Hi everybody, I switched to raw about three weeks ago because my 4 mo puppy was having diarrhea on kibble--even the bland stuff the vet gave us! A couple I met at the dog park told me about switching their 4 dogs to raw and the amazing benefits they saw, and I was sold! I cold-turkey switched her, and her poops almost automatically got better. We haven't been totally in the clear, 1 out of every 4-5 poops is still like melted frozen yogurt, and it's usually A LOT, which from what I've read is abnormal for dogs on a raw diet. The runny poop could be because when I initially switched her, I was feeding her boiled sweet potato or carrot at every meal which I read is unnecessary and can cause runny poops. For the first 2 and a half weeks she only ate chicken as she adjusted to the raw diet, and then I introduced pork on Saturday and beef/turkey on Sunday. Her poops after the new proteins were AWESOME: solid, dark in color, small.
This is essentially what she's eating now:
AM - raw chicken quarter; raw egg
PM - some combination of beef tips, ground beef, boneless turkey breasts, pork rib
(M, W, F she gets one chicken liver with her PM meal, and she gets fish oil every day with it. She also sometimes gets salmon/sardines with her AM meal).
BEFORE I introduced the new proteins this Saturday, she had started itching pretty bad, and it's gotten worse the past few days. She scratches at her hind quarters, her hips, her back, her ears. She's at the vet today getting checked out because of the itching, and they mentioned she may have a chicken allergy (there aren't any fleas/bugs visible). They're also extremely judgmental about feeding her raw bones, which makes me feel anxious and like I'm intentionally putting Leia in harm's way. Being honest, when she eats the pork ribs she barely chews them and it kind of freaks me out because I'm always certain they're going to cause an obstruction. I decided last night I wasn't going to give her pork ribs anymore and just stick with the boney meal being the chicken quarter. It's 30% bone, so her PM meal can be all boneless and her total bone content for the day would be around 15%, which is good, right?
Any advice on her daily menu, like should I add/change anything? Any advice on what the itching could be? When she initially started itching, she wasn't getting her fish oil regularly and I read somewhere it helps with dry skin during the winter. I live in North Texas and the allergies here are AWFUL and so is the weather because one day it's winter and the next day it's hot. I've been giving her Benadryl the past two days and it hasn't really helped her, at least not that I've noticed. Are there any other things that can help her with dry skin if that's all it is? Could it be a chicken allergy if her poops were only gross 1 out of every 4 to 5 times when that was exclusively all she was eating?
I know that was a lot, but my vet isn't helpful with her new diet and so I'm just looking for some support/advice. Thanks!
One more thing. I have been buying her meats at the grocery store. I get organic, grass fed, hormone/antibiotic free, blah blah blah. I saw somewhere grocery store meats can be bad because they may be bleached/filled with salt. I'd be interested in joining a co-op, I just don't know where to find one.
hi......that is quite a few proteins for only three weeks......
maybe you're intro'ing too many proteins too quickly......
how old is your dog and how much does she weigh?
i'd advise against giving benedryl, as benedryl has seizures as a side effect for dogs......
i would make sure i'm not overfeeding.........and start over.....with chicken for a few weeks, both bony and boneless.....stop feeding all of the other things
and slow down the introduction of proteins......
check the ingredient panel for sodium level. sodium level should be less than 100 mg per four ounce serving.
First of all, it sounds like you are feeding too much at once in the pm meal, along with organ,fish oil, and all the boneless together is probably causing the too soft poops. Stop the oil for now, and when you give organ, give it with bone in meals. I never give organ with boneless, it's asking for digestive trouble.
I also get get a lot of my meat from the grocery. Look at labels on the packaging to see what the sodium content is. The lower the better, and not all has sodium enhancements. When I buy chicken, for example I look for around 75 mg. Too much will also cause the poop issues you are seeing.
The bleaching you are talking about is in store bought tripe and intestines. They have to be to be sold for human consumption. There is no nutritional value in those, so don't bother. The biggest thing is looking at the sodium content.
And vets in general know very little if anything about nutrition. They are against raw majority of the time, because they just don't understand it.
JENNY mom to
Reba-Red Merle Australian Shepherd
Copper-Red Merle Australian Shepherd (my heart dog)/Rodeo-Red Tri Australian Shepherd
Aussie-Blue Merle Australian Shepherd
Lucky-Blue Tick Hound (or some sort of hound!) All fed raw, the way nature intended!!
Shadow-Black Tri Australian Shepherd
It is impossible to know how big your 4-month-old puppy is, but I'm guessing BIG.
An option for your twice a day feedings (that I'd cut to one evening feeding once nearing full grown) is to split items like quarters into thighs and drumsticks and feed one at each meal (especially if the pup has any dirrahea issuses). Both boneless and ovely boney meals can cause issues in sensitive dogs.
Do be sure you are not overfeeding. Sodium, too much initial fat, and over-feeding are 3 of the biggest causes of dirrahea.
Do, as Jenny suggests, feed organs with a bone-in piece.
I think you are wise to stop feeding rib bones if your pup is swallowing large pieces whole. This really are an obstruction risk and your caution is well-advised.
I'm a dissenter on the need for an elaborate transition of proteins (with protracted time spent feeding chicken only) but the one advantage of adding one item at a time is seeing if it triggers a food intolerance or allergy.
Not sure about the conditions in North Texas, but in Los Angeles we are having an early Spring with high-pollen etc. Most skin allergies are contact allergies (not food based). I'd wipe the dog down (paws expecially) to see if that helps.
Thanks so much for the replies! She just hit 40lbs today, she's supposed to be between 60-70lbs when full grown. She eats about 2lbs of meat a day, which is about 3% of her adult body weight. Is that too much?
Look from overhead, does the dog show a defined "tuck" (waist)?
Palpate the ribs. How much of a fat layer is there?
I strongly prefer my dogs to run lean, especially as pups. That means showing a little rib, just not pointy hips. Society generally looks on rolly-polly puppies as a "good thing," when it is not.
You will have the best perspective on the amount to feed your dog. Just know that raw fed dogs tend to run lean, but well-muscled (especially as they mature). This leaner body type is far better for health and joints that the standards of obesity we've come to accept as "normal."
5% of current body sounds high to me, but—again—rely on your best judgement not any formula or doubts from those (like me) who have never seen your dog. Do accept that a raw fed pup does not have to look like a corpulent kibble fed puppy to be healthy. The opposite is true. Aim for lean with slow steady growth.
Last edited by OtherGuy; 02-13-2017 at 12:07 PM.
two pounds a day? whoa.......
yes, we differ about frequency of offering proteins.......usually because the people we see have a situation.....if my dog is rolling right along, transition to a variety of proteins is relatively fast......relatively.
if i have a dog who is being overfed, as yours is, from day one, i would step back and punt, feed less and start over.
I've seen far more "situations" from people feeding too much bone-in chicken (with too high a bone percentage) for too long than difficulties from feeding different proteins. By a long shot.
Too much bone is the #1 problem with novice raw feeders in my estimation. Too much bone causes dogs GI distress that sets up dogs poorly for their transition to raw. I concur that is is important (on many levels) not to overfeed.
One doesn't want to stimulate overly fast growth, put undue stress on developing joints, nor upset the GI tract with too much food.
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