Human nutrition ;)

[yuffie]

also, i have a new hobby and have been cooking more of my foods from scratch lately. i know not everyone has time to do this, but it gives me a new appreciation for what i put in my food and eat. it also makes me appreciate the food better because i work to make it.

[magicre]

I'm interested in nutrition too and have been doing a little research on the side along with doggie nutrition. I don't think potatoes are that bad for people, i mean lots of grains and even fruits have starch. I think where it gets bad is when people put all that butter, salt, sour cream, etc on them is when they aren't that good. potato skins actually have some good nutrition in them too. i think if u want to eat better, stay away from fast food, cold cut meats, sugary drinks, overly processed foods (the ones with all those chemicals ingredients in it), high fructose corn syrup, and hydrogenated oils. like dog nutrition, the closer to nature food is, the more nutritious it will be for you. moderation is key and also try to get some variety. and don't forget to exercise! hope that helps a little :)

i agree with much of what you say about moderation and exercise...

potatoes were a staple during a time of great starvation....they are so unnecessary..and anything you get from potatoes you can get from other sources...same holds true with grains...

this is not to say that one should never eat a potatoe....or ice cream...or the occasional big mac...

as a staple, though? if it were all i had to eat....yeah...but these foods were not meant to be staples....

we have no evolved so much that we need them....we need protein...we need veggies...occasionally fruit...nuts and seeds....we were hunter/gatherers...

we, like dogs, have adapted to farming...but we are not built to eat that way.....nor were we meant to make milk the staple....we have adapted and not very well, considering the great allergies and asthma suffering that has increased these past several hundred years. good marketing though.

no. a lifetime of bread, which is processed and potatoes and rice which are starches and cereals which are processed....puts a great strain on the pancreas and the liver and the kidneys.....

even body builders don't eat white potatoes....why then would i feed that to my dog...

[magicre]

also, i have a new hobby and have been cooking more of my foods from scratch lately. i know not everyone has time to do this, but it gives me a new appreciation for what i put in my food and eat. it also makes me appreciate the food better because i work to make it.

would that everyone would do that...it takes less time to create a simple dish than it does to wait in line at a fast food joint...

good on you!!

[eternalstudent]

debate, as natalie says...it is good. it is how we learn...

bread, pasta, potatoes, rice...etc...all, if not used in the boston marathon....will turn to fat in your system....it clogs you up and slows you down....it gives a person a feeling, not so much of fullness, but of overfilling the tank....

The debate about sugar and fat need to be separated. Sugar in the body is not turned into fat and like-wise fat is not turned in to sugar when you starve yourself of sugars. (I can provide the biochemistry evidence for this if anyone wants it or is interested in it)

If you eat sugar your body will simply store the digested fats you absorb in your food.

Hence I watched a program about a child who ate nothing but jam sandwiches and was healthy and definitely not fat. This is not a suggestion of a healthy diet but one where if you cut out fats from the diet you will not get fat.

Personally I agree with the post about potatoes being pointless, but only in the same way as sugar! however I like chips (occasionally) and I put sugar on my conrnflakes.

My biggest reason for changing my pup to raw is that I have looked at a dog food ingredients and as an omnivore I would not choose that diet, so why would I give it to a carnivore.

My diet contains nearly all protein, and my sugar comes from corns and milk. When I heavily train I use what is called the GOMAD diet. (Gallon of milk a day) which boost sugar and protein levels in the diet.

[magicre]

ok. i'll separate the sugar and the fat.

if one eats too much sugar and isn't heavily training, the sugar will not be utilised. if it is not utilised, it is then converted by a series of biochemical reactions and in the end....fat is fat in your body....

not only that, but the pancreas is NOT having a field day....when one eats foods that are high in sugar...and, whilst plums are more easily utilised by the body than a snickers bar or jam.....too much will add on pounds.

i'm not going to discuss the genetics of the 'i can eat anything' crowd and still fit into my prom dress crowd....they are few and far between...

i must have missed the part where fat turns to sugar in the body...because i don't recall learning that....:)

i will never come off my stance about milk....but, when you're heavily training, i do understand GOMAD. i've seen it done...sloppily, too, i might add...from the guys in my gym LOL...they would take a gallon of milk..and just start to chug...even to the point of having contests...we'd bet money on who would finish first with the least amount dribbling down their rippling bodies...

let's face it, though.....those who, as i said, are running a marathon of 26 miles and those who lay on the couch or walk a few miles a day have different nutrition needs...

as a matter of opinion, i feel that we as individuals need a variation on a theme, based on who we are, what we do....

but, no matter who we are and what we do....processed foods will cause eventual harm.

