enzymes. 
(If what I read is wrong, I'd be very happy to be corrected).
I've been looking at the Sam-e too. I'm also going to join a yahoo's group about dog liver disease, it seems like there is a lot of good information in there. 
What I don't like is what I'm reading that they say the dog should be put on a low protein diet with lots of vegetables. And, feed meat with low copper levels. Heart, beef, beef liver and salmon have high copper. Chicken and chicken livers are more moderate. along with white fish.
Eggs are great, along with cottage cheese. Anyway, this is the stage I'm up to in my research, the diet. First I read fat is bad for the liver, then I read fat is great because it's easily digestible. So, lots more to go.....


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## magicre (Apr 7, 2010)

MollyWoppy said:


> How are his teeth too? I read somewhere that if there's something wrong with their teeth, it can cause elevated liver enzymes.
> (If what I read is wrong, I'd be very happy to be corrected).
> I've been looking at the Sam-e too. I'm also going to join a yahoo's group about dog liver disease, it seems like there is a lot of good information in there.
> What I don't like is what I'm reading that they say the dog should be put on a low protein diet with lots of vegetables. And, feed meat with low copper levels. Heart, beef, beef liver and salmon have high copper. Chicken and chicken livers are more moderate. along with white fish.
> Eggs are great, along with cottage cheese. Anyway, this is the stage I'm up to in my research, the diet. First I read fat is bad for the liver, then I read fat is great because it's easily digestible. So, lots more to go.....


vegetables act as a cleanser for the liver.

when the liver is affected, the idea is to cleanse it ...with humans, it means tons of veggies, very little fruit, less nutritious deep dark red meats...but lean meats are okay, such as goat and llama or ostrich.....

coconut oil is very good for liver problems....as is milk thistle and dandelion...

the liver, when it's not functioning properly, kicks that which should be metabolysed and then excreted....back into the blood stream..sometimes screwing up blood work....

cleaning the liver, letting it regenerate --- does the liver regenerate in dogs? it does with humans....

so i can see why veggies are recommended for liver problems....i give my dogs prophylactically some of my miracle juice that i'm using to clean my liver...

i think, just because dogs can eat high fat, doesn't mean they should never eat lean...if that makes sense.....it's always about balance...
mostly liver problems apply human solutions to a dog....such as lower, less nutritious animal proteins, more vegetable proteins.

you're talking about your friend's pug, right?

as we age, liver enzymes will elevate too....plus, there are kibbles whose names i can't mention here that can elevate livery enzymes, too. 

also nsaids and many other drugs will also.


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## Mondo (Dec 20, 2011)

Bile acids came back normal, so that is good news. Toby's liver is still functioning near normal Started both Tuffy and Toby on milk thistle today. Will be feeding them twice a day going forward. A small morning meal to take their milk thistle with prior to heading out to the workaday life.


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