My biggest reason for changing my pup to raw is that I have looked at a dog food ingredients and as an omnivore I would not choose that diet, so why would I give it to a carnivore.

that is exactly what my thoughts were.

[eternalstudent]

i must have missed the part where fat turns to sugar in the body...because i don't recall learning that....:)

Not to nit pick but that is what I said fat is not turned to sugar just energy.
Also my understanding (which I admit is anything but perfect) is that sugar is stored only in the liver as glycogen not as fat.

I will go back and have a look

but yes; when I saw L-carnitine in the list of ingredients on my dog food I was like WTF, thats what they try and sell me for muscle growth as a supplement!!! and they warn me about over developing the muscles of my dog.

(I have to admit though I spread my gallon out during the day and mix a large proportion of it with coffee which might not be the original way they planned it but it works for me)

[magicre]

let's see if senility allows for this thinking...no worries..i'm one of 'those' people too..nitpick away...:)

carbs are burned first, then protein, then fat.

sugar ingestion, depending on the type of sugar affects the pancreas and overtaxes it when too much sugar is ingested and sugar of the harmful kind, like cookies and candy and an overdose of doughnuts on a lazy sunday...processed foods are filled with sugar...carbohydrates, in the body, are converted to sugar...that which is needed is converted into energy..that which isn't....is stored.

if carbs are not burned, they are converted to glycogen and then glucagon and then stored in the liver as fat.....that's my recollection....since it's been thirty years since i went to university...and i'm too lazy to look it up....i'll just throw it out there and you can tell me if that's your understanding too.

calories, whether they are in the form of carb (sugar), protein or fat....if not burned, are stored...the longer they are stored and not utilised, the wider the dog or the human...

regardless of the process LOL

if dog food weren't processed, then our dogs would get all the l-carnitine they need for heart health....from...wait for it...red meat LOL

the guys i worked out with were the type who would lift people as weights....they were probably on 'roids, although none would admit it....but they would have chugging contests with milk....and sweet potatoes....and turkey....very competitive..:)

[eternalstudent]

Ok more or less the same :-) glad you understand the nitpick - some do not and take offence and that is definitely not intended.

The body gets it energy from
Glucose then Glycogen then Fat then Protein
(except for the brain and red blood cells which can only use glucose in which case the body converts the protein into glucose. This process is energy intensive and if you are left with no fat recourses you will die before the available protein energy source is depleted)

Glucose in the blood trigers the release of insulin which stores the glucose as glycogen in the liver. Glucagon is the hormone which then converts glycogen back into glucose during times of fasting. The liver has a finite amount of glycogen storage space so in the case of sugar overload the body produces more and more insulin which leads to the strain on the pancreas and eventually to type 2 diabetes.

The other effect insulin has on the body is to promote storage of fats in the adipose tissue which is found throughout the body (but in my case mostly round the belly!!). As the body does not need any of this energy source when the glucose level is high it is all stored.

Technically this would mean we could live on a diet with out fat and just load on sugar and we would never get bear bellies and cellulite. However, we would die of diabetes so not a suggestion I would make LOL!!

Incidentally have you ever come across the term Rabbit Starvation. It was a problem on the prairies when the only food was rabbit. If you live on this you eventually starve as the fat content is not high enough for a human to convert the protein to glucose.

My understanding is that dogs have a far better way of carrying out this transformation so they do not get keto acidocis (and the sweat smelling breath) which humans are prone to.

Unfortunately most guys in gyms get so rapped up on the idea of must compete must get bigger at all costs that they loose the whole point of it. I have spent a long time trying to find a gym which has the right amount of equipment with out the meat head attitude!

Ps. Hope that was not too long a reply and was at least a reasonable read :-)).

[magicre]

ok. you're not as lazy as i am.....and spot on.

yeah, i've heard about rabbit starvation, although i know it as mal de caribou....potato, potahto :)

we kind of need that glucose in the blood..it's the excess we don't need that eventually makes women wear size 24 and men size 50....

be that as it may....again, stated less lazily...dogs are not built like humans....or we'd make them wear clothing

their entire digestive tract is so different than ours....

and i think....it simply wasn't enough that i studied the human body and human nutrition...because i made that cardinal rule mistake and that was to assume they had similar systems...

and...oops. they don't.


the guys at this gym i used to go to were on 'roids...so they kinda defeated the entire purpose...

and then the gym i went to after....the women were on something because they'd stop menstruating....and get all kinds of problems...

it was good reading. even though i can only speak for myself....:)